CCJ action started and I need help!! Nursery Fee Debt alledgedly

[fluffycloud]

Hi I am being chased for outstanding nursery fees where by the company in question are saying I owe the two months notice period monies, this is going back to 2007.

 

The DCA Bullock & Clarke are a Limited Company but on checking the Public register at the OFT they do not appear to have a Consumer Credit Licence.

 

Surely as a DCA who haves started CCJ proceedings against me they should hold a CCL??

 

Am I right?? What can I do as I do not want a CCJ for monies I dont owe, I have not signed anywhere that says about a 2 month notice period.

 

HELP!! Its going to court soon and I want to be prepared.

[spartathisis]

I checked against a DCA chasing me on the OFT website but couldnt find anything so rang them and the gave me the licence no and when it was up for renewel. They were not new and had been trading for a while, best ring the OFT to check?

[mr.ton]

Ring trading standards as well.

[fluffycloud]

I checked against a DCA chasing me on the OFT website but couldnt find anything so rang them and the gave me the licence no and when it was up for renewel. They were not new and had been trading for a while, best ring the OFT to check?

 

Thank you

 

I called them Friday only to be told there was no CCL at that address, the registered address or in their names?

 

I need written proof or something so I can send it to the court, or maybe I am barking up the wrong tree and they dont need a CCL??

[midnightminky]

if you go to the rlp threads there is some imformative info about dcas not

having licences;)

[FunkyFox]

They do come up if you search for bullock or their licence number. Seems legit to me.

 

Application / Licence Details

 

 

 

 

Licence Number:0610011

Licence Status:Current

 

Current Applicant / Licensee:

 

Business NameCompany Registration Number Bullock & Clarke Collections Consultancy Limited

 

Categories:

 

Debt adjusting/counselling Debt collecting

 

Right To Canvass Off Trade Premises:No

 

 

Trading Name(s) (Current):

 

Collect-A-Debt

 

Issued Date: 11-Dec-2007

Expiry Date: 11-Dec-2012

 

 

Legal Formation:

 

Charity / Trade Union / Other

 

Current Individuals that run the organisation:

 

NamePosition Ms Anne Peace Ms Beth Louise Clarke Ms Carol Ann Bullock

 

Nature of Business:

 

Debt Collection

 

Current Address(es):

 

Address TypeAddress Correspondence29, Walker Street, Burton - on - Trent, Staffordshire, DE14 3PZ Principal Place Of Business56, Doveridge Road, Bridnocte Valley, BURTON-ON-TRENT, Staffordshire, DE15 9QD, United Kingdom Registered OfficeClaremont House, 223, Branston Road, Burton-on-Trent, Staffordshire, DE14 3BT

 

Historic Address(es):

 

Address TypeAddress Principal Place Of BusinessBridnocte Valley, BURTON-ON-TRENT, Staffordshire, DE15 9QD, United Kingdom

[fluffycloud]

I had nothing when I searched from their Limited Company Reg No!! The OFT man couldnt find them either!

[FunkyFox]

I don't know what to say. I searched on the licence number they quote on their website and their name and both pulled up this licence. Sorry if its not the news you had wanted

[fluffycloud]

Thats ok.. I will try the 'I did not receive the document that states 2 mth notice period' angle, seriously If I owe money fair enough I pay it up but all of a sudden they come at me with you owe 2 mths plus interest and court costs!!

 

HELP!

[FunkyFox]

I would ask for a copy of the contract that you signed and a statement showing all costs and payments. Always put it in writing and don't sign the letter.

 

Once you can see what you signed and how they have calculated what they say you owe you can take it from there. Nurseries do seem to be doing this more and more.

 

Best of luck. FF

[FunkyFox]

Just read though the thread again, have they actually issued a claim against you?

[Percival Wigglesbottom]

From their website,

they only ask the OC for the name , address and account info to proceed with their collection activities .

 

So, a good company to start requesting some official documentation off of ,

since they won't have any . ie , Notice of fair processing, cca, notice of assignment, statement of account , subject access req (if you don't mind the fee) etc .

 

They seem like a small scale dca working on a smaller profit margin so anything to rack up their time , costs and expenses in processing your account would be advantageous. Get them bogged down in formal complaints , I bet they don't have the wherewithal to withstand a concerted paperwork attack on their rearguard.

 

I wonder if they even have a complaints procedure .

Edited March 23, 2009 by Percival Wigglesbottom

[fluffycloud]

Well so far I have issued a letter asking for a copy of my signed agreement to the terms and conditions of the nursery,

all they sent was a photocopy of standard T&Cs hi-lighting the paragraph about 2 mths notice period,

 

thing is as I keep telling the woman at the DCA I have never seen this document,

she said it should have been given to me in my initial pack at the nursery,

 

my argument is where is the proof it was given to me,

I had no idea it was a two month notice!!

 

When I quizzed her (the DCA) she said that its an Ofsted regulation, to which I replied 'I have never heard so much twoddle'.

 

She has issued a CCJ on behalf of Leapfrog Group who she is working for, incidentally the debt is with the new Leapfrog Group as the Company who were in charge when My daughter was there has since gone into Administration and taken over!

 

I asked for details of assignment and received nothing, I have sent SAR and CCA etc and she keeps saying as its not a credit agreement debt that does not count and she has sent the invoices that are apparently outstanding too but these are for the notice period.

