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    • Thanks everyone. Will speak with the manager first chance I get later today and let you know.
    • own topic created  tnx the info. dx  
    • this debt: MBNA Bank of Scotland Card debt- LInk got a CCJ - now want payment review - MBNA - Consumer Action Group and a barclaycard loan - did you ever send the a CCA in all these years.....when was it taken out?    
    • Welcome to the Forum. The PCN must be subject to Bye laws as the warning near the bottom of the PCN does not comply with the protection of Freedoms Act 2012 Schedule 4 Under Section 9 [2][f[] of the Act it should say: (f)warn the keeper that if, after the period of 28 days beginning with the day after that on which the notice is given— (i)the amount of the unpaid parking charges specified under paragraph (d) has not been paid in full, and (ii)the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver ,the creditor will (if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met) have the right to recover from the keeper so much of that amount as remains unpaid; Their version states they are pursuing you as the driver [because of the Bye laws they cannot transfer the liability from the driver to the keeper] even though you are the keeper. Should it go to Court Judges do not accept that the driver and the keeper are the same person. Obviously on many occasions another member of the family may be driving instead of the keeper. Indeed anyone with a valid motor insurance policy is able to drive your car. if any of the three cars were not driven by the keeper they are not liable to pay the PCN only the driver is.  as long as they do not divulge who was driving those lovely people at Alliance haven't a hope of winning against them in Court. What a shame. However while those keepers who were not driving are in the clear all is not lost for the other keeper drivers. Alliance still have to prove who was driving which is difficult providing those keepers do not appeal.  It is quite often that on appeal the keeper may say "I entered the car park at....."  immediately giving away that they were the driver. Plus even if you appeal it won't be accepted as a] they lose £100 straight away and b] mostly all the major car parking companies are dishonest scrotes. In the meantime you will be on the receiving end of threatening letters from Alliance, unregulated debt collectors and fifth, sixth or even lower rated solicitors all trying to frighten the life out of you to cough up. They can all be safely ignored since if you don't contact any of them they don't know who was driving so have no information that the can use in Court to identify the driver. Some time in the future they may send you a Letter of Claim which must not be ignored. Just let us know and we will advise a suitable snotty letter to send them which will show that you are not afraid of them and are happy to turn up in court knowing that you will win. Sorry it was a bit long winded.  
    • He’s still At it from a bungalow on Haslingden Road. Changed name to Bamberbridge cars with a Preston based phone number (01772) but dodgy dealings at the bungalow are still a go.
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Halifax replied to my CCA - is it enforceable


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Hi there,

I am asking if a "Visa Card Priority Aplication" signed by me is counted as CCA. Is it enforceable??? It does say the followings:

1.Your personal details

..my name....phone no and mother maiden name...

2.Your employment

...my job, phone no from my company.

3. Additional card holde

...n/a

4.Additional services

...n/a

5.Prefered Pyment period

did not tick any of the 2 boxes in which one is 1-15 and second one 15-30 but has the following written:

On the back of this application you will find important information about your account. If you need any copy of conditions you can ask any of the branches.

Principal cardholders application and declaration

Please suply me with a card and the information I have given you is true.

 

I agree to be bound by the halifax visa conditions and understand that they form part of this agreement

Your right to cancel.......

 

6.Application's signature

This is a Credit agreement regulated under the CCA 1974. Sign if only to be legally ...and I do not understand what it says as is not clear.

I have signed it and dated back in 1997.

Then is says something about DPA1984. I am ok with that...as is about disclosing my data.

 

IT IS NOT SIGNED BY THEM but it is a

 

PW. and dated.

 

:confused: Help!!!

Thank you in advance.

DD

 

Then they have enclosed as well onto other additional sheet:

- a statement of account as at the date of this letter:

a) the balance on the acc is....pounds

b)the credit limit is ....pounds

c)the current interest rates are 29.95% for purchases, 29.95% for balance transfer, same amount for cheque and for cash advance

d)the arrears on the account is....

e)the amount currently payable by you to reach by ...is ...

f)further payments will be payable each month, if the balance is 5.00 or more, you must repay the greaterof: a)1%........blah,blah,blah...

 

Sigend by Anne Gartshore....another manager...what a joke

 

then another additional letter in which they say that they have complied with the requirements of the Consumer Credit, regulation 1983,3(2)(b), proides that a copy can omit any signature box, signature and date of signature. In summary we are not required to produce a copy with your clients signature on it and the agreement remains enforceable.

We have satisfied our obligation to provide an executed agreement under s78. As such the agreement is fully enforceable and we shall continue to treat it as such. We will not be entering into any further correspondence with you regarding the requirements relating to the provision of copy agreements....

and finally they said as a reminder that failure to make payments uner this agreement will result in collection activities and any default may also be reported to credit reference agencies.

 

Signed again A. Gartshore

Edited by London000
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Sounds like an application form to me. It doesn't sound like it contains prescribed terms. Enforceability? Practically nil I'd say.

 

I presume you applied for the card quite a long time ago?

