court letters,Nationwide cc,court costs, ** WON **

[the_shadow]

If this is accurate, it is sometimes code for 'sort it out between you or I'll make a decision that neither of you will like'.

 

Yep concur with that and obviously why Eversheds are making the first move... what ever happens that 2nd letter has to be answered imho.

 

S.

[Kraken1]

having re-read some of the thread, I suspect SS might get judgement against him, probably not a forthwith (I'd hedge a bet at £20 per month) and that Shoos will have to whistle for costs.

 

Result: everyone loses. Save for Shoos who'll still get paid.

 

This might mean that they are more willing to accept the initial offer. Depends on how ****ed they are. Sometimes for objective and detached businesses and lawyers they get awfully emotive about some stuff.

[diddydicky]

You say that they rely on a sample DN and their computer print outs to confirm that a DN was sent- so you should be asking for evidence from the person that made the computer print it- proof that it was posted etc,

 

If their comms logs do not mention the second DN which you say was sent in January (you need to post that up for us to look at) then this DN - even if it is valid, woould be useful evidence to show that their computer system evidence was unreliable -if this is to be regarded as reliable evidence that a DN was issued- then why did this computer not show the issue of this second DN?

[diddydicky]

this is one from surfaceagent on another thread that might prove useful to you in court

 

Take a situation where the Claimant produces a witness to deal with questions concerning say the default notice and who simply produces a screen print supposing it has to do with the default notice they say was delivered to the debtor but can't produce. I've seen screen prints which are essentially a database recording precious little information which is readliy understood by 'an outsider'. The screenshot might record 'date sent' followed by a date and that's about it.

 

Your purpose in cross-examination would be to demonstrate the witness and the screenshot are inadequate for proving the essentials required for showing what the paper DN looked like, said on it, when service occured and the manner of it. A milion questions could be put to dettach the witness from the database record and the DN the database is supposed to be able to re-construct.

 

I've seen witness statements made by solicitors professing to be able to verify the re-construction of a DN who make no mention of the source of their information or the steps taken by them to verify the truth of that information. Such a witness is hopeless.

 

I've even had one witness deal with a DN who it was eventually established, was still at school when the DN was supposedly delivered! The time had arrived to say 'No more questions' and sit down! Need I say more?

[ssshooter]

You say that they rely on a sample DN and their computer print outs to confirm that a DN was sent- so you should be asking for evidence from the person that made the computer print it- proof that it was posted etc,

 

If their comms logs do not mention the second DN which you say was sent in January (you need to post that up for us to look at) then this DN - even if it is valid, woould be useful evidence to show that their computer system evidence was unreliable -if this is to be regarded as reliable evidence that a DN was issued- then why did this computer not show the issue of this second DN?

 

Thanks for that,will post up the default notices first thingtomorrow morning.

[AA99]

still subbing, with interest

[ssshooter]

Here are the so called default notices:

1.zip

2.zip

2 001.zip

[AA99]

shooter, those are only statutory default charges notices. That was a new law that only came in a year ago I think. Instead of just whacking a £12 default charge on your account, the new law says they have to write and tell you that also! After 28 days, they can charge interest on that default charge.

 

These are not the same as a Default Notice informing you that you have specified days to pay back specified sum of arrears owing on your account.

 

Think I've got that right:wink:

[AA99]

Ref CitB's post #112

[ssshooter]

Yep concur with that and obviously why Eversheds are making the first move... what ever happens that 2nd letter has to be answered imho.

 

S.

 

I have sent a letter back to Eversheds stating that i do not wish to negotiate a settlement with them, as i know i have a very good chance of defending thier claim agaist me due to thier several non compliances of the consumer credit act 1974 (the points of which i shall be pointing out in my defence).

 

I've also pointed out that myself & the consumer credit counselling services spent 8 months negotiating with them before they put in their claim against me.(of which they refused £18.50 per month,they wanted £25).

I've also sent a copy of the letter to the Courts & will be putting my defence in next week.

[citizenB]

I have sent a letter back to Eversheds stating that i do not wish to negotiate a settlement with them, as i know i have a very good chance of defending thier claim agaist me due to thier several non compliances of the consumer credit act 1974 (the points of which i shall be pointing out in my defence).

 

I've also pointed out that myself & the consumer credit counselling services spent 8 months negotiating with them before they put in their claim against me.(of which they refused £18.50 per month,they wanted £25).

I've also sent a copy of the letter to the Courts & will be putting my defence in next week.

 

That seems fair enough. At least you can prove that prior to this claim, you did make attempts to negotiate an amicable agreement to repay.

[ssshooter]

Thinking of sending this letter to the courts,with the relevant letters i sent/they sent along with my defence.

 

Any opinions??

 

I enclose my amended defence for the Courts attention.I would also like to bring to the Courts attention my reasons for declining the Courts offer of mediation services,the reasons are:-

 

On numerous occasions Consumer Credit Counselling Services & myself have tried to negotiate with Nationwide by letter & also by telephone,a reasonable monthly payment in order to eventually clear my debt & also to avoid Court proceedings against myself.

However,all of my reasonable offers where declined by Nationwide,I enclose copies of the letters that I sent to Nationwide in order of reaching an agreement of payment with them ,& also there replies,which shows their reluctance to help me.(Marked as A1,A2,A3,A4,A5).

