MBNA debt bought by Link - don't know what to do - can anyone help please?

[the_shadow]

Blatent bump to see if anyone can shed light on selling an account prior to the end of the default remedy date they specified let alone the correct default remedy date allowing for service.

[Massamum]

Hi 42man, thanks for that - the agreement was early 2007 (February) – does that make a difference?

 

 

Thanks for all your help PmW, also for the bumps

 

I still haven’t contacted Link as I wanted to get them to prove they own the debt. Its been a while since they sent the NOA and I’m getting a bit worried it’ll make things worse if I continue to ignore them, but I don’t want to do the wrong thing!!! Should I contact them? Does anyone know of a template letter I could use?

 

Thanks in advance.

[diamondgirl]

Link are very presumptuous with their letter. Have you had anything from MBA stating they have sold the debt I only saw the default notice. I know the letter from Link states that they are the owners now but have MBA stated that they have sold the debt to them. They could just be anyone wanting money from you. Ask them to prove it - CCA them and see what they actually have. There is a template you can use. I'll see if I can find it. DO NOT SPEAK TO THEM ON THE PHONE only put things in writing and never sign your name. DG

[diamondgirl]

Think this is the write letter amend as necessary. I'm sure if it's not someone will point you in the right direction. I am only learning myself about the awful Link.

 

1 High Street,

Newtown,

Kent

R21 4RH

 

June 28, 2006

 

 

The Loan Company

Company House,

Church Street,

Newtown,

Kent,

R1 7HG

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Re:? Account/Reference Number 4563210025897412

 

This letter is a formal request pursuant to s.77/78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. I require you to provide me with a true copy of the credit agreement relating to the above account, together with any other documentation the Act requires you to provide.

 

I expect you to comply fully and properly with this request, within the statutory time limit. You are reminded that should you fail to comply with my request, the provisions of s.77 will apply.

 

If it is your view that you are not the creditor, s.175 of the CCA 1974 applies in the case of a simple assignment, and places a duty upon you to pass this request to the creditor. In the case of an absolute assignment, you are a creditor as defined by s.189. If you contend that you purchased the rights but not the duties of any agreement, you are reminded that s.189 of the Act is clear that an assignment is of both rights and duties.

 

Your attention is drawn to ss.5(2), 3(b),6 and 7 of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 (CPUTR).

 

I enclose a postal order in the sum of £1.00, which is the statutory fee. Note that these funds are not to be used for any other purpose.

 

If you are unable to comply fully and properly with this request, you should confirm this in writing at the earliest opportunity, and certainly within the statutory time limit for compliance, and return the fee.

 

We look forward to hearing from you.

 

Yours faithfully

Mr A N Other

 

Remember never sign your name, type it, print it but never sign it. DG:)

[Massamum]

Thanks DG. I’ve heard nothing from MBNA regarding Link. I’ve received many letters from them threatening “MBNA will place my account with a third party to obtain payment of the full balance” and “MBNA will sell your debt to a third party – you will no longer be an MBNA customer and the third party may apply their own fees to your debt”. But that’s all, no notice whatsoever that it has actually been sold on.

 

I’ve been reading lots of other posts in these forums and to be honest I’m even more confused than I was at the start - my head is spinning with so much info!

 

Thanks for the pm Shakey, I don’t know how to go about challenging unfair bank charges or mis-sold PPI. Is there a template letter for that???

 

I think I will CCA them, even though an online application it might slow them up a bit.

 

Any other suggestions gratefully received.

[Massamum]

Just re-reading posts and come across yours at #10 Shakey, that means if I send Link CCA I’ll be acknowledging having received the NOA??? Even though it was sent by ordinary post and not recorded.

 

 

Should I contact them or not?

 

 

 

[Massamum]

bump!

[diamondgirl]

Link don't tend to send anything recorded delivery I've not received anything like that from them. If you don't have a copy of the agreement you really could do with getting hold of one. You could then post it up and then someone more knowledgable than me would be able to see if it is enforceable or not. The trouble with Link is they do tend to move fast I know it's happend to me. You are not actually accepting they have bought the debt, you are requesting proof of the debt. Maybe a dispute letter may be in order. (ANYONE ANY IDEAS PLEASE)!

If you do the CCA letter make sure you put the account number on the back of the PO also put in the letter All communication must be in writing put in bold. Keep all letters and copies of what you send. Do not sign your name type it or print it but never sign it.

DG

[Massamum]

thanks for that DG. I will do that, even though it was an online application and therefore enforceable, at least I'll feel I'm doing something rather than just ignoring them. Thanks again.