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Hi Craigers,

Thank you for that.

What shall I write in return? Maybe sending them a letter asking under the CPR? As it is obvious that they did not send me a true copy of agreement and definetely as you said is not enforceable. I will not pay any money anyway and I should let them go ahead with whatever they want. They have still not replied at all yet even under the FOS request with regards to the amount of charges requested a while back which is stil in dispute.

But they have sent 1 week ago a notice for me being in default with the minimum payment and then 2 days ago,I am in arrears with 4 times biger amount.

I do not get what they want to do at the end. They think we are kids.

To one of my friend as we applied in the same time for CCA under s77/78 they have replied that they are not required to send a copy of any agreement but they sent just a T&C only.

Anyway I shall send them a letter so they will have to do their shopping elsewhere.

If they are for a joke, why can't I have a serious show in court if it goes.

As they are a big financial institution they should know very well the law...and what can I say ...they have not complied with it fully for so many years ; on top of which they already know it(different law applies).....and that is where we are all coming from. :smile:

Yes I have applied for this one back in 97-98.

I shall keep updating as it goes.

 

Regards,

DD

 

 

Sounds like an application form to me. It doesn't sound like it contains prescribed terms. Enforceability? Practically nil I'd say.

 

I presume you applied for the card quite a long time ago?

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Can you scan the alleged CCA and post it on here with personal info removed?

 

Hi craigers,

 

I do not know if it can be attached directly from my PC. But I should try later this evening.

Thank you very much,

DD

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Not an expert but, going on a similar case I went through with a credit card;

 

If it says "Application..." on the top it's exactly that.

 

Additionally the terms of the agreement must be (clearly laid out and) on the same page you sign if I remember correctly.

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Not an expert but, going on a similar case I went through with a credit card;

 

If it says "Application..." on the top it's exactly that.

 

Additionally the terms of the agreement must be (clearly laid out and) on the same page you sign if I remember correctly.

 

 

Hi ilonavamp,

I do know that they are trying to scare you as much as possible. Do not be afraid because as far as I know an application is not an agreement. As you said the agreement ..when they will send it has to have all the prescribed terms incuding the signatures. But we shall wait for others to join us. Do not panic in anyway. I do have a few nice letters waiting to go but I should wait a little longer. I should post the letter soon. I did find it somwhere around and not only it is very professional but it does give them a big kick....

Let me know if you find anything else a very good luck! I should post with latest news. I definetely will not pay them a dime anymore as they use to scare me for so long...not anymore.:p

Regards,

DD

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London,

 

I have had the same reply from Halifax. Just an application form and a newly prepared agreement. Looks very fishy. I will post shortly.

 

Vint

 

 

Hi Vint,

I have replied to Ilonavamp and I will post my letter later these days. At the moment I will wait a bit for others to join us.

 

Regards,

DD

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Can you scan the alleged CCA and post it on here with personal info removed?

 

 

Hi Craigers,

I am sorry not to open the PC yesterday but I was a bit tired....

I am trying now to do it......NO IT DOES NOT WORK the copy/paste.:(

I believe that I should try the photoshopbucket. I will definetely POST them tonight ...promise... although via these kind I am not big fun as URL'S as far as I know, gives viruses as well as the security of a PC.

DD:D

Edited by London000
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testing testin

 

I have to see again how to .....just to send the link only for the other ones...but is saturday night and off I go!

Any thoughts about this one???

DD

Edited by London000
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Just an application form as suspected. Can't really read it but I doubt it contains prescribed terms and is therefore improperly executed and I'd say unenforceable too.

 

Hi craigers,

Thank you for looking into it.

I am finding myself in a very hard position to read it but as I have looked very closely there is no chance of any prescribed terms.Unenforceable too! They have also enclosed other rubish things with it but I believe is not worth even mentioning and that it was sent in a A4 brown envelope re-sealeble. I have opened it so easy.....it is amazing how they are handling our sensitive informations...;).Certenly I should bring it to their attention as well. For a big financial institute they should have sent it as proof of signature....

I have in store a few letters to send them. No wonder why Halifax did mention that they do not want any correspondence with me in this matter.

I shall get back with more updates.

All the best and thank you once more,

God Bless

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post the other rubbish they sent

 

Hi craigers,

 

I have these ones and in the same envelope with tha application came Credit Card Agreement reg. by CC ACT 1974 but it is a new one drafted, no signature of both of us and I did find it somwhere on this forum -8 pages...but I shall post the link for you to see it after I post the other rubish....:cool:

 

Halifax3

 

hA!HA! I have the link where HALIFAX HAVE SENT SOMETHING SIMILAR.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/halifax-bank-bank-scotland/196784-halifax-cca-enforceable.html

 

Also I have just been through your thread and yes I did find exactly the same with regards to a 7-8 pages of shall we call them a new copy of Credit Agreement???? Exactly the same.

What a joke!!!!

I will not pay them anything until they are showing me exactly for what I am paying....