I would be grateful under the circumstances if the Courts would consider that I have done everything within my powers to reach an amicable solution to arranging monthly payments to Nationwide & that my offers where declined.

I therefore ask the Courts to take this matter into consideration should Nationwide try to pass any Court charges to myself with regards to this case.

 

I therefore believe,that I have done everything within my powers to reach an agreement with Nationwide, & due to their reluctance to help me in the past I see no point in negotiating through mediation services now,if they could not of accepted my offer then, I see no reason that they would accept it now,if they had then this case would not of come to Court in the first place.(save to costs).

 

I have also recently received letters of Court action regarding my overdrafts on 2 current accounts that I also have with Nationwide,again I have tried to come to an arrangement with them proposing a reasonable offer,both of which have been declined.It is only up until recently that I have found myself out of work for the first time in my life,& I thought I was doing the decent thing informing my creditors of my current situation,asking for a little help & understanding ,until I am back in employment.

No doubt these 2 cases will also come to Court,& I see no reason as to why all 3 cases couldn’t have been done at the same time (save to cost).

 

I also believe that I have a very good chance of defending Nationwides claims against me,the reasons for which are listed in my defence.

[citizenB]

SS, the current account / overdrafts, do they contain penalty charges ?. If so that is probably whey they didnt lump them all together because you may well have been able to get a stay due to the OFT case.

[ssshooter]

Yes they did have penalty charges on them,what your saying seems about right for Nationwide.

[Winged Piglet]

You need to get a copy of the Default Notice from Nationwide that they are relying on to take this action in the first place. It is widely known and experienced by myself twice that Nationwide Default Notices do NOT comply with the regs. They never give the 'not less than 14 days' and they are not set out correctly ie the prsecribed text which must appear on all DN's is always in bold capitals only and not given the preference by underlining and the rest of the text unbolded. On both issued to me, they asked for the whole amount and not just the breach ie arrears. A small but very vaild point. I have just had a registered DN removed by N/wide because of this when I pointed it out to them and then because of that, have asked for the other to be removed as it is the same department, they can hardly deny that the other with the same faults is valid. Why they continue to send out incorrect notices shows you the level of competence that their legal teams have. If they have then terminated your account and the DN is faulty, then it is an unlawful recission of contract and you are only obliged to pay the sum owing ie arears at he time the DN was issued.

 

Good Luck!

[diddydicky]

they asked for the whole amount and not just the breach ie arrears. A small but very vaild point.

 

 

cant agree with your assesment of this being a "small but very valid point"

 

 

it is THE MAJOR failing of the DN (even more than the time allowed) and extremely valid point - since this demand constitutes and unlawful rescission of the agreement

 

In effect the DN becomes a TN

 

a creditor cannot TN without first issuing a valid DN

 

as for getting a copy - well you wont because they dont keep copies of the Dn's they send

[Winged Piglet]

diddydicky,

 

yes you are quite right. I actually meant the capital lettering and bolding etc rather than this - was just the way it was written.

 

I was pointing out that in my experiene the fools at Nationwide keep issuing these faulty DN's as standard (so the same mistakes are there on DN's from 2 different accounts) and as there are several mistakes including often asking for the whole amount on them then it gives even more weight to this argument and would be very hard for a judge in a court to ignore. I totally agree with you!

 

Also if they have issued a dodgy DN and it included asking for the whole amount it does then serve as a Termination Notice if they haven't formally terminated, which means they could not then issue a compliant one!

[diddydicky]

arent they wonderful? long live nationwide!!

[ssshooter]

thanks,had a good laugh over this.managed to get my defence in on time,,,just.its 27 pages long so that should keep them busy for a while,i'll let you know what sort of a response i get.

[diddydicky]

thanks,had a good laugh over this.managed to get my defence in on time,,,just.its 27 pages long so that should keep them busy for a while,i'll let you know what sort of a response i get.

 

when you get a minute post your defence up (or pm it to me if you like)- always pays to make notes well in advance for your arguments in court

 

good luck

[ssshooter]

Phoned up the court on Monday,Nationwide have not filed thier paperwork, which was supposed to be in by 4pm.Have now sent a letter on Tuesday asking for the case to be thrown out.

[pecky1]

Good luck keep us posted

Pecky1

[freethemice]

Nationwide were around 4 weeks late filing thier defence in my case. Court didn't seem intrested at all. They do get alot of room for manourver.

If this mirrors my case this will now be with the solicitors at cardiff who will be in contact with you about the case.

I have a telephone conference with them on Tuesday and they do seem very willing to negotiate a solution.

Good luck and keep us posted.

[diddydicky]

any news??

[ssshooter]

I Have This Morning Recieved A Reply From The Court, Regarding My Request For The Claim To Be Thrown Out Due To Nationwide Not Filing Thier Paperwork With The Court By The Date Given (which Was 7th Dec).

The Reply Basically Says 'no Further Order Needed The Matter Shall Remain Listed As A Small Claims Trial On .....2010'.

 

I Phoned The Court This Morning & They Have Told Me That Nationwide Has Still Not Put Thier Paperwork Forward.

In My Opinion,if This Had Been The Other Way Around Then Nationwide Would Have Been Awarded The Claim,,surely This Should Work Both Ways?

 

Is It Worth Me Now Putting In A N244 Form To The Court Asking Again For The Claim To Be Struck Out,giving The Reasons As To Why I Think This Should Be Done?