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    • Thanks everyone. Will speak with the manager first chance I get later today and let you know.
    • own topic created  tnx the info. dx  
    • this debt: MBNA Bank of Scotland Card debt- LInk got a CCJ - now want payment review - MBNA - Consumer Action Group and a barclaycard loan - did you ever send the a CCA in all these years.....when was it taken out?    
    • Welcome to the Forum. The PCN must be subject to Bye laws as the warning near the bottom of the PCN does not comply with the protection of Freedoms Act 2012 Schedule 4 Under Section 9 [2][f[] of the Act it should say: (f)warn the keeper that if, after the period of 28 days beginning with the day after that on which the notice is given— (i)the amount of the unpaid parking charges specified under paragraph (d) has not been paid in full, and (ii)the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver ,the creditor will (if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met) have the right to recover from the keeper so much of that amount as remains unpaid; Their version states they are pursuing you as the driver [because of the Bye laws they cannot transfer the liability from the driver to the keeper] even though you are the keeper. Should it go to Court Judges do not accept that the driver and the keeper are the same person. Obviously on many occasions another member of the family may be driving instead of the keeper. Indeed anyone with a valid motor insurance policy is able to drive your car. if any of the three cars were not driven by the keeper they are not liable to pay the PCN only the driver is.  as long as they do not divulge who was driving those lovely people at Alliance haven't a hope of winning against them in Court. What a shame. However while those keepers who were not driving are in the clear all is not lost for the other keeper drivers. Alliance still have to prove who was driving which is difficult providing those keepers do not appeal.  It is quite often that on appeal the keeper may say "I entered the car park at....."  immediately giving away that they were the driver. Plus even if you appeal it won't be accepted as a] they lose £100 straight away and b] mostly all the major car parking companies are dishonest scrotes. In the meantime you will be on the receiving end of threatening letters from Alliance, unregulated debt collectors and fifth, sixth or even lower rated solicitors all trying to frighten the life out of you to cough up. They can all be safely ignored since if you don't contact any of them they don't know who was driving so have no information that the can use in Court to identify the driver. Some time in the future they may send you a Letter of Claim which must not be ignored. Just let us know and we will advise a suitable snotty letter to send them which will show that you are not afraid of them and are happy to turn up in court knowing that you will win. Sorry it was a bit long winded.  
    • He’s still At it from a bungalow on Haslingden Road. Changed name to Bamberbridge cars with a Preston based phone number (01772) but dodgy dealings at the bungalow are still a go.
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Help with DCA.


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Hi, A couple of weeks ago i found out my wife was paying a DCA for an old C.Card debt by D.Debit on my behalf. As the debt doesent show on my Credit File i told her to stop paying whilst i sent them a request for a CCA along with the £1 p.o.

I have received a couple of letters from them as well as phone calls whilst waiting for my CCA and i have just received this letter in response;

 

 

Dear Mr XXXX.

We write in reply to your lette datted 23.4.09.

 

We confirm we have requested a copy of your agreement with our client although this document may no longer be available in view of the age of the debt.

 

However you will be fully aware that your ac**** was transfered to this office in January 2004 as a result of your default in your agreement with the Bank and in order to assist you in avoiding legal proceedings we agreed to accept repayments by instalments

 

Liability has been admitted and in the absence of any dispute, should your default continue we will have no aternative other than to assume that you are deliberately trying to avoid repayment of your debt.

 

We look forward to hearing from you.

 

I would be grateful for any advice on the best way to go with this. As i am sure the debt is older than 6 years and my wfe decided to pay because of all their threats.

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Do you think there has been a clear 6 year gap in the debts history where there was no payments or written acknowlegement of the debt?

 

UF

I am rarely around these parts any more. I only stop by when something has come to my attention that has sufficiently annoyed me so as to persuade me to awake from my nap and put in my two pence.

 

I am a final year law student; I am NOT an expert in law. All of my posts are just my opinion. I cannot be held responsible for any outcome whatsoever resulting from any person following the opinions or information contained within my posts. Always seek professional legal advice from a qualified lawyer.

