Red V Cap1

[Red1983]

Good afternoon everyone,

Please can someone help me, I originally requested a copy of the original CCA and SAR'd Capital One on the 14th January 2009, I got a letter back a few days later telling me a was x amount in arears, baring in mind that I have been in an arrangement with since 2006, actually paying more than the mimimum each month.

Anyways, I sent them another letter reminding of them obligations under the Act, and of course telling them that the account is now in default due to noncompliance of the SAR and CCA.

I got this letter from them on 10th Febraury 2009, it reads;

Thank you for your letter requesting copy documents for your account.

You requested copies of the executed credit agreement and a statement of your account under section 78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

 

Please find enclosed a copy of your credit agreement as requested. In accordance with section 78 of the Cunsumer Credit Act 1974 and the Consumer Credit (cancellations notices and copy documents) Regulations 1983, this is your original agreement, and if any terms have been varied, then the copy agreement will include the updated terms. In addition, your PERSONAL DETAILS, THE SIGNATURE BOX

OF THE CONSUMER CREDIT REGULATIONS 1983.

 

The status of your account, as at the date of this letter, is currently open and active, and behind with payments.

 

 

blah blah blah.

 

Ok, then included is a COPY of the application form on the back of a letter that say;

 

Thank you for your recent request. Please see overleaf for the current terms of your agreement with us.

 

For the rest of your terms and conditions, please see the leaflet enclosed.

 

blah blah blah.

 

I asumed that a blank application form can not constitute for a vaild agreement, neither did they send any STATEMENTS, which I have never had inthe last two and a hlaf years, neither anything else, that was it, so I sent them this letter;

 

 

Account In Dispute

 

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

 

You have failed to respond to my legal request to supply me a true copy of the original SIGNED Consumer Credit Agreement for the above account.

On 14th January 2009I made a formal request for a true signed agreement for the alleged account under consumer credit Act 1974 s77/8. A copy of which is enclosed for your perusal and ease of reference.

 

You have failed to comply with my request, and as such the account entered default on 27th January 2009.(12+2 days after you sent the CCA request)

The document that you are obliged to send me is a true copy of the executed agreement that contained all of the prescribed terms, all other required terms and statutory notices and was signed by both your company and myself as defined in section 61(1) of CCA 74 and subsequent Statutory Instruments. If the executed agreement contained any reference to any other document, you are also obliged to send me a copy of that document. In addition a full statement of this account should have been sent to me detailing all debits and credits to the account, for which you also accepted the £10.00 postal order for.

 

Furthermore;

 

You are aware that the Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for a request for a true copy of a credit agreement to be carried out before your client enters into a default situation. This limit has expired

 

As you are no doubt aware section 77(6) states:

 

If the creditor fails to comply with Subsection (1)(a) He is not entitled , while the default continues, to enforce the agreement. Therefore this account has become unenforceable at law.

 

As you have Failed to comply with a lawful request for a true, signed copy of the said agreement and other relevant documents mentioned in it, Failed to send a full statement of the account and Failed to provide any of the documentation requested. Consequentially any legal action you pursue will be averred as both UNLAWFUL and VEXATIOUS. Furthermore I shall counterclaim that any such action constitutes unlawful harassment.

 

Please note you may also consider this letter as a statutory notice under section 10 of the Data Protection Act to cease processing any data in relation to this account with immediate effect. This means you must remove all information regarding this account from your own internal records and from my records with any credit reference agencies.

 

Should you refuse to comply, you must within 21 days provide me with a detailed breakdown of your reasoning behind continuing to process my data. It is not sufficient to simply state that you have a ‘legal right’; You must outline your reasoning in this matter and state upon which legislation this reasoning depends. Should you not respond within 14 days I expect that this means you agree to remove all such data.

 

Furthermore you should be aware that a creditor is not permitted to take ANY action against an account whilst it remains in dispute.

The lack of a credit agreement is a very clear dispute and as such the following applies.

 

* You may not demand any payment on the account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.

* You may not add further interest or any charges to the account.

* You may not pass the account to a third party.

* You may not register any information in respect of the account with any credit reference agency.

* You may not issue a default notice related to the account.

 

I reserve the right to report your actions to any such regulatory authorities as I see fit, including but not exhaustively, FOS, FSA, OFT, TS and the ICO. You have 14 days from receiving this letter to contact me with your intentions to resolve this matter which is now a formal complaint. I therefore request a copy of your official complaints procedure which you are obliged to supply.

 

I would also like to bring to your attention that although you state that I am xxx.xx in arrears with the account, I have been in a repayment arrangement with you since 2006, and have paid and increased payments as when I could. I believe that I have also increased my monthly payments to exceed the NORMAL minimum monthly payment if my card was still active.

You write to tell me that the account is open and active; however I have previous correspondence from you that states contrary to this statement.

