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Hi enamae, this DN is from 2003 when I think the requirement was only 7 days.

 

You are indeed correct, its 7 days required back then and they've given you an extra day to ensure (if it was sent first class post)

 

S.

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Hi enamae, this DN is from 2003 when I think the requirement was only 7 days.

 

 

 

Ah right didn't realise that, Thought it had always been 14 days.:oops:

 

When did it change ? because I've got one dated 4th February 2004 and that gave me 14 days.

 

 

enamae

Please note: I have no qualifications in this area and any advice offered is given in good faith.

 

 

http://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/publications/Ombudsman-news/40/40_setoff.htm

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Have you blanked out the address Cymru ?

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The prescribed format of the wording doesnt look right, the Capital letters that are underlined should be bolder than the rest of the capital letters according to the regs, are they on the original? scans are never very clear on this.

 

(5) Where any statement is required to be in a form specified in a Schedule to these Regulations and is reproduced in

the notice, then apart from any heading to the notice, trade names or names of parties to the agreement--

(a) the lettering in the statement shall be afforded more prominence (whether by capital letters, underlining, large or

bold print or otherwise) than any other lettering in the notice; and

(b) where words are both shown in capital letters and underlined in any statement specified in a Schedule to these

Regulations, they shall be afforded yet more prominence.

S.

 

Enamae, The date change from 7 to 14 was 19/12/2006

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Hi shadow, thanks for that . On the original the underlined words in the middle bold section are the same print, not any heavier or thicker.

 

Thats what I thought:)

 

Then they havent followed the format required in the regulations, all down to how the judge see's this. The regulations clearly state it MUST follow the prescribed format and terms.

 

S.

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***** SERIOUSLY IN DEBT, DONT KNOW WHAT TO DO, TRY NationalDebtLine's MoneySteps *****

 

 

IMPORTANT: Please take my advice in the spirit it is given and on the basis that I am expressing my opinion, These opinions are not endorsed by CAG in anyway and are offered informally without prejudice or warranty of any kind. These opinions are solely based upon the knowledge I've gained from this fantastic site and life in general. I have NO legal training.

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Their solicitors want repayment; from what I have read elsewhere I think I am correct that if a DN is incorrect all they can request is repayment of the defaulted amount, not the full alleged amount. Am I right? If so I'd better start researching for a letter:)

Edited by cymruambyth
typo
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Their solicitors want repayment; from what I have read elsewhere I think I am correct that if a DN is incorrect all they can request is repayment of the defaulted amount, not the full alleged amount. Am I right? If so I'd better start researching for a letter:)

 

If the DN is deemed invalid or incorrect then yes.....IF they have terminated the agreement all they would be able to ask for is the arrears prior to termination.

 

If they have not sent a termination letter then asking for the full balance is usually a good indicator the agreement is ended alongside that implying they are taking legal action by solicitor letters would also suffice in my opinion :-)

 

S.

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***** SERIOUSLY IN DEBT, DONT KNOW WHAT TO DO, TRY NationalDebtLine's MoneySteps *****

 

 

IMPORTANT: Please take my advice in the spirit it is given and on the basis that I am expressing my opinion, These opinions are not endorsed by CAG in anyway and are offered informally without prejudice or warranty of any kind. These opinions are solely based upon the knowledge I've gained from this fantastic site and life in general. I have NO legal training.

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Hi shadow, following on from your last post, I've found that the default notice date is actually shown on LTSB paperwork as the 14th and not the 13th on the letter; also there is a final demand date from March 2004.

I was thinking of sending a 1st letter along these lines (and then a follow up with more specifics if they had replied), unless anyone can suggest anything better

Thank you for your recent letter, the contents of which are noted.

I would be grateful if you could clarify a few points with your client.

My SAR showed that on a Default Notice was sent onXXX, could you please supply both proof of postage and the nature of the post that was used. In addition when was the agreement terminated?

I am intent on seeking a resolution to this and would be grateful if I could receive your replies within 14 days.

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Hi I'm looking at dates again. The DN is dated 113 August 2003, a Wednesday. LTSB SAR shows it being sent on 14 August, a Thursday.......according to this extract from another thread, surely that means it is shown as being delivered 2 working days later, which makes it Monday 18th, thus not allowing 7 clear days. Am I right?