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Hi,

 

It's more than likely this debt will be Statute Barred, if no payment or acknowledgement of this debt was made for a period of 6 years, then it makes no odds whether your wife made payments to it or not, the debt will be Statute Barred and there's nothing anyone can do to un-statute barr it.

 

If your sure there has been a period of 6 years without payment to the debt, I would send letter 'M' from the library...........

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt-issues/20758-creditors-dcas-letter-templates.html

 

Send recorded and don't sign it.

 

Once you tell them you are not willing to pay this debt, that should be the end of the matter.

 

Regards.

 

Scott.

Any advice I give is honest and in good faith.:)

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Do you think there has been a clear 6 year gap in the debts history where there was no payments or written acknowlegement of the debt?

 

UF

 

I dont think that there has been a 6 year gap between starting repayments and the original default. I have not been contacted by the Bank and i am in good standing with them now ad there is no ref on my credit file, which leads me to think they have written it off and are not getting the money my wife is paying.

 

B

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I dont think that there has been a 6 year gap between starting repayments and the original default. I have not been contacted by the Bank and i am in good standing with them now ad there is no ref on my credit file, which leads me to think they have written it off and are not getting the money my wife is paying.

 

B

 

What often happens is that the bank will sell the debt to a DCA, in which case the bank personally couldn't give two hoots what happens with it and would have no reason to record things on your credit rating.

 

For a debt to be statute barred, there has to be a clear 6 year gap where no payment or acknowlegement has been made.

 

However, your request for a cca is still perfectly legal and this company will know that if they take you to court they are bound by the CPR to produce a copy of the agreement.

 

Furthermore, the Consumer Credit Act is clear when it states that a debt cannot be enforced whilst in default of a request for a copy of the executed agreement under the act.

 

In my opinion they are p**sing into the wind and they know it.

 

I should fire off the Dispute letter when the time comes and then let them rot in their own filth. :)

 

UF

I am rarely around these parts any more. I only stop by when something has come to my attention that has sufficiently annoyed me so as to persuade me to awake from my nap and put in my two pence.

 

I am a final year law student; I am NOT an expert in law. All of my posts are just my opinion. I cannot be held responsible for any outcome whatsoever resulting from any person following the opinions or information contained within my posts. Always seek professional legal advice from a qualified lawyer.

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What often happens is that the bank will sell the debt to a DCA, in which case the bank personally couldn't give two hoots what happens with it and would have no reason to record things on your credit rating.

 

For a debt to be statute barred, there has to be a clear 6 year gap where no payment or acknowlegement has been made.

 

However, your request for a cca is still perfectly legal and this company will know that if they take you to court they are bound by the CPR to produce a copy of the agreement.

 

Furthermore, the Consumer Credit Act is clear when it states that a debt cannot be enforced whilst in default of a request for a copy of the executed agreement under the act.

 

In my opinion they are p**sing into the wind and they know it.

 

I should fire off the Dispute letter when the time comes and then let them rot in their own filth. :)

 

UF

 

Thats what i thought, even though my wife has been paying in the meantime i still have a right to a CCA and that they will have to produce one if they decide to take me to court. Their were three people at my address at the time all with the same initials and surname (all family)so i need to know if iot was me. They seem to say payment to them acknowldges the debt, but i doubt if the Bank has ever received a penny.

It was originally for £2k and the balance is now less than £200. I think they have had enough of my wifes money.

B.

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Thats what i thought, even though my wife has been paying in the meantime i still have a right to a CCA and that they will have to produce one if they decide to take me to court. Their were three people at my address at the time all with the same initials and surname (all family)so i need to know if iot was me. They seem to say payment to them acknowldges the debt, but i doubt if the Bank has ever received a penny.

It was originally for £2k and the balance is now less than £200. I think they have had enough of my wifes money.

B.

 

If it is a case of an absolute assignment, under which the DCA have bought the debt outright, then the bank will not have received any money after having sold it.

 

But you are right, you're wife having paid to them does not remove their obligation to fulfil your cca request. If I were in your position, I would fire off the dispute letter, telling them in no uncertain terms where to go until they fulfil your request.

