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Unenforceability Cases on hold until further notice


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All sounds like Bull Dust to me and...

will only believe when I have had sight of a Court document!

 

AC

There is a letter from the Chester County Court which appeared somewhere else on this forum which I have as a pdf but don't know how to bring it up here.

It refers to the test cases and putting a stay on other cases but there are some confusing things.

1.It is not addressed to anyone

2.There is no date on it.

3.It says that all parties involved in CCA cases already in progress through that court will be informed and invited to make representations about the proposal-I have been taken to court by MBNA in the Chester County Court and submitted a defence and the pre trial process is continuing but I have not had any notification about this.

4.It says representations are invited as to the merits of the proposed course of action and the selection of the cases.-I guess thats an open invitation to the lenders to select the ones that serve their purposes best.

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They'll stay the lot, so they can complete this:

 

The alarming thing is...some of this appears to be happening already, at least from the way some Judges now behave.

 

Cheers,

BRW

 

I fear that you are right, BRW - there is sufficient case law already in place, so the only possible reason they can have to treat 'carefully selected cases' as test cases is to scupper the debtor:(

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I fear that you are right, BRW - there is sufficient case law already in place, so the only possible reason they can have to treat 'carefully selected cases' as test cases is to scupper the debtor:(

 

 

Wonder if it will be treated fairly and QC's appointed to put the debtors arguments forward.............:roll:

 

Wouyldn't hold your breath though

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I cannot and do not believe that a firm, an admitted member of the Law Society, would get a third party to send out their letters, undated letters.

 

It is amazing what one can do with an apple mac!

 

I just don't buy it, no doubt time will tell.

 

AC

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Wonder if it will be treated fairly and QC's appointed to put the debtors arguments forward.............:roll:

 

Wouyldn't hold your breath though

 

make no mistake the claims firms will have big hitting QCs to argue the debtors case.

some of them have already invested millions in creating a whole new industry on the advice of the very best QCs in the country and they will not go down without a fight.

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Wonder if it will be treated fairly and QC's appointed to put the debtors arguments forward.............:roll:

 

Wouyldn't hold your breath though

 

My thoughts exactly Tinkerbell - guess it was inevitable that with all these claims firms springing up, the creds would do something to put an end to the 'loophole' (their term, not mine).

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I fear that you are right, BRW - there is sufficient case law already in place, so the only possible reason they can have to treat 'carefully selected cases' as test cases is to scupper the debtor:(

 

 

You are right that there is sufficient case law in place regarding straightforward breaches of prescribed terms so there is no need for further cases to establish that .

However there are now cases being submitted which do not rely upon the prescribed terms breaches but on other points which may render an agreement being unenforceable but are more of a 'grey area'

Maybe some test cases clarifying these grey areas could be good in that precedents set may give us more grounds to claim on.

If that is the case then only that type of case should be stayed and the straightforward ones should proceed but thats probably not what will happen.

Interesting thought-if all unenforceability cases are stayed then surely everyone can stop paying their credit cards and loans and when the lender takes them to court we can argue unenforceability and bingo the case is frozen and they can't get a ccj against you.

In the meantime you can investigate the agreement to see if it has breaches so you can decide what to do when the case is unfrozen.

I would love to see what would happen if everyone in the country stopped paying their debts

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make no mistake the claims firms will have big hitting QCs to argue the debtors case.

some of them have already invested millions in creating a whole new industry on the advice of the very best QCs in the country and they will not go down without a fight.

 

Certainly hope so, TD - but will it be a level playing field?

 

Call me cynical, but why are they even having test cases when there is sufficient case law already in place? Sounds like the judge has already made his decision in favour of the creditors and the rest is just a formality.:evil:

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You are right that there is sufficient case law in place regarding straightforward breaches of prescribed terms so there is no need for further cases to establish that .

However there are now cases being submitted which do not rely upon the prescribed terms breaches but on other points which may render an agreement being unenforceable but are more of a 'grey area'

Maybe some test cases clarifying these grey areas could be good in that precedents set may give us more grounds to claim on.