2. Practice Direction

Service of Documents - First and Second Class Mail.

 

With effect from 16 April 1985 the Practice Direction issued on 30 July 1968 is hereby revoked and the following is substituted therefore.

1). Under S7 of the Interpretation Act 1978 service by post is deemed to have been effected, unless the contrary has been proved, at the time when the letter would be delivered in the ordinary course of post.

2). To avoid uncertainty as to the date of service it will be taken (subject to proof to the contrary) that delivery in the ordinary course of post was effected:-

(a) in the case of first class mail, on the second working day after posting;

(b) in the case of second class mail, on the fourth working day after posting.

"Working days" are Monday to Friday, excluding any bank holiday.

3). Affidavits of service shall state whether the document was dispatched by first or second class mail. If this information is omitted it will be assumed that second class mail was used.

4). This direction is subject to the special provisions of RSC Order 10, rule 1(3) relating to the service of originating process.

 

8th March 1985

J R BICKFORD SMITH Senior Master

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Hi I'm looking at dates again. The DN is dated 113 August 2003, a Wednesday. LTSB SAR shows it being sent on 14 August, a Thursday.......according to this extract from another thread, surely that means it is shown as being delivered 2 working days later, which makes it Monday 18th, thus not allowing 7 clear days. Am I right?

 

If there SAR shows as sending on the Thursday :-D :-D :-D then the calendar 7 days dont start till the following Monday.

 

Your calculations are correct and they didnt give you the prescribed 7 clear days to rectify.

 

S.

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Deal with your debts:

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***** SERIOUSLY IN DEBT, DONT KNOW WHAT TO DO, TRY NationalDebtLine's MoneySteps *****

 

 

IMPORTANT: Please take my advice in the spirit it is given and on the basis that I am expressing my opinion, These opinions are not endorsed by CAG in anyway and are offered informally without prejudice or warranty of any kind. These opinions are solely based upon the knowledge I've gained from this fantastic site and life in general. I have NO legal training.

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Oh dear :(:lol::lol:

Without wishing to sound pathetic, but not wanting to make any silly mistakes.......would it be best to advise a solicitor of this when they are threatening legal action if payment isn't made?

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Oh dear :(:lol::lol:

 

Without wishing to sound pathetic, but not wanting to make any silly mistakes.......would it be best to advise a solicitor of this when they are threatening legal action if payment isn't made?

 

You could be cheeky and state you'll be happy to pay the arrears on the default notice in monthly payments as legally thats all they can claim since they defaulted and terminated the account in breach of the CCA1974 act.

 

Its a large arrears amount though :-(

 

S.

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Deal with your debts:

STEP ONE - Dont Panic! | STEP TWO - Priority & Non Priority Debts | STEP THREE - Personal Budget Sheet | STEP FOUR - A SAFE bank Account | STEP FIVE - Dealing with Priority Debts | STEP SIX - Non-priority Debts | STEP SEVEN - Non-Priority Debt-Repayment Opt1 | STEP EIGHT - Non-Priority Debt-Repayment Opt2 | STEP NINE - Perils of Consolidation | STEP TEN - RE-Evaluate Frequently

 

***** SERIOUSLY IN DEBT, DONT KNOW WHAT TO DO, TRY NationalDebtLine's MoneySteps *****

 

 

IMPORTANT: Please take my advice in the spirit it is given and on the basis that I am expressing my opinion, These opinions are not endorsed by CAG in anyway and are offered informally without prejudice or warranty of any kind. These opinions are solely based upon the knowledge I've gained from this fantastic site and life in general. I have NO legal training.

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Hi Shadow,:)

Can I hypothesize as to whether, if they take their time terminating after the DN..ie drag on for a few months just sending arrears notices each month, then terminate/demand full balance, can they only claim the arrears stated on the DN, or the arrears accrued up to the actual point of termination? The latter would seem more logical, unfortunately?

Elsa x

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Hi Shadow,:)

Can I hypothesize as to whether, if they take their time terminating after the DN..ie drag on for a few months just sending arrears notices each month, then terminate/demand full balance, can they only claim the arrears stated on the DN, or the arrears accrued up to the actual point of termination? The latter would seem more logical, unfortunately?

