Unenforcable Credit Agreement- Halifax

[pitbullofbrum]

Can anybody please help me , I feel as though i have come to a dead end with my request for a copy of my original credit card agreement ,which was made back in November 2008, I have a copy of all the corespondance between me and the halifax and have refered my case to the financial ombudsman, The halifax have sent me my original application (not signed) 3 times - then they sent me an agreement with pages blanked out and nothing on it apart from terms and conditions, they say they have furfilled there obligation under section 78 and the account is no longer in dispute, I now have a letter from Power To Contact saying they will be visiting me at my address to discuss this matter with me , This credit card dates back to 2001 and i wont pay a penny untill they show me a singed copy of the agreement, IS there some kind sole out there who will advise me what to do next,i have been to citizens advice but they dont have a clue ,they have never come across this before ,, HELP

Edited May 18, 2009 by supasnooper
Removal of e-mail address

[42man]

Welcome PB....If they won't send a copy of your agreement have you considered this ? - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/173201-why-you-shouldnt-use.html with hopefully this result - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/165349-smt37-morgan-stanley-goldfish-3.html#post2119750

[pitbullofbrum]

Thanks for your reply 42man, I sent that letter(under the provisions of cpr31.16) on the 6/5/2009 they have untill the 28/5/2009 to respond (21 days). On the 13/5/2009 they responded with the letter from power to contact saying they were coming to my abode ,Scary or what ?? Should i wait and see if they send anything to me by the 28th ??

 

When i originally requested a copy of my agreement i done it by phone,followed up by letters ie: i didnt send a cheque for £1.00, however they sent me the application 3 times and agreement once totally blanked out , do you think it will matter in court that i didnt send a cheque for the fee of £1.oo ?

[citizenB]

If you sent the letter advised by 42man, then you didnt need to enclose a cheque/postal order.

 

That is only required for CCA 1974 = £1.00 or SAR = £10.00

[pitbullofbrum]

ok i will wait and see what they come up with next ,do you advise sending it again after the 21 days or just applying straight to the county court , your advise is very much appreciated

[smt37]

Hi Pitbull,

 

I don't think the non-payment of the £1 fee will make any difference. In my case, I didn't mention the S.78 requests in my witness statement at all, but saved them until the hearing and then used it to my advantage to show the judge that Barclaycard had been frustrating matters by failing to send me anything.

 

In any case like this, I think the best procedure would be to do whatever you can to get a copy of the original agreement. If that means sending CCA requests twice and then starting the CPR requests, then so be it. Take shortcuts at your peril. The last thing you want is the creditor to say "well why didn't you say so" in court and then produce the agreement. If the judge agrees with them that you were not clear in your demands under the CPR, then you risk having to pay their costs (could be as much as £2,000).

 

My advice is to send it again - make sure it's clear and a reminder and then send the N244 application for a hearing.

 

SMT37

[pitbullofbrum]

Thanks for your advice SMT i will take it on board, theres quite a hefty balance on the account so i know they wont roll over but without my signature on the agreement i think they are fighting a losing battle , i will keep you posted on my progress thanks again

[pitbullofbrum]

hi guys just updating you on my progress, today i recieved a letter and from the outset they are apologising that i have had reason to complain ,i will quote them '

 

"My understanding of your concerns are that futher to asking the bank to provide you with a copy of the agreement for the account,which you have recieved,you now say the bank are unable to enforce the debt, due to lack of signature on the copy you recieved. you have asked the bank to consider writing off the debt.

I have liased with our legal department regarding your claims,and would advise that although you have not been provided with a copy of the singed agreement,this does not mean the bank will not pursue you for full payement.As you are aware,you applied for the account in feb 2001 and have used funds available to you ,since that time . Statements have been produced on a monthly basis and i could find no regard of you disputing any of the entries on the account,since the account was oponed.

At this time your account is being serviced by our collections department,and i would ask you to contact them to discuss proposals for repayment.i would remind you that failure to make the required payment, may result in a default being issued against you and recorded on your credit file . this in line ,will have an adverse affect on any credit application you make in the future , i trust this clarifies matters futher."

