Bryan Carter/Phoenix taking me to court. Littlewoods?

[Bellisdaisy]

Hiya,

I have been reading with great interest all Bryan Carter threads, and have decided to request a copy of a CCA in order to defend my case. I have had the blue court letters in the last week and I am just hoping for a bit of assistance if anyone can help me?

I believe I do owe the money to littlewoods, but the court letter says that the claiment is 'Phoenix Recoveries' being represented by Bryan Carter etc. Under particulars of the claim they state:

the claimants claim is for the price of goods sold and delivered by the claiment to the defendent.

particulars

claimants a/c no.XXXXXXXX to goods sold between 2003 - 2008 and the claimant claims £xxxx.xx

the claimant also claims interest thereon pursuant to s.69 county court act 1984 limited to one year to the date hereof at the rate of 8% per annum amounting to £xxx.xx

I can't remember whether I signed anything for littlewoods as it was so long ago. I also never purchased anything after 2005. I have had no dealings with Phoenix who have obviously bought the debt.

I am sending my aknowledgment of service in tomorrow, and also a request to Bryan Carter for the CCA. Is this the right thing to do? What do you suppose I should do next in order to compile my defence? should I just wait until they have got back to me?

Thanks in advance of any answers.

Bellisdaisy

[Spamalot]

Hi and welcome to CAG

 

If I were you I would send a SAR to the original creditor to get as much information as possible. If you were completely unaware that Phoenix owned the debt then you have good reasons to dispute the claim with regards to ownership if nothing else...

 

You need to get the credit agreement, copies of statements, notices of assignments...everything!

 

Spam.

[Bellisdaisy]

Hiya,

Sorry to be dumb, but how do I do a Subject Access Request? Would that be to Littlewoods?

Thanks

[Spamalot]

Hiya,

Sorry to be dumb, but how do I do a Subject Access Request? Would that be to Littlewoods?

Thanks

 

Hi, you are not dumb! If littlewoods were the 'original creditor' then that is where you would send the SAR.. In the information you get from the response there should be information as to who they sold the debt to...

 

It gets very complicated with Notices of assignments etc.

 

Have you had any default notices with regards to the account?

 

When was the last time you paid anything and who to?

 

Spam.

[Bellisdaisy]

Thanks for your help

I am afraid I have no idea what has been acknowledged or paid or what as my husband and I have approx 10 different creditors and we have lost track of all of the different debt collecting agencies - particularly as each one seems to use about three different names. What would a default notice look like?

Bellisdaisy

[havinastella]

Hi Bell,

 

You need to get a CRP request off to Bryan Carter ASAP.

 

I would also send the CCA request with £1, do not sign it.

 

Does the claim say part off?

 

Jogs

[Spamalot]

A default notice is normally sent by a creditor and it states that you have fallen behind with payments and demands that you pay the arrears by a certain date.. It has to be done in a special format..

 

I have to go away from pc for short time... if someone else doesn't step in to help a bit more I'll be back in half hour..

 

Spam.

[Bellisdaisy]

Think I have found a copy of a CRP template on another thread (CPR 31.14 request - is that right?) Do I send that and the CCA request to Bryan Carter?

Unfortunately it is not a part claim - he wants the lot

Thanks

[Bellisdaisy]

Thanks Spam.

If I ever did have one of those I don't believe I will still have it. I tended to bury my head in the sand and hide for a couple of years and just threw a lot of letters away........

[havinastella]

Bell, you really don't have to worry.

 

As soon as you defend, BC folds like a pack of cards.

 

Yes, send the CPR and CCA to BC.

 

JOgs

[Bellisdaisy]

I am filling in my template letter, which part of the following should I DELETE. From what I can gather I only need to keep the first part in as they haven't mentioned anything in the particulars of claim.

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of the documents mentioned in your Particulars of Claim:

 

1 the agreement. You will appreciate that in an ordinary case and by reason of the provisions of CPR PD 16 para 7.3, where a claim is based upon a written agreement, a copy of the contract or documents constituting the agreement should be attached to or served with the particulars of claim and the original(s) should be available at the hearing. Further, that any general conditions incorporated in the contract should also be attached.

 

2 the assignment*

 

3 the default notice*

 

4 the termination notice*

 

5 [any other documents mentioned in the Particulars of Claim]*

 

* delete if not mentioned in the Particulars of claim.

 

Thanks again for everyones help

[creditcardmug]

Hiya,

I have been reading with great interest all Bryan Carter threads, and have decided to request a copy of a CCA in order to defend my case. I have had the blue court letters in the last week and I am just hoping for a bit of assistance if anyone can help me?

I believe I do owe the money to littlewoods, but the court letter says that the claiment is 'Phoenix Recoveries' being represented by Bryan Carter etc. Under particulars of the claim they state:

the claimants claim is for the price of goods sold and delivered by the claiment to the defendent.

particulars

claimants a/c no.XXXXXXXX to goods sold between 2003 - 2008 and the claimant claims £xxxx.xx

the claimant also claims interest thereon pursuant to s.69 county court act 1984 limited to one year to the date hereof at the rate of 8% per annum amounting to £xxx.xx

I can't remember whether I signed anything for littlewoods as it was so long ago. I also never purchased anything after 2005. I have had no dealings with Phoenix who have obviously bought the debt.