Elsa x

 

I would think as the default notice is invalid it would therefore be the arrears at that point in time of termination, which in the case you have made would be a larger amount than that at default stage.

 

Dont forget though, just because the lender doesnt send a letter of termination doesnt mean the agreement isnt in termination, by a) asking for something they are not due till the end of the contract (complete repayment) or b) selling the debt to an agency that is unable due to licencing to run a rolling credit service (most DCA's) or c)Initiate court action.

 

Just my opinion as always.

 

S.

Are You as Anonymous on CAG as You Think You Are? *Link*

 

The CAG is a free help site,should you be offered help that requires payment,please report it to site team.

 

Deal with your debts:

STEP ONE - Dont Panic! | STEP TWO - Priority & Non Priority Debts | STEP THREE - Personal Budget Sheet | STEP FOUR - A SAFE bank Account | STEP FIVE - Dealing with Priority Debts | STEP SIX - Non-priority Debts | STEP SEVEN - Non-Priority Debt-Repayment Opt1 | STEP EIGHT - Non-Priority Debt-Repayment Opt2 | STEP NINE - Perils of Consolidation | STEP TEN - RE-Evaluate Frequently

 

***** SERIOUSLY IN DEBT, DONT KNOW WHAT TO DO, TRY NationalDebtLine's MoneySteps *****

 

 

IMPORTANT: Please take my advice in the spirit it is given and on the basis that I am expressing my opinion, These opinions are not endorsed by CAG in anyway and are offered informally without prejudice or warranty of any kind. These opinions are solely based upon the knowledge I've gained from this fantastic site and life in general. I have NO legal training.

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Thanks Shadow,

I've been researching this and had initially assumed it was the amount stated on DN, but to the point of termination does make more sense.

For some reason one I'm dealing with for a relative seems very reluctant to use the T word, just keeps sending those tedious arrears notices and acting as if the loan ac is still active...yet their in house gaXngsXters sorry Solicitors are asking for full balance.

Elsa x

PLEASE NOTE... I AM MOST SORRY BUT I HAVE VERY LIMITED AVAILABILITY AT THE MOMENT DUE TO EXTREME PRESSURE OF WORK - IF YOU REQUIRE URGENT HELP ON YOUR THREAD AND ARE GETTING NO RESPONSE PLEASE HIT THE TRIANGLE FOR SITE TEAM ASSISTANCE. ELSA XXX

 

Please check out my BLOG for the quick guide to debt threats - it has all the info & letter template links you need to get started on your journey of TAKING CONTROL. :roll:

 

All opinions are my own based on research. I am not legally qualified, if in doubt please consult a legal expert.

Hope this has helped or made you smile. Keep your chin up, you're among friends now! Elsa xxx

Please click the *star* of any CAG member who has helped you .

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Thanks Shadow,

I've been researching this and had initially assumed it was the amount stated on DN, but to the point of termination does make more sense.

For some reason one I'm dealing with for a relative seems very reluctant to use the T word, just keeps sending those tedious arrears notices and acting as if the loan ac is still active...yet their in house gaXngsXters sorry Solicitors are asking for full balance.

Elsa x

 

Tell their in house idiots to confirm whether or not the account is in fact terminated.

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Sorry Cymru,

Didn't mean to be rude by hijacking you..yours is a very interesting thread.

I've put a collection of threads and references on DN's together which you might find useful:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/200901-anatomy-default-notice.html#post2186250

 

Hope I'm forgiven :) ?

Elsa xx

PLEASE NOTE... I AM MOST SORRY BUT I HAVE VERY LIMITED AVAILABILITY AT THE MOMENT DUE TO EXTREME PRESSURE OF WORK - IF YOU REQUIRE URGENT HELP ON YOUR THREAD AND ARE GETTING NO RESPONSE PLEASE HIT THE TRIANGLE FOR SITE TEAM ASSISTANCE. ELSA XXX

 

Please check out my BLOG for the quick guide to debt threats - it has all the info & letter template links you need to get started on your journey of TAKING CONTROL. :roll:

 

All opinions are my own based on research. I am not legally qualified, if in doubt please consult a legal expert.

Hope this has helped or made you smile. Keep your chin up, you're among friends now! Elsa xxx

Please click the *star* of any CAG member who has helped you .

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