In regards to you stating that I am behind with payments, this too is incorrect, as I have bank statements to prove otherwise.

 

I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter.

I look forward to hearing from you in writing.

 

 

Yours faithfully,

 

 

 

I then get this letter TODAY AND I AM PETRIFIED AND FURIOUS AND CONFUSED TO THE HEAVENS:

 

Thank you for writing back to me about your request for us to provide you with a true copy of your credit agreement.

We sent you the correct documentation for your Subject Acces Request under the Data Protection Act 1998. This inculded screen shots of your accoutn and all statements.

 

As I've already explained, in accordance with section 78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 and the Consumer Credit (Cancellation Notices and Copy Documents( Regulations 1983, we've provided you with a copy of your original agreement, and if any terms have been varied, then the copy agreement will include the updated terms. In addition, your personal details, the signature box signature and date of signature were omitted from the copy provided as permitted under Regulation 3 of the Consumer Credit Regulations 1983.

 

You clearly have a valid and enforceable credit agreement with Capital One, as evidence by these documents and any claim to the contrary will be strongly defended.

 

Your account status remains behind with payments and the balance currently due and payable is xxx.xx

It is important that you maintain payments as your account balance consists of transactions that you have made. Faliure to do this may result in negative information being recorded on your credit file, which may affect your ability to gain credit in the future.

Again, we will continue to pursue the outstanding debt and do not consider this account to be in dispute, therefore would remind you that you are bound by the terms and conditions of your credit agreement and you are obliged to maintain payments and repay your outstanding balance. If proceedings were commenced by you, on the basis that there is no enforceable agreement between Capital One and you, we would strongly defend this.

 

Financial Regulations requsire me to advise you that this is my final response in relation to this matter. However, you now have the option to contact the Financial Ombudsman Service within six months from the date fo this letter. Thier contact details are in our complaints leaflet, which I have included with this letter.

 

Yours sincerely blah blah blinking blah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

 

 

 

 

Please can someone help me, THEY HAVE NOT sent me a credit agreement, and cos they wont send it I dont actually know if they have one, not only this, THEY HAVE NOT sent me any statements, though they say that they did, they really really didnt!

Please can someone help me, please please please.

And if I go to the FOS, do I even have a case, all I wanted was the information form them, I cant even check that what they say we owe is true cos they wont send me any statements, this is the OC, so like, what the hell is going on!!!!!!!?????????

 

Please help

 

Red

Edited February 13, 2009 by Red1983
Had entered perosnal details by mistake

[kiptower]

take out name / address etc and anything that can identify you as soon as possible

[mr.ton]

Remove your personal details ASAP or can 1 of the mods do it please?

[Red1983]

Gosh I completly forgot about that, thank you.

xxx

[mr.ton]

Well done..you never know who our "guest" could be

[Red1983]

Done, thank you, I forgot about that, and that you CAN TRUST NO ONE!

[mr.ton]

On here you can trust all the regulars etc...its just that the DCA's trawl through this site for whatever info they can

[Red1983]

Ok cool, thank you, im a bit of a newbie, and to be fair, I am petrified that I have dug myself a bigger hole, then I was in, but I can't help but hink, every time I get scared and they send letters like this, that Hang on a minute, I have a right to know what they have on me, if nothing else, and as far as they ar concernced, I just want the info, and actually need it. How can I plan to sort our debts out if they dont send me up to date current infformation, ya know?

 

xxxx

[Red1983]

On here you can trust all the regulars etc...its just that the DCA's trawl through this site for whatever info they can

 

 

 

Loving the cat by the way

[mr.ton]

Loving the cat by the way

 

That was all Clemma's fault...it was done just to annoy her, i just havent got round to changing it yet

[Red1983]

That was all Clemma's fault...it was done just to annoy her, i just havent got round to changing it yet

 

 

No leave the cat, its cool.

Any ideas on the above prob?

 

Red:p

[Shawn0109]

Let me take a shot at this did they send you one of them crappy application things in the post that you filled in and they are trying to pass it of as the Credit Agreement?

[mr.ton]

As far as your thread is concerned...

In a nutshell - they can send you a transcript of the Gettysburg address, it matters not, as they have no legal authority over you whatsoever.

Only a county court does.

Stick around & you'll soon get the hang of things ;-)

[Red1983]

Let me take a shot at this did they send you one of them crappy application things in the post that you filled in and they are trying to pass it of as the Credit Agreement?

 

 

Yeah I think so, it is completely blank, how do I put it on here so you can see?

And actually the card was taken out 8 years ago in my maiden name, and I have paid it off twice already, but then of course went to the limit again, and fell into bad circumstances, and have been paying what i can for the last 2 and a half years.