I am sending my aknowledgment of service in tomorrow, and also a request to Bryan Carter for the CCA. Is this the right thing to do? What do you suppose I should do next in order to compile my defence? should I just wait until they have got back to me?

Thanks in advance of any answers.

Bellisdaisy

 

Hi, and welcome, don't worry, you have come to the right place,

 

First you need to acknowledge service of the claim, (dont file any defence yet), you only have 14 days to do this, This gives you a total of 33 days from the date on the claim form to file your defence. (what date is on the claim form)?

Then send a CPR request to carter, will post it up for you.

 

Are the Particulars of Claim above, exactly as it says? (they are not entitled to the s69 interest by the way).

 

Have you already sent the CCA request? did you sign the letter?

Was it issued in the northampton court?

Who is the claimant, as on the front of the claim form?

 

We will help you with the defence when the time comes

 

 

In the Northampton County Court

xxxxxxxxxxx -v- xxxxxxxxxxxx

Claim Number: xxxxxxxxxxxx

 

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

REQUEST FOR INFORMATION

 

I have received a recent court claim from your organisation. In order to file a defence and counter claim I require some information. Given that this matter is now the subject of legal proceedings, you are obliged to disclose under the Civil Procedure Rules, the information and documents detailed below.

 

The information must be furnished within fourteen days of the receipt of this letter. If you fail to comply, this will be reported to the Court, a copy of this letter will be provided as evidence to the same and an Order enforcing your compliance will be sought.

 

1. A true copy of the executed credit agreement and any terms and conditions that applied to the account at the time of default and at the time the account was opened. True copies of any notice of assignment and/or default notice or enforcement notice that you or the original creditor sent me, with a copy of any proof of postage that you hold.

 

 

1.1 If copies of any of the above documents are to be relied on in court rather than originals, a copy of the Notice of proposal to adduce hearsay evidence required under s2(1) of the Civil Evidence Act 1995 together with proof of the authenticity of the document(s) as required under s8(1)(b) of the Act, including but not limited to:

 

(a) a copy of the procedure(s) used for copying, storing and retrieving documents

(b) a copy of the relevant log entry showing the time and date of the scan or copy, the name of the member of staff making the copy, the method used for copying, storage and retrieval and time and date of destruction of the original document(s)

© copies of internal and external audit reports covering the entire period from the date of the copy to the present to demonstrate that the procedures have been complied with

(d) copies of Quality Assurance accreditation certificates covering the entire period from the date of the copy to the present to demonstrate that the procedure(s) and audit process(es) comply with the appropriate quality standards

 

2. All records you hold on me relevant to this case, including but not limited to:

 

a. Transcriptions of all telephone conversations recorded and any notes made in relation to telephone conversations by your company, or by any previous creditor

b. Where there has been any event in my account history over this period which has required manual intervention by any person, I require disclosure of any indication or notes which have either caused or resulted in that manual intervention, or other evidence of that manual intervention in relation to my account formerly held with Barclaycard.

c. .Documents relating to any insurance added to the account, including the insurance contract and terms and conditions, date it was added and deleted (if applicable).

d. Details of any collection charge added to the account; specifically, the date it was levied, the amount of the charge, a detailed financial breakdown of how the charge was calculated, and what the charge covers.

e. Specific details of the fees/charges levied by any other agency in respect of this account and a detailed breakdown of said fees/charges and what each charge relates to and on what date said fees/charges were levied.

f. A genuine copy of any notice of fair use of my data as required by the Data Protection Act 1998

g. A list of third party agencies to whom you have disclosed my personal data and a summary of the nature of the information you have disclosed.

h. Copies of statements for the entire duration of the credit agreement.

 

 

3. Any other documents you seek to rely on in court.

 

 

I will require this information within the next fourteen days. I must advise you that if the information is not forthcoming, it will be reported to the Court that you are trying to frustrate proceedings and denying me the opportunity to file a defence and counter claim.

 

Yours sincerely,

 

[Spamalot]

Hi Bell,

 

You need to get a CRP request off to Bryan Carter ASAP.

 

I would also send the CCA request with £1, do not sign it.

 

Does the claim say part off?

 

Jogs

 

My mistake been jumping from forum to forum today forgot I was in legal... thanks for pointing that out..

 

Bellisdaisy.. just to let you know, Phoenix recoveries are notorious for buying up unenforceable debts just on the off chance they can bully people into paying.. you really are in the right place here.

 

Good luck

 

Spam.

[Spamalot]

I am filling in my template letter, which part of the following should I DELETE. From what I can gather I only need to keep the first part in as they haven't mentioned anything in the particulars of claim.

