FirstPlus/Red Castle/Resolution Legal Services - Court Case seems likely.

[GhostDebt]

We recently sold our house - Dec 2007 (which was in negative equity) and first plus had to accept a shortfall on their account.

 

During 2008, we made some payments through a DMP with the CCCS but due to continuing financial problems did not maintain the DMP very well.

 

No payments have been made to First Plus since about October 2008 and we have not heard a single thing from them!

 

I am a little confused as to why not, because reading some of the other threads here, they appear to get Red Castle involved at the earliest opportunity and pursue payment quite hard.

 

Do I rock the boat, by writing to them with a Subject Access Request or do I play ignorant and do nothing.

Maybe the account has been written off? (Doubtful) but if I contact them will they suddenly start chasing?

 

Any comments or ideas would be greatly received.

 

Many thanks.

[supasnooper]

Firstly, speak to CCCS and review your Income & Expenditure on the DMP if it is still running. You can do this when ever your bills go up or down.

 

Your choice as to what First Plus may do but the odds are they will come after you.

 

You can either face them head on and request a Consumer Credit Agreement and go from there.

If your DMP is still active, pay them a token amount from that and divert any aggressive collections tactics by them to CCCS.

[loobyloo85]

As supasnooper said, I would also check if your DMP is still active. If it is and you wish to continue with it, it would be better to include all of your debts within this arrangement to clear them altogether, therefore you will need to know exactly how much is outstanding to First Plus. I would send them a CCA to see what you are liable for. If the account then gets passed onto DCAs, CCCS can deal with them on your behalf.

I think the best way is to tackle it head on...it is tempting to ignore them if they havent contacted you, but if you do contact them now, you can sort your finances out once and for all, and know where you stand with your finances.

[GhostDebt]

We are looking to face them head on but are currently trying to compile information to allow us to do this in the correct manner. Will keep you posted.

Many thanks.

[GhostDebt]

The following will alo be sent to RedCastle who have contacted me recently regarding the alleged accout.

 

Collections Department

Red Castle Recoveries

PO Box 4503

Worthing

BN11 1XP

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Your reference: *

Client reference: *

I write with regards to the above alleged account.

I have reason to believe that there may be discrepancies within the above alleged account and have requested further clarification of these matters direct from First Plus Financial Group Plc.

Until such time as these discrepancies have been rectified I respectfully request that you place the account on hold within your organisation and cease any further collection activities.

Please be advised that I will only communicate with you in writing and that any telephone calls from your company may be recorded.

Furthermore, should it be your intention to arrange a “doorstep call”, please be advised that under OFT rules, you can only visit me at my home if you make an appointment and I have no wish to make an appointment with you.

There is only an implied license under English Common Law for people to be able to visit me on my property without express permission; the postman and people asking for directions etc (Armstrong v. Sheppard and Short Ltd [1959] 2 Q.B. per Lord Evershed M.R.). Therefore take note that I revoke license under Common Law for you, or your representatives to visit me at my property and if you do so, then you will be liable to damages for a tort of trespass and action will be taken, including but not limited to, police attendance.

 

I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter.

I look forward to your response, in writing only.

 

Yours faithfully,

---------------

 

Again, any comments before I send this would be greatly appreciated.

 

Many thanks.

 

p.s Would it be possible for a Site Team member to move this thread to the First Plus area of the forum.

 

Best regards.

[GhostDebt]

Hello CAGgers.

 

Having sent firstplus a SAR recently they have replied with quite an interesting bundle of documents.

 

Firstly I would like to post up some of the main points which I have queries with and would like some help regarding them please.

 

1.

The covering letter sent states, "unfortunately due to the manner in which sound data is held we are unable to locate your request for the recording without detailed information as to the employee date and time you believe the information was captured. This is in accordance with the requirements set out in secction 7(3) of the dpa which sets a requirement to provide additional location information" and "Please note that the business being able to supply any data will depend on whether you are able to provide information to allow us to locate the information required.

 

--- Is this correct?

 

2.

The screen dumps state that the loan is CCA regulated as does the alleged agreement which states "The legal charge will only secure monies due under an agreement regulated by the CCA 1974 if the agreement states that it is to be secured by the legal charge"

 

--- Since the value of the agreement exceeds the 25k limit of the CCA in what way is the agreement regulated by the CCA 1974?

 

3.

Following sale of the property, this is now a shortfall debt and subsequently is unsecured which is also evidenced by the screen dumps.

 

--- Does this change it being regulated by the CCA 1974 at all?