[diamondgirl]

It also buys you some time Link are just a load of plonkers (think of stronger words but not allowed to post them DG:D

[Massamum]

you're right, they are that and more (much, much more). Thanks

[joemay]

Hi Massamum,

How it's going? Thought I'd let you know had a call from Link, told them we've CCA'd them. Guy got stroppy:mad: Told him to communicate in writing, he told me they can't. Asked him to just get the CCA to us and also send me copy of their complaints procudure. Am getting a little nervous, this is the first time we've been in this position and feel like a fish out of water

I read your first thread "downing in debt" and your position is very similar to ours. Now doubt people in this situation will be increasing with the way econ is at moment. Anyway hope your managing to sleep these days.

If I hear anymore from Link I'll let you know. My thread is Have MBNA/Link Mucked Up???

[Massamum]

Hi Joemay

Sleep, whats that?

What a cheek the Link guy got stroppy! That couldn’t have been nice for you, well done for standing up to him. What a load of rubbish that they can’t communicate in writing, they managed to send us both the notice of assignment without any problems. I’ve read on some posts that when DCAs call, refuse to go through the security questions so they can’t continue with the call. Worth a go. Try not to feel nervous, it sounds like you’re doing really really well.

 

 

For myself, I’ve just CCA’d Link. I know its not the greatest thing to do but at least I feel as though I’m doing something. So we shall see what comes back.

 

 

 

I was reading a good post earlier, its well worth a look – post 87 by Andyorch you may find some useful info in it.

 

 

Also, have a look at this post as it has a link to a telephone harassment letter on it, it may be worth your while sending that to them Renegotiation.

 

 

 

Stay strong.

[andyr666]

Just re-reading posts and come across yours at #10 Shakey, that means if I send Link CCA I’ll be acknowledging having received the NOA??? Even though it was sent by ordinary post and not recorded.

 

 

Should I contact them or not?

 

 

 

 

I'm by no means an expert but it appears to me that you haven't actually received a notice of assignment at all...you have only received a letter from Link claiming ownership of the "debt" . Surely a notice of assignment would have to come from MBNA (I think)

[Massamum]

I'm by no means an expert but it appears to me that you haven't actually received a notice of assignment at all...you have only received a letter from Link claiming ownership of the "debt" . Surely a notice of assignment would have to come from MBNA (I think)

 

Hi andyr666, I read on another MBNA thread that it doesn't matter whether the NOA comes from MBNA or Link, as long as one of them notifies me it means its done.

 

I haven't seen a notice of assignment before so no idea if it is a NOA or just a letter - can anyone confirm if its the notice please?

[the_shadow]

Hi andyr666, I read on another MBNA thread that it doesn't matter whether the NOA comes from MBNA or Link, as long as one of them notifies me it means its done.

 

I haven't seen a notice of assignment before so no idea if it is a NOA or just a letter - can anyone confirm if its the notice please?

 

I dont think there is a prescribed format for a NOA to be honest, can anyone confirm?

 

I would therefore assume it just has to state they are purchasing the debt from xxxx on xxx date and its regulated by the law of property act 1925.

 

S.

[andyr666]

If the NoA doesn't have to come from the OC then surely the system is open to all sorts of abuse.

[the_shadow]

If the NoA doesn't have to come from the OC then surely the system is open to all sorts of abuse.

 

Yep thats why the first letter back to them should be asking them to prove the debt (basically that they hold information on the debt and its just not a fishing excercise)

[shakespeare62]

According to the Law of Property Act 1925, section 136, the notice of assignment (NoA), doesn’t need to come from the Assignor (The original creditor aka ‘OC’). The Assignee (purchaser of the ‘debt’) can notify you of the assignment. :-

To quote from LoP 1925 s136 - (see link below) :-

Law of Property Act 1925 (c.20) - Statute Law Database

(1)Any absolute assignment by writing under the hand of the assignor (not purporting to be by way of charge only) of any debt or other legal thing in action, of which express notice in writing has been given to the debtor, trustee or other person from whom the assignor would have been entitled to claim such debt or thing in action, is effectual in law (subject to equities having priority over the right of the assignee) to pass and transfer from the date of such notice

(a)the legal right to such debt or thing in action;

(b)all legal and other remedies for the same; and

©the power to give a good discharge for the same without the concurrence of the assignor:

 

Provided that, if the debtor, trustee or other person liable in respect of such debt or thing in action has notice

(a)that the assignment is disputed by the assignor or any person claiming under him; or

(b)of any other opposing or conflicting claims to such debt or thing in action;he may, if he thinks fit, either call upon the persons making claim thereto to interplead concerning the same, or pay the debt or other thing in action into court under the provisions of the Trustee Act, 1925.

 

You will note that while the assignment is required to be under the hand of the assignor, the notice to the debtor need not be. All that is required is that the debtor has express notice of the assignment. Express notice may be given by the assignor, assignee or some third party even.

 

Good comments on the above from cagger Surfaceagentx20 (a v. experienced lawyer) can be found on this link :-

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/173676-assignment-questions.html#post1876538

1.Any assignment is not effective until you have been notified in writing.