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of the documents mentioned in your Particulars of Claim:

1 the agreement. You will appreciate that in an ordinary case and by reason of the provisions of CPR PD 16 para 7.3, where a claim is based upon a written agreement, a copy of the contract or documents constituting the agreement should be attached to or served with the particulars of claim and the original(s) should be available at the hearing. Further, that any general conditions incorporated in the contract should also be attached.

2 the assignment*

3 the default notice*

4 the termination notice*

5 [any other documents mentioned in the Particulars of Claim]*

* delete if not mentioned in the Particulars of claim.

 

 

Thanks again for everyones help

 

That's a good question...

 

In order to prove that Phoenix 'own the debt' you would need a notice of assignment otherwise anyone could take out a claim against you and say you owe them money....

 

You should have received a default notice prior to them terminating the agreement but if the notice isn't mentioned maybe they didn't send one..

 

 

I will scout round and see what I can find out.

 

Spam.

[Bellisdaisy]

Hiya again,

Wow, I am overwhelemed at all of this support! I wish I had come here years ago!

I have copied and pasted that letter and will send it first class, recorded delivery tomorrow. The date on the court letter is 12th June. I am going to file the acknowledgement online now stating I intend to defend the claim.

The CCA request has not gone yet - I was planning to do that tomorrow. Who should I send that to?

The claimant on the court letter is Phoenix Recoveries. There is no mention of littlewoods. I only know that it is for littlewoods as I recognise my account number.

The particulars of the claim are eactly as I typed, except they quoted actual dates and I have just put the year on here. Other than that, it is exact.

The court is Northampton.

Thanks

[Spamalot]

If you haven't seen this already it might be worth a read.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/108467-basic-introduction-consumer-credit.html#post1048125

[NailPost]

Sending the court th acknowledgement of service and informing Craters you intend to defend the claim is usually enough to get this slimy bunch to withdraw. Make sure that when they do you get notification in writing and apply for your costs.

[creditcardmug]

Hiya again,

Wow, I am overwhelemed at all of this support! I wish I had come here years ago!

I have copied and pasted that letter and will send it first class, recorded delivery tomorrow. The date on the court letter is 12th June. I am going to file the acknowledgement online now stating I intend to defend the claim.

The CCA request has not gone yet - I was planning to do that tomorrow. Who should I send that to?

The claimant on the court letter is Phoenix Recoveries. There is no mention of littlewoods. I only know that it is for littlewoods as I recognise my account number.

The particulars of the claim are eactly as I typed, except they quoted actual dates and I have just put the year on here. Other than that, it is exact.

The court is Northampton.

Thanks

 

If you still want to send the CCA request, it should go to whoever is demanding money from you, i.e. carter/pheonix, however, its not really worth bothering now.

 

As the case progresses you will put them to strict proof that a deed of assignment exists between littlewoods and pheonix, and that a notice of assignment was served on you, and proof of service...without this they have no legal cause for action against you, regardless of anything else they may or may not have.

 

Post up any reply to your request for info,(but dont hold breath)

 

Your defence must be filed by 15th july at the latest, providing you acknowledge service

[Bellisdaisy]

What should I do if they don't get back in touch with me in time to put together my defence - ie 15th July?

[creditcardmug]

What should I do if they don't get back in touch with me in time to put together my defence - ie 15th July?

 

No problem, we use an "embarrassed defence"

[Bellisdaisy]

Right! I will come back if that happens then!! In the meantime, I have submitted the acknowlegement online stating I intend to defend, and have printed off the CCA request and the request for information letter, which I will post tomorrow. Am I done then until they contact me, or until the 2nd week of July if they don't? Is there anything else I should do now?

[creditcardmug]

No, just spend the time reading up all you can on here, to gain a better understanding of how these things work, and of the dubious tactics of friend carter in particular:D

[Bellisdaisy]

Brilliant!

Thanks very much for your advice everyone . The links have all been very useful too. Thank you.

Bellisdaisy

x

[Spamalot]

No, just spend the time reading up all you can on here, to gain a better understanding of how these things work, and of the dubious tactics of friend carter in particular:D

 

 

Not forgetting Phoenix recoveries too!!! :eek:

[Bellisdaisy]

Hiya again,

I sent off the request for information and request for a CCA. I have now had a letter from Bryan Carter and Co saying the following:

'We have issued proceedings against you for recovery of this debt but you have failed to respond with either reasons as to why the debt is disputed or with proposals for payment.

Unless we hear from you we will take steps to enter Judgement against you.

If you subsequently fail to pay the Judgement withinn a prescribed time period, it will be entered on your credit file and may seriously affect your ability to obtain credit in the future.

Once we have obtained Judgement we will seek to enforce the Judgement by either instructing bailiffs to take possession of your property or by applying for an attachment of earnings, or we may ask the court to make an order to secure the debt by obtaining a charge over your home'

The letter was dated 23rd June so they would not have received the requests at that point, but they are obviously responding to my court statement saying I am planning to defend. Are they allowed to send me letters like this? I have until sometime in July to submit my defence so they are technicaly harrassing me surely?

My husband is starting to feel a bit threatened by it but after reading statements on here I feel they are just clutching at straws and trying to frighten us.

What do you think?

Thanks in advance.