 

4.

I am of the opinion that this agreement constitutes irresponsible lending as the screen dumps state that they have accepted being 3rd charge on the property at the time and also that they have exceeded there LTV threshold significantly.

 

--- Where do we stand if it is irresponsible lending?

 

5.

The address details of my employer are incorrect and don't match the details they were given.

 

---Does this make any difference?

 

6.

PPI - not told only five years

 

--- Could somebody advise how we start going about reclaiming and offer some sample letters?

 

7.

Statements for 2009 have not been provided.

No copies of correspondence to red castle have been provided, although some other third party correspondence has been provided which includes details of an attempt to apply a charging order on the property after a CCJ from Natwest (pre CAG) after Firstplus had removed their charge 'cos the house had been sold. Is this DPA breach?

No details of the PPI has been provided.

 

Many thanks for any help and comments you can provide

 

Best regards.

[GhostDebt]

Bump,

 

Any help or comments will be greatly appreciated

 

GD

[IdaInFife]

hiya,

 

what year was the loan taken out?

 

ida x

[GhostDebt]

Hi Ida,

 

It was approx october 2004.

[GhostDebt]

Bump,

 

Any Help or comments will be greatly appreciated

 

GD

[Pinky69]

1) They do not have the recording. That is why it is important that everything is in writing so you have proof of all transactions. They can easily deny anything that was said over the phone unless you have recorded it yourself.

 

2) A loan over £25k was not covered by the CCA 1974 in 2004 terms of the original agreement. For an unsecured shortfall to be covered by the CCA 1974 they would have to have drawn up a new agreement

 

4) Irresponsible lending would be a point to make if there was a court case about the loan

 

5) The SAR should give details of what you gave them as your emplyers details so you can check if they are correct

 

6) You can send a letter claiming you were not told the PPI would only last for 5 years and if it was included in the loan amount you can add to your claim that you were not told that you would be paying the insurance over the whole period of the loan. They will deny mis-selling and you will probably have to take it to the Financial Ombudsman Service for abitration - takes over 1 year for an FOS response.

 

7) Copies of aLL statements, correspondence with 3rd parties and loan and PPI details should be sent as part of the SAR. If they haven't sent everything they have they are in breach of the DCA.

[GhostDebt]

Hello Pinky. Thank you for your reply.

 

I think I should consider the following:

 

1. Write to Firstplus with the date and time details indicated on the manual intervention print offs which would show when the calls were made approximately and see if they can locate the recordings. If they don't provide them it will add to a complaint to the ICO.

2. Write to Firstplus asking them to clarify or explain how it is regulated by the CCA 1974, as although it is outside the scope of the CCA 1974 they do state it is regulated and certain parts of the CCA 1974 could come in handy for us should the need arise.

3. No new loan was drawn up or signed.

4. Point noted. Would like to have an opportunity to approach them about this without having to go to court over it though. Maybe the OFT?

5. The details given on the application as employers details do not match what they have on the screen dump data as application info. (in terms of addresses. the employer is right but not the address)

6. Looking into it.

7. Write to Firstplus asking them to provide the information which we think is missing. Interest rate change letters, letters to other third parties. etc.

 

What do you think the likelihood of them replying would be?.

Think its in our best interest to write to them, 'cos if they don't respond it only goes to show them as being uncooperative...

 

Many thanks

 

Regards

[Pinky69]

Yes, I would write to them and state what is missing. The OFT don't deal with individual complaints. What they do is note a complaint against a creditor on the creditor's file and use the info if need be if there is a case against renewing a consumer credit licence. First Plus are unlikely to come up with the recording.

[GhostDebt]

Thanks for the reply Pinky.

[GhostDebt]

Quick update.

 

I have sent a letter to FP, saying what I believe is missing including a list of dates and times shown on their manual intervention records of when calls were made in an attempt to get the recordings/transcripts.

 

Also asked them to clarify to what extent they claim it is regulated.

 

Will wait and see what response we get and keep you updated.

 

Regards.

[GhostDebt]

In response to my follow up letter, they have sent it back asking for a signature... doh!

I am planning to resend the follow up letter but with the following tagged on the bottom.

**

I would also like to draw you attention to the Data Protection Good Practice Note: Checklist for handling requests for personal information (subject access requests) issued by the Information Commissioner’s Office. Section 2 states Do you have enough information to be sure of the requester’s identity? Often you will have no reason to doubt a person’s identity. For example, if a person with whom you have regular contact sends a letter from their known address it may be safe to assume they are who they say they are.