 

If they threaten you with court again and, more importantly, make further statements that they can do this even without a cca then I would be sending them a very strongly worded letter bringing to their attention the sections of the CPR that show that they would need the document, as well as the CPUTR 2008. ;)

 

I would also at that stage be compaining to the OFT, Trading Standards, the SRA and your MP. :D

 

My view is, as stated before, that they are up the proverbial creek without an instrument with which to propel their craft!! :p

 

 

I am not a legal expert and I have no legal training. All of my posts are just my opinion and I cannot be held responsible for their accuracy or the way in which the information etc is used.

I am rarely around these parts any more. I only stop by when something has come to my attention that has sufficiently annoyed me so as to persuade me to awake from my nap and put in my two pence.

 

I am a final year law student; I am NOT an expert in law. All of my posts are just my opinion. I cannot be held responsible for any outcome whatsoever resulting from any person following the opinions or information contained within my posts. Always seek professional legal advice from a qualified lawyer.

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Hi,

 

It's more than likely this debt will be Statute Barred, if no payment or acknowledgement of this debt was made for a period of 6 years, then it makes no odds whether your wife made payments to it or not, the debt will be Statute Barred and there's nothing anyone can do to un-statute barr it.

 

If your sure there has been a period of 6 years without payment to the debt, I would send letter 'M' from the library...........

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt-issues/20758-creditors-dcas-letter-templates.html

 

Send recorded and don't sign it.

 

 

 

Once you tell them you are not willing to pay this debt, that should be the end of the matter.

 

Regards.

 

Scott.

 

Thanks Scott, but there has been no payment to or contact from the original creditor. Does your post apply if payment has been made to a DCA.

Thanks B.

If I have been helpful please tickle my scales or better still contribute to CAG.

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A payment to a DCA would still count as acknowlegement in respect of the Limitation Act 1980.

 

For a debt to be statute barred there actually has to be a period in the debt's history where you can see 6 years where absolutely no payment or written acknowlegement has been made.

 

However, if there was a period of six year where there was no payment or acknowlegement BEFORE your wife started to pay again, then the debt remains statute barred. Once a debt has become statute barred, it cannot become un-statute barred.

 

Hope this helps clear things up for you somewhat. :)

UF

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I am rarely around these parts any more. I only stop by when something has come to my attention that has sufficiently annoyed me so as to persuade me to awake from my nap and put in my two pence.

 

I am a final year law student; I am NOT an expert in law. All of my posts are just my opinion. I cannot be held responsible for any outcome whatsoever resulting from any person following the opinions or information contained within my posts. Always seek professional legal advice from a qualified lawyer.

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A payment to a DCA would still count as acknowlegement in respect of the Limitation Act 1980.

 

For a debt to be statute barred there actually has to be a period in the debt's history where you can see 6 years where absolutely no payment or written acknowlegement has been made.

 

However, if there was a period of six year where there was no payment or acknowlegement BEFORE your wife started to pay again, then the debt remains statute barred. Once a debt has become statute barred, it cannot become un-statute barred.

 

Hope this helps clear things up for you somewhat. :)

UF

 

Thanks for that UF, so it seems that even without a CCA they can make me pay and i will have to start making the payments again.

B

If I have been helpful please tickle my scales or better still contribute to CAG.

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Thanks for that UF, so it seems that even without a CCA they can make me pay and i will have to start making the payments again.

B

 

NO!!!!!!

 

 

I'm afraid we seem to have crossed wires here. There are two issues that the OP raised; firstly the issue of a cca request and secondly the issue of statute barred.

 

Although it sounds like the debt may not be statute barred, the DCA are still legally required to provide you, on request, a true copy of the executed credit agreement. Once they have passed the 12 + 2 days from the date of your request, the account enters default; thus rendering the account unenforcable whilst that default continues.

 

I think you should fire off the dispute letter (cca dispute) and then see what happends. At the end of the day the general consensus is that NO CCA = NO ENFORCABLE AGREEMENT!!!!

 

The fact that payments have been made is only relevant to the statute barred side of things.