 

Regards,

DD

Edited by London000
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Having scanned the threads we are all getting the exact same literature back - from the same manager! I need to send the second letter and will follow the sample wording in the above threads. Wishing everyone success. Will keep reading to see if there are new updates. (Knowing that you are not the only one helps).

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London, what are you wanting to achieve by going down the CCA route? If its a refund on unlawful charges then a gentle reminder that you are not obliged to make payments on an account in dispute on the grounds of an unenforceable credit agreement should hopefully work. It did for me with bosom buddy BOS.

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Hi London,

 

I think that we all have had similar responses from the same Manager.

 

Looking at a lot of the application forms on the forum, there is a date received stamp, all seem to be signed by the same person, for both Halifax and BOS applications. He must have been busy.

 

I responded to my receipt of documents in the way Craigers suggested, but not too gentle, pointing out that the documents received were inadequate and that the account was still in serious dispute.

 

I think that we are all realising, that to get a real copy of the signed agreement, a SAR needs to follow.

 

Vint

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Yesterday I received a half a rain forest by special delivery in response to my SAR to BOS. I asked for copies of any application forms and copies of any signed executed agreements. Surprise surprise they produced another copy of my application form, albeit this one was much more legible than the one they sent with my CCA request. They blatantly don't have an enforceable agreement!

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London, what are you wanting to achieve by going down the CCA route? If its a refund on unlawful charges then a gentle reminder that you are not obliged to make payments on an account in dispute on the grounds of an unenforceable credit agreement should hopefully work. It did for me with bosom buddy BOS.

 

 

Hi craigers,

 

I have sent already for the unlawful charges back in Dec08 and 2 months down the line Halifax did not even answer. I am already through FOS and they have given Halifax 8 weeks. Still 2 more weeks...so in default as well.

CCA them, 14 days gone Halifax did not reply, then 2nd letter sent and they have replied on the on the 30th day with the letter and application plus a new statement of acc. I do not know what they think but I should go to court if they do not reply now. I have sent a letter now under the s60 and given them a lot of sites to have a look....see what they are replying. I told them they are in default and no money will be paid anymore. They can only dream....and if it goes to court I shall go without any problems. I shall ask a disclosure of everything they have under the CPR.....then I will take it up from there..they will go empty handed...

plus I shall ask them to repay all the money I have paid to this acc...:p

Did you find a good letter somewhere???

DD

Edited by London000
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Hi London,

 

I think that we all have had similar responses from the same Manager.

 

Looking at a lot of the application forms on the forum, there is a date received stamp, all seem to be signed by the same person, for both Halifax and BOS applications. He must have been busy.

 

I responded to my receipt of documents in the way Craigers suggested, but not too gentle, pointing out that the documents received were inadequate and that the account was still in serious dispute.

 

I think that we are all realising, that to get a real copy of the signed agreement, a SAR needs to follow.

 

Vint

 

Hi Vint,

 

I have sent a good letter under the s60 and given them a lot of sites to visit....and is it goes further...I will aske them a disclosure under the CPR...then I will make them not only to bring the balance to 0.00 but to repay all my money back since opening this account....

I know they do not have anything else to disclose unles they will carboncopy my signature which is impossible as I would know if I have signed anything else....and if they copy it.....go under the different law...and they will go very down.8)

DD

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Not an expert but, going on a similar case I went through with a credit card;

 

If it says "Application..." on the top it's exactly that.

 

Additionally the terms of the agreement must be (clearly laid out and) on the same page you sign if I remember correctly.

 

Hi ilonavamp,

 

Yes you are right about being on the same page....if not I would say goodbye to them. There are, somewhere on this forum very good letters to guide you. I have been looking around and it does make me laugh of how a bank would atract so many bright and clever people. It is very clear that they were only there to take the money without much of ...education...I think they are learning through these forums what to do as well.....

Good luck and if you have any good template letters or links do please share them with all the others....I shall put them on this forum as soon as I am sure....especially the outcome...;)

DD

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Not an expert but, going on a similar case I went through with a credit card;

 

If it says "Application..." on the top it's exactly that.

 

Additionally the terms of the agreement must be (clearly laid out and) on the same page you sign if I remember correctly.

 

Hi there,

I have sent a different letter at the end in which, after I have given them lots of sites to have a look with regards to the CCA's cases, OFT, etc I have used the s61,65 and 127.

Quoting from my letter sent (it was about 4 pages:cool:):

I would refer you to Sections 61, 65 and 127 of the CCA 1974, and the recent binding decisions in the high court and court of appeal regarding the lack of prescribed terms in regulated consumer agreements (which applies in this case).

 

I refer the cases of Wilson V FCT and Wilson V Hurstanger.

 

Both these BINDING judgements hold that if a regulated agreement is missing any prescribed terms, or if the terms are misstated then the agreement is irredeemably unenforceable.

In Wilson V Hurstanger it is stated that the prescribed terms should be within the signature document and not in any other document. I believe that the document sent to me with my signature on does not contain the prescribed terms and as such is unenforceable

 

I should post the letter once I have any answer from them....then I will go under the CPR letter....

What did you send them??

DD

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