BOS/Halifax

[joemay]

Hi Joemay..

 

I may be wrong, but I don't think the test case applies to this...

 

I am just a few steps ahead of you with my one and am currently in the process of defending the claim.

 

I received a notice of intended litigation from them before xmas and hot on its heels was a nice claim form..

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/204655-spam-merry-christmas-halifax-4.html.

 

I would advocate 'wait and see' at this stage... but as Halifax are now 'Lloyds TSB' it is likely that **** will get involved and they have the tendancy to try the patience of a saint...

 

You would appear to have an excellent case to defend but it is very likely they will try and convince you otherwise.... also **** are avid readers of these threads and are known to try and use the posts on them as evidence....

 

Good Luck..

 

Spam.

 

Hey Spam,

 

Just had a quick look at your thread - As they've sent NOTICE OF INTENDED COURT ACTION should I send of a CPR and if so which one should it be? Wow my brain is like a sieve.

 

Also who is **** haven't heard of them:oops:

[diddydicky]

Hi Guys,

 

Haven't been around for a while - OHs health has been more of a priority.

 

Anyhow, wrote to Halifax informing them discreetly that they had rescinded the account and that they were behaving despicably considering health issues. They responded stating they can't see how they've rescinded and the debt is still owing. Also got them to confirm that the cc account wasn't in my name which they had originally tried to suggest.

 

OH has now received a notice of intended court action.

 

I'm a little confused these days as I know there have been test cases going on and it looks as if the goal posts have been moved for us the consumer, not in our favour it would appear.

 

Just to summarise:

OH has been sent a copy of merely an "application form" with sig.

No original T & Cs

Default notice issued only allowing 13 days

Letter confirming that account was terminated before a proper DN was issued.

 

Where does he stand and could someone explain if the test case has made a difference, do I have to go back and re-learn anything.

 

Finally what should he do? Any advise is as always greatly appreciated.

 

Thanks & regards

 

they have failed to comply with s78 and are prevented from enforcement until they do so

 

issuing proceedings (demanding the full balance) will be a 2nd attempt (not counting a faulty dn) at unlawful repudiation

[joemay]

they have failed to comply with s78 and are prevented from enforcement until they do so

 

issuing proceedings (demanding the full balance) will be a 2nd attempt (not counting a faulty dn) at unlawful repudiation

 

Hey DD,

 

Thanks for looking in.

 

Have you had any response regarding your unlawful repudiation lately?

[lexis200]

Hey Spam,

 

Just had a quick look at your thread - As they've sent NOTICE OF INTENDED COURT ACTION should I send of a CPR and if so which one should it be? Wow my brain is like a sieve.

 

Also who is **** haven't heard of them:oops:

 

Lloyds in-house collection Agents - Sechari, Clark and Mitchell if memory serves (haven't had anything from them for a couple of years). Amusingly they can be shortened to [problem] and the natural progression given their tactics is ****

[diddydicky]

Hey DD,

 

Thanks for looking in.

 

Have you had any response regarding your unlawful repudiation lately?

 

nope aq' s are taking forever and i just changed my mind (again) and am just preparing a strike out application (short and sweet)

[diddydicky]

Lloyds in-house collection Agents - Sechari, Clark and Mitchell if memory serves (haven't had anything from them for a couple of years). Amusingly they can be shortened to [problem] and the natural progression given their tactics is ****

 

RECORDED DELIVERY

 

Request for copies of documents

(Civil Procedure Rules 1998: Pre-Action Protocols)

 

Dear Sirs

Account/Reference*[1234 5678 8765 4321]*(IN DISPUTE)

Your letter dated***DATE***(received***DATE**) says your client has instructed you to commence court proceedings against me without delay, and that papers are being prepared for action at my local court to seek a judgement against me.

 

As you know, I have long since requested from your client, under both the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (“CCA 74”) and the Data Protection Act 1998, evidence of the agreement to which both you and your client allege I am a party. To date your client has failed to supply any such evidence, but instead tried to persuade me that providing a copy of an application form discharges your client from further obligations under section 78 of CCA 74. Conversely, I have explained that a copy of a mere application form is not a lawful substitute for a true copy of the executed agreement as required by CCA 74 s.78 and prescribed by Regulation 3 of the Consumer Credit (Cancellation Notices and Copies of Documents) Regulations 1983 (“CNCD 83”).