 

I hope this has cleared a few things up for you :)

 

UF

 

I am not a legal expert and I have no legal training. All of my posts are just my opinion and I cannot be held responsible for their accuracy or the way in which the information etc is used.

I am rarely around these parts any more. I only stop by when something has come to my attention that has sufficiently annoyed me so as to persuade me to awake from my nap and put in my two pence.

 

I am a final year law student; I am NOT an expert in law. All of my posts are just my opinion. I cannot be held responsible for any outcome whatsoever resulting from any person following the opinions or information contained within my posts. Always seek professional legal advice from a qualified lawyer.

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NO!!!!!!

 

 

I'm afraid we seem to have crossed wires here. There are two issues that the OP raised; firstly the issue of a cca request and secondly the issue of statute barred.

 

Although it sounds like the debt may not be statute barred, the DCA are still legally required to provide you, on request, a true copy of the executed credit agreement. Once they have passed the 12 + 2 days from the date of your request, the account enters default; thus rendering the account unenforcable whilst that default continues.

 

I think you should fire off the dispute letter (cca dispute) and then see what happends. At the end of the day the general consensus is that NO CCA = NO ENFORCABLE AGREEMENT!!!!

 

The fact that payments have been made is only relevant to the statute barred side of things.

 

I hope this has cleared a few things up for you :)

 

UF

 

I am not a legal expert and I have no legal training. All of my posts are just my opinion and I cannot be held responsible for their accuracy or the way in which the information etc is used.

 

Thanks UF, thats exactly what i was thinking. No CCA-No Debt. because they will have to produce it eventually, unless they try to say "payment is acknowledgement" (Damm i'm furious that they have already had nearly £2K. and i am gonna fight the other £200.

I will check te dates that they signed for my request and fire off the "Dispute Letter". Is there a link to the letter that i should send.

Thanks,B.

If I have been helpful please tickle my scales or better still contribute to CAG.

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I think the other thing that we need to establish is - who is the DCA and who is their client. Their letter would usually tell you who it was...

 

Can I ask how much is involved

 

As everyone else points out you need to start off with the agreement...

If I've helped feel free to add to my reputation.

 

I am not a Practising Lawyer. My comments are my opinion only. You should not rely upon those comments and should always take your own professional advice from a practising Solicitor or Barrister

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I think the other thing that we need to establish is - who is the DCA and who is their client. Their letter would usually tell you who it was...

 

Can I ask how much is involved

 

As everyone else points out you need to start off with the agreement...

 

Hi, the OC was Lloyds Bank (now Lloyds-TSB). And the DCA is "Credit Security Ltd". The original debt was for just over £2k and the balance is less than £200.

B.

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Thanks UF, thats exactly what i was thinking. No CCA-No Debt. because they will have to produce it eventually, unless they try to say "payment is acknowledgement" (Damm i'm furious that they have already had nearly £2K. and i am gonna fight the other £200.

I will check te dates that they signed for my request and fire off the "Dispute Letter". Is there a link to the letter that i should send.

Thanks,B.

 

 

I found this kicking about on a couple of other threads:

 

I DO NOT ACKNOWLEGE ANY DEBT TO YOUR COMPANY OR

ANY COMPANY YOU PURPORT TO REPRESENT

 

ACCOUNT IN DISPUTE

 

 

Ref:

 

 

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

 

 

Thank you for your letter of xx/xx/xx, the contents of which have been noted.

 

You have failed to respond to my legal request to supply me a true copy of the original Consumer Credit Agreement for the above account.

On **DATE** I made a formal request for a true signed agreement for the alleged account under consumer credit Act 1974 s77/8. A copy of which is enclosed for your perusal and ease of reference.

You have failed to comply with my request, and as such the account entered default on **DATE**.(12+2 days after you sent the CCA request)

The document that you are obliged to send me is a true copy of the executed agreement that contained all of the prescribed terms, all other required terms and statutory notices and was signed by both your company and myself as defined in section 61(1) of CCA 74 and subsequent Statutory Instruments. If the executed agreement contained any reference to any other document, you are also obliged to send me a copy of that document.In addition a full statement of this account should have been sent to me detailing all debits and credits to the account.

