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Trudy B

Bannatynes Gym Contracts and CCA 1974????

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I have some questions concerning Bannatynes gym membership and their application forms and terms and conditions that I’d really appreciate any super legal eagles having a quick look at … pretty please!!

 

I have posted up both sides of the “membership agreement” the first side being the application and the second being the T & C

 

http://s655.photobucket.com/albums/uu271/trudyb004/Bannatynes/

 

On the bottom right of the application form it says “10% finance charge”. On the T & C point 5 b) it also says about the Finance Charge”

 

They don’t charge a finance charge if you pay it all up front but if you have a 12 month subscription they charge you a 10% finance charge – is that then giving you credit?

 

It has been confirmed to me that Bannatynes do indeed hold a Consumer Credit Licence.

 

Therefore my questions are :-

 

1) Is this “finance charge” legally classed as credit or are gym memberships and their finance charges exempt from the CCA 1974?

 

2) if the 10% finance charge is legally classed as credit should it or should it not be cover under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 and therefore should the application form and the T & C have all the prescribed terms etc etc or not????

 

3) can anyone see any unfair contract terms with all this and the T & C??

 

All replies appreciated!

 

Many thanks

 

T :)

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teeny bump :)

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Trudy, I am afraid I am unable to read the T&Cs. Is there anything on them that would indicate they are covered by a regulatory body ?.

 

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Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

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Hi Citizen B

 

A pleasure to hear from you ...... your little cat piccie is my all time absolute fav on the site and never fails to cheer me up and make me smile!

 

Well, this was the thing I was wondering.

 

Side 1, the application, states the finance charge of 10% etc but no regulator, no CCA 1974, no APR, no total interest, no final costs including interest, no nothing.

 

Same with side 2 …….. T & C mentions the 10% finance charge once only in point 5 b) and nothing else and nowhere else …… no regulator, no CCA, no APR, no total interest, no final costs including interest, nothing about defaults - nothing

 

 

This is what I am trying to establish – are gym memberships exempt or because they charge interest should adhere to the CCA 1974?

 

Why have they got a CCL if they are not meant to adhere to the CCA 1974?

 

If I can find this out then it could also be good for other people on the site because I have been reading all about how awfully they treat people when they want to cancel their memberships and how they hounded by debt collectors etc

 

T :)

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plus if i can establish that the contract is invalid and unfair then I can seriously push for money back!

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ooo... good question...

 

Is the money payable upfront? Is there something in the ts and cs that implies or states that a 'financial accommodation' has been made?

 

A finance charge makes me think that it is a credit agreement and should be regulated.

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Well, here’s the thing ;-

 

I asked him to write down the prices so I could go away and think about it

 

They wrote down £40pm or £45 per month for premier off peak

 

Then I was sold you get a 10% discount for paying up front annual

 

But the charge for annual was £486 so in fact that is equal to 12 x the monthly fee (12 x £45 = 540) less 10% £54 = £486

 

So it wasn’t a discount at all, they were knocking of the 10% finance charge and lying through their back teeth.

 

Or alternatively is it 12 x £45 = £540 (i.e. including a finance charge) less 10% (cos you get a 10% discount for paying up front annually) = £54 = £486

 

And in this scenarios you have been charged this “finance charge” when their contract says you don’t get a finance charge for up front annual subscription.

 

So either way to me it is a con and I think I have been deliberately mislead. Unfair contract terms????

 

If I was conned so have thousands of other people who ever paid annually.

 

The most it should have been was £45 less the finance charge of 10% = £40.50

 

£40.50 x 12 = £486 and THEN less the 10% discount for paying annually = £437.40

 

So basically that’s why I am trying to establish

 

1) should the contract (cos it one for both annual and monthly membership) be fully CCA 1974 complaint or are gyms completely exempt?

 

2) are there any legal eagle who can pull the contract apart and help me put up decent arguments with any regulatory and legal bits I should be quoting for unfair contract terms

 

If I am completely mad and barking up a number of wrong trees then fair do’s, no problem, I shall go back under my stone … if not then lots of people are owed money and especially those who have been hounded by the gym and debt collectors for unpaid monthly subscriptions etc

 

I have tried to do the contract on a PDF attached to see if that is any clearer for anyone to read?

 

T :)

T & C.pdf

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I don't believe it is a CCA matter - as they don'r let you 'buy money', they only offer a facility to defer their membership dues into a monthly payment plan, whilst charging for the service. You couldn't, however, get them to provide you with the money in a lump sum which you could pay back to them over 12 months (or possibly go on a short holiday). This WOULD require a formally regulated agreement.

 

My insurer works in the same way, with the Broker having a CCL, but the scheme only provides for the annual policy fee to be paid on the due date, with the customer paying an additional amount for the 'service'.

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s9 states that credit can be any kind of financial accommodation, though. Would this not count? Especially if there is some sort of clause that says the full amount of the contract price is due from the date of the agreement (I can't read the attachment)

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I've seen this argued before unsuccessfully - because the 'accommodation' is soley for the purposes of gym membership i(self provided by the operating company) as they can avoid the tighter regulation than if they generally provided finance for other purposes. I don't think this is a loophole, just providing an 'additional facility' for members as part of their 'benefits' package.

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Yes, I am looking having a look at some car insurance paperwork payable monthly

 

The car insurance is an annual premium and because it is paid monthly the insurance company charge interest. I am looking at the documents and it has the CCA 1974 info and paperwork.

 

The T & C on the gym documents says :-

 

“beginning when the member is accepted for membership all members shall pay either a single subscription for their 12 month membership or at the discretion of the proprietor 12 monthly subscriptions consisting of one twelfth of the annual membership fee plus a finance charge, information on which will be provided to the member on joining and at each renewal of membership”

 

So therefore why would an insurer charge you interest for having your annual premium payable monthly and have to comply with the CCA 1974 but a gym doing the same thing not?

 

T :)

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also any thoughts anyone about unfair contract terms on annual subscriptions whereby they are telling you it is one price and a 10% discount but in reality it is not?

 

T :)

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I'll defer to Buz.

 

I think it is an interesting and decent enough argument, but if it has been tried before and failed, then we'd need to have a look at those decisions in detail to see if they could be distinguished or whether there is any new/different law that applies.

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The issue of misleading statemnts is valid - but I'd think this would always be treated as a seperate issue and not be any part of the original agreement. If never seen a Bsnnstyne sgreement, but often you see conditions that state that staff are not empowered to change or modify the terms (only a director of the company), so they could esily argue that the staff member was in error/incompetent, and have a get-out.

 

For the motor insure schemes, I've come across 4 different types and hte ramifications are differfent in each.

 

(a) Intermediary provides the funds to pay the policy in full. Is noted as an interested party. Driver holds the policy, and pays the intermediary back in full with a service charge over 4 or 6 months. (CCA required)

(b) For an increased premium, insurer/broker allows the policy to be paid up monthly by DD. If a payment is missed, the policy is irrevocably cancedlled, with the insured having the short-term insurance recalculated and a final bill (or refund) calculated (no CCA)

© Pay per use. Minimum monthly charge agreed, with additional monthly usage figure based on distance covered. (no CCA)

(d) Insured souces full annual amount from an unconnected 3rd Party as a loan, and pays it in FULL to the insurer at the inception of cover. Then makes monthly payments with interest to the firm providing the money. (CCA required).

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Just thinking aloud here.. would this be like a kind of Hire purchase agreement then ?


Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

 

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

 

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

 

 

BCOBS

 

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

 

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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Nope. Only if it says so at the top of the agreement. :)

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