 

the letter then says the usual about if your still unhappy contact the financial ombudsman.

 

What do you think ? shall i send another cpr request ?

 

your advise is very much appreciated

Edited May 28, 2009 by pitbullofbrum

[42man]

If it was me i'd send a LETTER BEOFRE ACTION...for failure to respond to the CPR31.16

[pitbullofbrum]

thanks 42man,i had a look through your templates and nothing seems applicable to my situation - or have i missed it ? thanks for your speedy response by the way

[42man]

I'm pretty sure there is one on here - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/173201-why-you-shouldnt-use.html

[smt37]

Hi,

 

The point is, you asked for a copy of the agreement under CCA s.78 and they sent you, legitimately, a copy which was unsigned. They are allowed to do this. Unfortunately, it doesn't help you because they might have a signed copy hidden away somewhere that they could produce in court if they wanted to get a court order for enforcement.

 

So the next step is to ask them which documents they would use in court and ask them to send you a copy under the pre-disclosure rules - hence the CPR 31.16 request. They have confused the two and not sent you what they would use in court, so you should remind them that they have not complied with you CPR 31.16 request and give them another 21 days and then if they still have not complied, then you can seek a court order for them to disclose. There's no need for a letter of action unless you want to give them a third chance. I didn't with barclaycard and it worked for me. A CPR 31.16 request is actually a pre-action disclosure request, so it should already be considered by their legal department as a letter before action (unless they comply).

[pitbullofbrum]

your completly right smt 37 ,why is it so hard to get a simple copy of your singed agreement ? ,so i will send your letter to them with something like this at the top YOU HAVE FAILED TO COMPLY WITH MY CPR 31.16 REQUEST WHICH WAS MADE ON ******, SO I ASK AGAIN and give them 21 days to respond before i take my next course of action, what do you think smt ?

[pitbullofbrum]

hi guys just updating you futher, i recieved a letter from the financial ombudsman stating that :

It would appear that Bank of Scotland plc have not yet issued their final response on your complaint even though they have had the required eight weeks in which to do so.

It may be possible for the firm to issue their final response shortly;we have therefore contacted Bank of Scotland plc and requested that they issue their final response letter within the next 14 days.

We will contact you again upon reciept of the final response from Bank of Scotland plc or when the 14 day time limit has expired.

I dont know what to make of the letter or what the financial ombudsman can do but im sure it will ruffle a few feathers .(my complaint was that someone from the office had filled in the application/agreement on my behalf as it had no signature from me / I did not fill it in ,and they are also refusing to acknowledge my letters )

Meanwhile my second cpr 31.16 went off over 2 weeks ago now so i wait in excitment ...

[pitbullofbrum]

Hi guys Ive had no replies from Halifax after sending off 3 cpr 31.16 requests

so ive got a N244 but im a bit confused with section 10.What exactly do I

put after ticking witness statement box.Do i print off pt2537's witness statement and attach to my N244? Please help as now im being threatend with court action by Blair Oliver Scott,who are sending letters saying they will obtain court order to take money out of my property :sad:

[IdaInFife]

yes

 

ida x

[pitbullofbrum]

Thanks for your lack of help

[raydetinu]

Ida said yes to your query!!

[pitbullofbrum]

but what about the links to templates ive sent 6 times in total ????

need help with n244 and court hearing im way passed sending cpr requests!

[IdaInFife]

Hi guys Ive had no replies from Halifax after sending off 3 cpr 31.16 requests

so ive got a N244 but im a bit confused with section 10.What exactly do I

put after ticking witness statement box.Do i print off pt2537's witness statement and attach to my N244? YES

 

 

what else is that you need help with ?

 

PT has put everything you need to do on the link:

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/173201-why-you-shouldnt-use.html

 

 

you could also have alook at smt's thread:

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/165349-smt37-morgan-stanley-goldfish.html

 

 

just shouting help and not saying wat you need help with doesn't help :-|

 

 

ida x

[pitbullofbrum]

while ive been preparing my n244 against halifax they have passed it on to robinson way and company now the debit is no longer with the halifax can i still do the n244 or am i to late or do i fill it in with this new companys details?