 

Furthermore;

 

You are aware that the Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for a request for a true copy of a credit agreement to be carried out before your client enters into a default situation.

This limit has expired

 

As you are no doubt aware section 77(6) states:

 

If the creditor fails to comply with Subsection (1)(a) He is not entitled , while the default continues, to enforce the agreement.Therefore this account has become unenforceable at law.

 

As you have Failed to comply with a lawful request for a true, signed copy of the said agreement and other relevant documents mentioned in it, Failed to send a full statement of the account and Failed to provide any of the documentation requested.

Consequentially any legal action you pursue will be averred as both UNLAWFUL and VEXATIOUS.

 

Furthermore I shall counterclaim that any such action constitutes unlawful harassment.

 

Please note you may also consider this letter as a statutory notice under section 10 of the Data Protection Act to cease processing any data in relation to this account with immediate effect.

This means you must remove all information regarding this account from your own internal records and from my records with any credit reference agencies.

 

Should you refuse to comply, you must within 21 days provide me with a detailed breakdown of your reasoning behind continuing to process my data.

It is not sufficient to simply state that you have a ‘legal right’; You must outline your reasoning in this matter and state upon which legislation this reasoning depends.

Should you not respond within 14 days I expect that this means you agree to remove all such data.

Furthermore you should be aware that a creditor is not permitted to take ANY action against an account whilst it remains in dispute.

The lack of a credit agreement is a very clear dispute and as such the following applies.

 

* You may not demand any payment on the account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.

* You may not add further interest or any charges to the account.

* You may not pass the account to a third party.

* You may not register any information in respect of the account with any credit reference agency.

* You may not issue a default notice related to the account.

 

I reserve the right to report your actions to any such regulatory authorities as I see fit. You have 14 days from receiving this letter to contact me with your intentions to resolve this matter which is now a formal complaint. I therefore request a copy of your official complaints procedure which you are obliged to supply.

I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter.

I look forward to hearing from you in writing.

 

 

Yours faithfully,

 

I am not a legal expert and I have no legal training. All of my posts are just my opinion and I cannot be held responsible for their accuracy or the way in which the information etc is used.

I am rarely around these parts any more. I only stop by when something has come to my attention that has sufficiently annoyed me so as to persuade me to awake from my nap and put in my two pence.

 

I am a final year law student; I am NOT an expert in law. All of my posts are just my opinion. I cannot be held responsible for any outcome whatsoever resulting from any person following the opinions or information contained within my posts. Always seek professional legal advice from a qualified lawyer.

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Hi, the OC was Lloyds Bank (now Lloyds-TSB). And the DCA is "Credit Security Ltd". The original debt was for just over £2k and the balance is less than £200.

B.

 

Have they said who their client is?

 

I agree with UF - send them the account in dispute letter

 

I have a suspicion that its' going to turn out to be unenforceable...do you remember when you first applied for the card

If I've helped feel free to add to my reputation.

 

I am not a Practising Lawyer. My comments are my opinion only. You should not rely upon those comments and should always take your own professional advice from a practising Solicitor or Barrister

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I dont understand what you mean by "their client", surely it's the bank? Or am i missing something?

I cant remember when i applied, but i am sure it's over 6 years.

B.

Edited by boswell
missing info

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I dont understand what you mean by "their client", surely it's the bank? Or am i missing something?

I cant remember when i applied, but i am sure it's over 6 years.

B.

 

I think some of the other posters suggested that the account may have been assuigned (sold) to a DCA - which would explain why the bank had "written it off"

If I've helped feel free to add to my reputation.

 

I am not a Practising Lawyer. My comments are my opinion only. You should not rely upon those comments and should always take your own professional advice from a practising Solicitor or Barrister

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I think some of the other posters suggested that the account may have been assuigned (sold) to a DCA - which would explain why the bank had "written it off"

 

As i have previously said, i have had no contact from the bank regarding this debt and i even have credit cards with them now, so i am sure they have no record of it.

If I have been helpful please tickle my scales or better still contribute to CAG.

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