 

I remind you that CCA 74 s.78(6) provides that whilst a creditor is in default of a request made under sub-section (1) it may not enforce the alleged agreement.

 

Notwithstanding the above and your client's persistent, unexplained and wilful refusal to supply a copy of an executed agreement in accordance with its obligations (the permitted omissions under CNCD 83 Reg.3(2) excepted), you have made plain your client’s intention to begin legal proceedings against me. Consequently this matter is now subject to the*Civil Procedure*Rules and your letter appears to be intended as a “letter before claim”, despite not complying with the Pre-Action Conduct protocol.

 

Therefore take notice that, I request you supply to me within 14 days true copies of the following documents:

1) the executed credit agreement incorporating prescribed notices, terms and conditions applicable at the time the agreement was executed, and

2) any further or subsequent notices, terms and conditions relied on.

 

If you are unable to supply these documents please confirm discontinuance of your client’s claim.

 

Take note that this request is not made under either CCA 74 or Data Protection Act 98. It is under Annex A paragraph 4.2(7) of the CPR Pre-Action Conduct protocol, for a copy of alleged documents which I believe are relevant but do not have.

 

Should you ignore this request, I shall in due course make another under CPR 27 or 31.15, as appropriate. If you fail to comply with that request, I will ask the court to strike out your client's claim as an abuse of process due to lack of reasonable grounds, or at least order proceedings be stayed pending provision of the requisite documents. The application will refer to this and previous document requests, and apply for costs.

 

FOR THE AVOIDANCE OF DOUBT, THE ABOVE SHALL NOT BE CONSTRUED AS ADMITTING THE EXISTENCE OR VALIDITY OF AN AGREEMENT WITH OR DEBT TO YOU OR ANYONE YOU CLAIM TO REPRESENT.

Yours faithfully

 

PRINT NAME, DON'T SIGN

[joemay]

Thanks Diddy great letter. I'll send this off to Bloody Orrible & Snotty and await their response.

[joemay]

Diddy,

 

I have a question. I know this is going over old ground, but as the account has been rescinded, OH shouldn't really be stating that the account is in dispute because he has accepted their unlawful repudiation.

 

Does this letter need adjusting or just take out "ACCOUNT IN DISPUTE"

 

Won't send the letter til I get confirmation from you or any other knowledgeable Caggers.

 

Thanks

[diddydicky]

Diddy,

 

I have a question. I know this is going over old ground, but as the account has been rescinded, OH shouldn't really be stating that the account is in dispute because he has accepted their unlawful repudiation.

 

Does this letter need adjusting or just take out "ACCOUNT IN DISPUTE"

 

Won't send the letter til I get confirmation from you or any other knowledgeable Caggers.

 

Thanks

 

take out account in dispute - there is no account left to dispute

 

just put

 

Your ref : XXXXXXXXXXXXXXX (their letter ref or the account number they state on their letter

 

OR you could put

 

Re Terminated agreement

[joemay]

Hi Joemay

 

If you have a look at my BOS threads you'll find OH was issued NIP's on both. Anyway, CitB and X20 sorted out a letter for me to gain sight of the documents they'd be using in court under the Civil Procedure Rules.

 

From memory I sent one to one account in Nov '08 and one to the other in Mar '09. Neither have replied, they've ignored me when I've queried it and essentially shown categorically that they have no teeth and are just trying it on.

 

OH has been passed from DCA to DCA, all who are seen off with one or two letters, but BOS have not tried the court route again because (I believe) their bluff was called.

 

You're welcome to use the letter if you like to see if it helps. I think it's on my BOS dodgy CCA thread on about page 5.

 

edit - just re-read spam's post and it's possible things have changed since they issued OH's as it's now part of Lloyds. Not sure if that makes a difference to whether or not you should press on with the CPR letter which is what I was advised to do...?