If that is the case then only that type of case should be stayed and the straightforward ones should proceed but thats probably not what will happen.

Interesting thought-if all unenforceability cases are stayed then surely everyone can stop paying their credit cards and loans and when the lender takes them to court we can argue unenforceability and bingo the case is frozen and they can't get a ccj against you. Certainly hope so:)

In the meantime you can investigate the agreement to see if it has breaches so you can decide what to do when the case is unfrozen.

I would love to see what would happen if everyone in the country stopped paying their debts

 

:D I'd love to see that too - mass apopletic fits in DCA offices across the country:lol:

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Hello U13!

 

Sounds like the judge has already made his decision in favour of the creditors and the rest is just a formality.
If the letter is genuine, then that is exactly how it sounds. It signals the gathering of a herd of pro-bank Judges intent on doing another Rankine on the Consumer.

 

This issue, if genuine, needs Media attention from the outset, so the Judges concerned are dragged out into the spotlight well before they start plotting any decisions or, heaven forbid, making any dubious Judgments.

 

We need to moan about it before they give themselves the chance, not wait until after they have done the dirty deed.

 

Cheers,

BRW

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Hello U13!

 

If the letter is genuine, then that is exactly how it sounds. It signals the gathering of a herd of pro-bank Judges intent on doing another Rankine on the Consumer.

 

This issue, if genuine, needs Media attention from the outset, so the Judges concerned are dragged out into the spotlight well before they start plotting any decisions or, heaven forbid, making any dubious Judgments.

 

We need to moan about it before they give themselves the chance, not wait until after they have done the dirty deed.

 

Cheers,

BRW

 

Maybe there should be a flood of calls to Chester county court from worried debtors querying the position so that the perception Chester may have that it is all Rankine type claims cases may be changed??

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Certainly hope so, TD - but will it be a level playing field?

 

Call me cynical, but why are they even having test cases when there is sufficient case law already in place? Sounds like the judge has already made his decision in favour of the creditors and the rest is just a formality.:evil:

 

For that to be the case with breaches of prescribed terms the government would have to repeal the 1974 Consumer Credit Act.Gordon is pretty stupid but do you think he will commit political suicide?

How about the courts can see an avalanch of cases coming in from claims companies and are clearing the decks so they can just wave them through rather than the court system collapse.

Under the Civil Proceedures Rules both parties are obliged to try to settle before the case comes to court.If there is clear case law precedent then a lender bringing a case to court when he has no chance of winning would clearly be breaking the rules.

Also I can not believe that the claims companies having been advised by top QC's would not have seen this coming and had a contingencies plan to deal with this move

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Hello U13!

 

If the letter is genuine, then that is exactly how it sounds. It signals the gathering of a herd of pro-bank Judges intent on doing another Rankine on the Consumer.

 

This issue, if genuine, needs Media attention from the outset, so the Judges concerned are dragged out into the spotlight well before they start plotting any decisions or, heaven forbid, making any dubious Judgments.

 

We need to moan about it before they give themselves the chance, not wait until after they have done the dirty deed.

 

Cheers,

BRW

 

Well, looks like there are 13 days left, in which to kick up a storm.

 

If the letter on page 1 is indeed genuine, what flows from it could seriously impact on many vulnerabe consumers;

consumers with valid claims!

 

AC

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Maybe there should be a flood of calls to Chester county court from worried debtors querying the position so that the perception Chester may have that it is all Rankine type claims cases may be changed??

 

I have called Chester County Court and have been told that regarding my case an order confirming the stay has beeen sent out today so I should receive it in the next couple of days-good news for me actually :)

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There is a letter from the Chester County Court which appeared somewhere else on this forum which I have as a pdf but don't know how to bring it up here.

It refers to the test cases and putting a stay on other cases but there are some confusing things.

1.It is not addressed to anyone

2.There is no date on it.

3.It says that all parties involved in CCA cases already in progress through that court will be informed and invited to make representations about the proposal-I have been taken to court by MBNA in the Chester County Court and submitted a defence and the pre trial process is continuing but I have not had any notification about this.