Please note, that the above address is the one which you normally use to communicate my private business to me and which you have hitherto found to be acceptable. You have also provided personal documentation regarding this matter to the above address in your response dated *. If it is only now, that you consider it appropriate to validate my identity you would be minded to consider the above and your culpability for breaching the Data Protection Act by providing personal information previously if you were unsure of my identity.

I look forward to hearing from you in the first instance of receipt.

Yours faithfully,

**

 

Any comments on this?

Is it best to just sign it and send it back, or should they comply based on this. (Don't agree with signing it for obvious reasons...

 

Regards

[GhostDebt]

Letter with alterations as detailed in post #11 sent today.

[GhostDebt]

FP have replied again asking for a signature again, how can i get them

to comply without it? or can we use a modified signature or some other way to get them to comply?

 

Comments appreciated.

 

Best regards

[IdaInFife]

you could use a digital signature

 

Online Personal Signature Maker - MyLiveSignature - Free Personal Signature Generator

 

ida x

[GhostDebt]

Sent a follow up letter, will see what response we get

 

Regards

[GhostDebt]

Evening everyone,

We are currently awaiting a complete response from Firstplus to our SAR request.

They have replied with some info, but some things are missing and now they want a signature...

Anyway, today we received the following letter from Resolution Legal Services:

 

Notice of potential court action.

Dear..

Our ref...

 

We have now been authorised by Red Castle Recoveries on behalf of firstplus to undertake a final review of your case with the view of passing it to our solicitors for immediate action.

My recommendations may include one of the following actions:

Attachment of earnings order - money to be deducted from your salary on a monthly basis via your employer.

Warrant of execution - the county court will appoint a bailiff to seize goods to the value of your debt.

Raise and issue a statutory demand. - this would be served on you by the county court. Upon expiry of this statutory demand, if you fail to comply with its terms our client may then seek to issue bankruptcy proceedings against you.

 

May I remind you any of the above actions would incur further costs to your account and could have a major effect on your credit rating and future applications for a credit facility.

 

In a final attempt to prevent action and help you resolve this you must call me immediately on 0844 ... and agree a suitable repayment option.

 

----------------

 

Now, as I understand it. For a warrant of execution and/or attachment of earnings order they first have to get a ccj, so they are overstating their position a little.

Also, are 0844 premium rate numbers?. 'cos thats against the OFT guidelines I believe.

 

The main reason for the SAR is about the PPI mis-selling, so that would feature in any counterclaim should they issue court proceedings and there are unfair charges on the account.

 

So my question is,

What would be a suitable response letter?

I think something including the, 'no calls', 'no visits' and OFT guideline breach and maybe a CPR letter for the documents we haven't yet received from them.

 

Any comments?

 

Many thanks.

 

Best regards

 

Also please see the following associated links:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/201063-help-required-sar-response.html

and

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/182456-first-plus-loan-help.html

[mr.ton]

They are in no position to dictate what will happen & when etc...

Thats between you & the county court should it ever get to there, which i doubt & even so, you would have so many legal rights/options etc...

In the meantime, report these clowns to the OFT & trading standards.

[the_shadow]

You seem to have the right replies all lined up

 

As they have mentioned court proceedings, you can hit them with a CPR 31.16 requesting the agreement and any other documents that you can specifically request.

 

One other possible breach is claiming the stat demand would be served by county court... the stat demand is a method by which anyone can fill out and serve on people, it has no connection with the courts except for the defendants nearest insolvency court to be named on the form. If they mean they intend to get a process server to deliver the document thats different from the courts sending you a stat demand. (this is how I understand it anyway)

 

S.

[Bazooka Boo]

Hmm 'Red castle' another subsidary to 'Gothia' I see!

As for premium rate numbers these all start with 09, but I do agree with you that even the 0870, and 0845 numbers are bloody expensive and should be avoided.

Although if your with BT, and depending on which tariff your on, in the evenings and at weekends calls to these numbers are free, which allows me to carry out my new hobby of DCA baiting!

[Bazooka Boo]

In a final attempt to prevent action and help you resolve this you must call me immediately on 0844 ... and agree a suitable repayment option.

 

I'd ring them just to thank them for being so charitable:lol:

'Why thank you so much for giving me the opportunity to resolve this, I did try to ring you "immediately" but you were closed:( my suitable payment option to you is a Full & Final payment by card:) I trust you do take cards don't you:confused: Good, this one is my birthday card, it says Dear....'