2.According to section 196 of the Law of Property Act, the notice of assignment must be sent by recorded delivery.

Law of Property Act 1925 (c.20) - Statute Law Database

Obviously if you acknowledge receipt of a Notice of Assignment which was sent by ordinary post, then there is no need for a creditor (Debt Collection Agency etc.) to prove that it was delivered by Recorded Delivery. (Recorded Delivery now replaces Registered Post)

In terms of concerns that anyone could issue a Notice of Assignment :- a copy of the actual Deed of Assignment (the contract of sale between the original creditor and the new owner of the debt) would normally be requested by a Debtor as part of a Subject Access Request made under the Data Protection Act 1998.

Additionally, you the Debtor could also demand inspection / copy of the Deed of Assignment under Civil Procedure Rules, should the matter go to Court. The claimant would have to produce this. If you had been seriously misled regarding the NoA the claimant would be in very deep ‘sherbert’ indeed.

The Notice of Assignment must also fill certain criteria (backed by Case Law) to be valid. The date of assignment referred to in the Notice, must be the same date referred to in the Deed of Assignment. The amount of the debt and the account number must also be accurate and the name and address of the Debtor, Assignor and Assignee must be correct.

The following Court of Appeal case confirmed that an invalid date in the Notice of Assignment makes the notice ineffectual :-

WF Harrison & Co Ltd v Burke [1956] 2 All ER 169, [1956] 1 WLR 419, CA

[joemay]

"The date of assignment referred to in the Notice, must be the same date referred to in the Deed of Assignment." Can you confirm should the date of assignment be after the date "to remedy the breach" on a default notice or can it be assigned before?

[shakespeare62]

"The date of assignment referred to in the Notice, must be the same date referred to in the Deed of Assignment." Can you confirm should the date of assignment be after the date "to remedy the breach" on a default notice or can it be assigned before?

 

When I stated Notice - I meant Notice of Assignment. The Notice of Assignment will refer usually refer to a date when the assignment took place. If it does, then the date referred to, MUST be correct and match the date on the Deed of Assignment (also known as document of Assignment). If the Notice referred to a different date than in the Deed, - then it would be referring to a Non Existent Deed of Assignment.

 

In terms of Default Notice, and transferring / Assigning ownership of the debt before the Default period for remedy has expired - I'm not sure.

A debt is classed as a form of property, so I think the owner can sell his right to it whenever he wishes (contract permitting).

 

What is important is the Debtors rights are not affected. For example, if it is a credit card, then the facility to use the card is not cancelled before the Default Notice expires, or if it is a loan that the outstanding balance is not demanded beforehand...etc.

 

However If you rectify a Default Notice by paying in full the arrears before the expiry date - then you would expect to continue full use of your credit card / loan repayment by installments etc. If the original creditor pre-empts that, then maybe this would be a BREACH OF CONTRACT ..

 

Any thoughts anyone ?

[shakespeare62]

If Massamum, has replied to Link and requested a copy of the agreement, then I believe link should provide (but they won't) a copy of the PPI insurance document if it was mentioned in the credit agreement. With reference to s 78 (1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974, it is clearly stated that upon receiving a request in writing to that effect from the debtor and payment of a fee of [£1], the creditor quote :-

 

“shall give the debtor a copy of the executed agreement (if any) and of any other document referred to in it, ...”

 

If No documentation regarding the Payment Protection Cover is provided, the Section 78 request will remain unfulfilled.

[Massamum]

Hi all and thanks for your posts. Many thanks for the above Shakey, most informative. I did have PPI on the account but as I seem to remember I insisted on it “just in case” (no policy docs received though). Turned out to be a complete waste of money as the tight wads wouldn’t pay out when I did make a claim.

 

Will post up whatever Link send back, plus I'll keep any envelopes from now on as I haven't so far.

 

Getting back to assignment of the debt, I’ve been reading lots of different posts on here and I came across one tonight (my laptop crashed and I couldn’t find it again so can't quote from it:mad:). It said that if the account has been sold to a DCA that they would be given a new account number. But the number on Link’s NOA is my MBNA account number, so I’m guessing the debt hasn’t been sold to Link after all and that they are merely collecting on MBNA's behalf. Can anyone confirm if that’s correct please?

[Massamum]

in with the post this morning I received a postcard with "please call Helen urgently on ....." and "registered office: Link Financial etc". Feel sooooo embarrassed.

[diamondgirl]

Sometimes they just add a 1 to the end of the account. Link have done that I notice on a couple of letters etc., they have sent me however the last one I received from them was missing this 1. Hope they do it again cause then I have something else to use against them.

Did the card actually have Link on it, fancy, they must think you will phone them because of that. Stay well away let them write to you if they want something.

Nuts and bananas to be thrown out of their prams when you don't phone them. DG:D