4.It says representations are invited as to the merits of the proposed course of action and the selection of the cases.-I guess thats an open invitation to the lenders to select the ones that serve their purposes best.

 

TD, do you mean the letter in the first post of this thread ? If you want to put a PDF file into a post I think you can use the "manage attachment" button.:)

 

pdf.gifEnforceability decl 06 05 09.pdf (26.6 KB, 50 views)

 

Although, it looks as though I have been able to copy and paste it over.

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Hello U13!

 

If the letter is genuine, then that is exactly how it sounds. It signals the gathering of a herd of pro-bank Judges intent on doing another Rankine on the Consumer.

 

This issue, if genuine, needs Media attention from the outset, so the Judges concerned are dragged out into the spotlight well before they start plotting any decisions or, heaven forbid, making any dubious Judgments.

 

We need to moan about it before they give themselves the chance, not wait until after they have done the dirty deed.

 

Cheers,

BRW

 

Good point BRW.

 

Anyone have any contacts?

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For that to be the case with breaches of prescribed terms the government would have to repeal the 1974 Consumer Credit Act.Gordon is pretty stupid but do you think he will commit political suicide? Thought he'd done that already;)

How about the courts can see an avalanch of cases coming in from claims companies and are clearing the decks so they can just wave them through rather than the court system collapse. Hope that is the case, I really do.

Under the Civil Proceedures Rules both parties are obliged to try to settle before the case comes to court.If there is clear case law precedent then a lender bringing a case to court when he has no chance of winning would clearly be breaking the rules.

Also I can not believe that the claims companies having been advised by top QC's would not have seen this coming and had a contingencies plan to deal with this move

 

What contingency plan would cover a (possibly) corrupt judge, though?

 

I'm sorry to sound negative - and believe me, I would be overjoyed to be proved wrong - but experience has taught me to be cynical. Even the largest claims firm is small fry compared to the amassed banks; and we know how the establishment loves to rally to their cause...

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Why is this just limited to Chester ?

is there a specific reason for that?why have other courts not followed suit,?

 

What concerns me is stories like the lords the other week, several of them received payments to change laws and were caught at it bang to rights, and unbelievably they werent breaking any laws in taking these payments.

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I'm sorry to sound negative - and believe me, I would be overjoyed to be proved wrong - but experience has taught me to be cynical. Even the largest claims firm is small fry compared to the amassed banks; and we know how the establishment loves to rally to their cause...

 

Agree UD13!

 

Furthermore, the establishment appear to prefer, propping up the Banks!

 

AC

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100,000 claims, lets say approx 4-5.000 per claim;

amounts to quite a sizeable figure...approx £5 Million.

 

Now, in all of this what about claimants Human Rights?

 

It would appear that consumers do not have any!

 

AC

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100,000 claims, lets say approx 4-5.000 per claim;

amounts to quite a sizeable figure...approx £5 Million.

 

Now, in all of this what about claimants Human Rights?

 

It would appear that consumers do not have any!

 

AC

 

 

Think you missed a few zero's out there AC........shgould be £500,000,000 or half a billion

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Why is this just limited to Chester ?

is there a specific reason for that?why have other courts not followed suit,?

 

What concerns me is stories like the lords the other week, several of them received payments to change laws and were caught at it bang to rights, and unbelievably they werent breaking any laws in taking these payments.

 

 

Because a particular claims company & their solicitors have issued thousands of claims there

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MBNA are adamant that section 189 is valid for the prescibed terms to be included in a document other than the signature document?

An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last. <br />

Winston Churchill

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Agree UD13!

 

Furthermore, the establishment appear to prefer, propping up the Banks!

 

AC

 

The establishment now partly owns most of them:eek:

 

Surely all this will take time anyway,

bankrupcies will soar even higher,

dca"s will become even more unscrupulous,

 

Surely they cant just overwrite the cca law that simple,

im not overly worried, surely laws will still be there to protect the consumer,

 

When the last cca amendment came in, how badly did that affect consumers rights?

were there any major changes or just tiny ones,and did it really affect agreements pre 2007 ,what major benefits did we loose from the 1974 act?

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