 

Hi Lexis200,

 

Wow you've been busy. I'm not being lazy or anything but I can't seem to find the letter you are referring to, would it be possible if you could point me to the post or even the thread as I notice there are a couple of Halifax threads.

 

Thanks a million

Regards,

Joemay

[lexis200]

Hi Joemay

 

No worries, I've just looked and it was nowhere near where I said:)

 

Anyway http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/show-post/post-1800199.html should be the link to it. It's by x20 so I have no worries as to it's content, and if it helps you that's great.

[joemay]

Hi Joemay

 

No worries, I've just looked and it was nowhere near where I said:)

 

Anyway http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/show-post/post-1800199.html should be the link to it. It's by x20 so I have no worries as to it's content, and if it helps you that's great.

 

Thanks Lexis200 - Your a star! I shall have a look at it.

 

BTW love your avatar:) Reminds me of a cat I had years ago

[lexis200]

Had a penchant for fruit hats did it?

[Undercover-Elsa]

Reminds me of a sheepdog I had years ago, he always looked sad, or should I say melon-collie?

Arghhhhh!

I'm so so sorry...

[lexis200]

So you should be!

[Undercover-Elsa]

[lexis200]

You're forgiven:)

[joemay]

Does anyone know who is Robinson Way - Do they get passed Bloody orrible & snotty accts or is it Links?

[lexis200]

Robby Way are an (in my experience) easily seen off DCA. They've popped up on both of OH's HBOS accounts that have already gone through BlairOS so must just be one of their go-to companies. I'm not sure if they deal with Links accounts too?

 

Fat lot of good they do though, as they seem to scarper the minute you look like you know what you're talking about (or in my case the minute you tell them to feck off:D)

[joemay]

Hey Elsa - you certainly are forgiven after posting that adorable dog.

[joemay]

Robby Way are an (in my experience) easily seen off DCA. They've popped up on both of OH's HBOS accounts that have already gone through BlairOS so must just be one of their go-to companies. I'm not sure if they deal with Links accounts too?

 

Fat lot of good they do though, as they seem to scarper the minute you look like you know what you're talking about (or in my case the minute you tell them to feck off:D)

 

Cheers for the lexis200, seems they like making contact via phone, not in writing, even though the OC and their henchmen have been told not to contact by phone. Cheeky barstewards. Oh we'll give them a little rope to hang themselves;)

[Undercover-Elsa]

Hey Joemay

Don't you just want to ruffle those lovely ears? LOL

Hope you're OK hon..see you're still battling!

Elsa x

[joemay]

Elsa,

Yeah battling on! I'm not bad. How you doing honey, I haven't been around for a while, so haven't had time to catch up on everyone's threads hope all's going well with your battles. Noticed your still wearing the dark specs;)

[joemay]

OK Update,

 

DD kindly posted a response letter requesting copies of documents (Civil Procedure Rules 1998: Pre-Action Protocols) in response to robbers way letter. Have now received a copy of a credit card application (signed) with no prescribed terms or terms & conditions attached from robbers way with letter "we need to hear from you with your proposal for settlement". No mention of any other documents that they would use as evidence in court.

 

To go over again

1. No CCA

2. Defective DN not enough time given with DN

3. Letter confirming account has been terminated (but no termination notice) therefore unlawful rescinded account.

 

Now my understanding is that as they haven't given the cca with prescribed terms they can not enforce by law, (they can't take to court), but they can still send the nasty letters am I right?

 

Any ideas/suggestions would be appreciated on how to respond to their letter as they haven't actually responded to my requests, regarding pre-action CPR.

 

Thanks

Joemay

[diddydicky]

well this is an open debate due to a naff judgement it would appear to be the (ridiculous) case that the creditor could commence- but not complete proceedings against you

 

the reason being that the judge ruled that the bringing of proceedings was not enforcement- yet of course obtaining judgement clearly is

 

in response to what they sent- you should re read the letter you sent to them and when the time is appropriate- you carry out the threat you made in that letter in the event that they failed to respond fully