 

[Shawn0109]

This is correct only a county court can enforce an agreement the OC or the DCA can kick and scream as much as they want in the end it wont do them any good, they will threaten with their toilet paper letters blah blah blah, so dont be getting panic stricken about it, they havent complied with your CCA request so the account it sounds is totally in dispute.

[Red1983]

As far as your thread is concerned...

In a nutshell - they can send you a transcript of the Gettysburg address, it matters not, as they have no legal authority over you whatsoever.

Only a county court does.

Stick around & you'll soon get the hang of things ;-)

 

 

Ok, so if it goes to court, surely a judge is bound to say that "well, you have been paying monies to the account surely you know you have an agreement therefore the debt stand and oh by the way heres another 500 of court costs!!!!! (sorry... bad day....8-))

Do you think that I should stop paying them then, as surely the account is in default whether they say it is or accept it or not.

 

xxxx

[Red1983]

This is correct only a county court can enforce an agreement the OC or the DCA can kick and scream as much as they want in the end it wont do them any good, they will threaten with their toilet paper letters blah blah blah, so dont be getting panic stricken about it, they havent complied with your CCA request so the account it sounds is totally in dispute.

 

Ok, shawn, thank you, do you think that I should then proceed to report them to the FOS?

Do you think that they will pursue court action, as the amount is half of a thousand?

 

xxx

[Shawn0109]

If you can scan the application form for us taking out all personal information we can take a look, are there any terms and conditions enclosed with this when you got it from them? And yes I would be reporting them to the FOS because they will investigate it for you if you have had a unsatisfactory response from Cap One which to me you have, tell them all the information you have and that they havent complied with your request of a CCA, have there been any penalty charges included in this debt?

[havinastella]

Hi Red,

 

Firstly under a CCA request, the lender can satisfy your request by sending you almost anything. This does not mean they can enforce the debt.

 

How much (roughly) is owing on the account and would there be any late payments/over limit payments on the account?

 

Jogs

[mr.ton]

Ok, so if it goes to court, surely a judge is bound to say that "well, you have been paying monies to the account surely you know you have an agreement therefore the debt stand and oh by the way heres another 500 of court costs!!!!! (sorry... bad day....8-))

Do you think that I should stop paying them then, as surely the account is in default whether they say it is or accept it or not.

xxxx

 

Not necessarily..you could have been paying under false pretences/deception/threats etc...(its a legal minefield out there ;-))

Any company that takes you to the county court it costs them money to do so.

If its decided that you do owe the money (which is the worst that can happen) then the court has to take into account all your essential outgoings like bills/food/clothes/travel costs...so if there's nothing left then legally you can just pay £1 per month.

Not sure how many years a thousand pounds is at that rate?

[Red1983]

If you can scan the application form for us taking out all personal information we can take a look, are there any terms and conditions enclosed with this when you got it from them? And yes I would be reporting them to the FOS because they will investigate it for you if you have had a unsatisfactory response from Cap One which to me you have, tell them all the information you have and that they havent complied with your request of a CCA, have there been any penalty charges included in this debt?

 

Hi Red,

 

Firstly under a CCA request, the lender can satisfy your request by sending you almost anything. This does not mean they can enforce the debt.

 

How much (roughly) is owing on the account and would there be any late payments/over limit payments on the account?

 

Jogs

 

 

The debt is approx half of a thousand, although have defaulted me two and a half years, ago, I have never missed a payment, always paid them first arranged, and I dont know if any charges apply cos they wont send me any statements.

 

I will try and scan what they sent me, how do I attach it on here?

[Conniff]

Tell them until they prove you have an contract with them no more payments will be forthcoming.

[Red1983]

Not necessarily..you could have been paying under false pretences/deception/threats etc...(its a legal minefield out there ;-))

Any company that takes you to the county court it costs them money to do so.

If its decided that you do owe the money (which is the worst that can happen) then the court has to take into account all your essential outgoings like bills/food/clothes/travel costs...so if there's nothing left then legally you can just pay £1 per month.

Not sure how many years a thousand pounds is at that rate?

 

Thank you Mr. Cat Man, loving you right now!

I will make a note of that, what I am scared of with the courts thing is that we have 1 ccj, and I am afraid that a judge will see all that we owe and force us into bankruptcy, though nothing is secured on our house, which is probably the only wise decision i have EVER made.

xxxx

[Red1983]

Just trying to scan doc.

[mr.ton]

Thank you Mr. Cat Man, loving you right now!

I will make a note of that, what I am scared of with the courts thing is that we have 1 ccj, and I am afraid that a judge will see all that we owe and force us into bankruptcy, though nothing is secured on our house, which is probably the only wise decision i have EVER made.

xxxx

 

I have a million CCJ's & none of them ever come to light when i go back to court - its just another 1 added to the list

Losing your home is a very last resort.

It will have gone through many legal proceedures/something being sorted out before it ever got to that stage.

I sure wont love you if you call me Mr Cat man again