 

I dont know what to do, I filed a defence with the court saying I was disputing it as I had not received ever the T&Cs of business, now apparently it will go to court as the DCAs are adamant they want the money!

[Percival Wigglesbottom]

Have they issued a default notice ? What does the particulars of claim say ?

 

Maybe ask to get the thread name changed since the issue of them not holding a licence is now defunct , but more importantly they have initiated proceedings and this thread will more than likely address your defence to their claim and you'd want a title to draw in people with legal expertise to aid in this defence .

Edited March 23, 2009 by Percival Wigglesbottom

[fluffycloud]

Have they issued a default notice ?

 

Nope!!

[Percival Wigglesbottom]

Maybe just let this thread die off as an issue resolved , just begin a new thread with relevant title with all the relevant info you have here , plus anything else that could be of use .. ie history of account to date , what requests you have made , what their responses have been . What they have done or not done, what the POC states etc . No default notice would be a good start to constructing the defence. How far along you are in proceedings etc . It is not clear exactly , at least to me, what stage you are at with this claim.

[fluffycloud]

I have had notification from Bullock & Clarke that I owe over £800 in nursery fees dating back to 2007,

this was the first I had heard!

 

They are saying there was a 2 mth notice period that entitles them to charge me as per their Terms and Conditions to which I had not received nor do I remember signing.

 

Well so far I have issued a letter asking for a copy of my signed agreement to the terms and conditions of the nursery,

all they sent was a photocopy of standard T&Cs hi-lighting the paragraph about 2 mths notice period,

 

thing is as I keep telling the woman at the DCA I have never seen this document,

she said it should have been given to me in my initial pack at the nursery,

 

my argument is where is the proof it was given to me,

I had no idea it was a two month notice!!

 

When I quizzed her (the DCA) she said that its an Ofsted regulation, to which I replied 'I have never heard so much twoddle'.

 

She has issued a CCJ on behalf of Leapfrog Group who she is working for,

incidentally the debt is with the new Leapfrog Group as the Company who were in charge when My daughter was there has since gone into Administration and taken over!

 

I asked for details of assignment and received nothing,

I have sent Subject Access Request and CCA etc and she keeps saying as its not a credit agreement debt that does not count and she has sent the invoices that are apparently outstanding too but these are for the notice period.

 

I dont know what to do,

I filed a defence with the court saying I was disputing it as I had not received ever the T&Cs of business,

now apparently it will go to court as the DCAs are adamant they want the money!

[fluffycloud]

Maybe just let this thread die off as an issue resolved , just begin a new thread with relevant title with all the relevant info you have here , plus anything else that could be of use .. ie history of account to date , what requests you have made , what their responses have been . What they have done or not done, what the POC states etc . No default notice would be a good start to constructing the defence. How far along you are in proceedings etc . It is not clear exactly , at least to me, what stage you are at with this claim.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/190828-ccj-action-started-i.html

 

Thanks everyone for your help I have started a new thread here.

[Percival Wigglesbottom]

There are two letters in the link below that you could adapt for your cpr 18 request for information :

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/126912-court-summons-brachers-solictors.html#post1329130

 

You could go to experian and get a copy of your credit report for £2 , as you said on the other thread there was no default notice issued. Your report should show up as clean of any defaults issued by them . No default notice will probably be the main part of your defence. I assume your account with them has been terminated in them taking you to court ? What they can do with an account they have wilingly terminated without issuing a default notice I am not sure on , I do not think they can sue for the whole amount . Will need expert advise on this default, or lack thereof, angle .

Edited March 23, 2009 by Percival Wigglesbottom

[debt4get]

Dear Sirs

 

REQUEST FOR INFORMATION

 

I have received a recent court claim from your organisation. In order to file a defence and counter claim I require some information. Given that this matter is now the subject of legal proceedings, you are obliged to disclose under the Civil Procedure Rules, the information and documents detailed below.

 

The information must be furnished within fourteen days of the receipt of this letter. If you fail to comply, this will be reported to the Court, a copy of this letter will be provided as evidence to the same and an Order enforcing your compliance will be sought.

 

1. A true copy of the executed credit agreement and any terms and conditions that applied to the account at the time of default and at the time the account was opened.

2. All records you hold on me relevant to this case, including but not limited to:

 

a. Transcriptions of all telephone conversations recorded and any notes made in relation to telephone conversations by your company, or by any previous creditor

b. Where there has been any event in my account history over this period which has required manual intervention by any person, I require disclosure of any indication or notes which have either caused or resulted in that manual intervention, or other evidence of that manual intervention in relation to my account formerly held with First Direct.

c. True copies of any notice of assignment and/or default notice or enforcement notice that you or the original creditor sent me, with a copy of any proof of postage that you hold.

 

 

 

 

 

d.Documents relating to any insurance added to the account, including the insurance contract and terms and conditions, date it was added and deleted (if applicable).

 

e. Details of any collection charge added to the account; specifically, the date it was levied, the amount of the charge, a detailed financial breakdown of how the charge was calculated, and what the charge covers.

f. Specific details of the fees/charges levied by any other agency in respect of this account and a detailed breakdown of said fees/charges and what each charge relates to and on what date said fees/charges were levied.

g. A genuine copy of any notice of fair use of my data as required by the Data Protection Act 1998

h. A list of third party agencies to whom you have disclosed my personal data and a summary of the nature of the information you have disclosed.

i. Copies of statements for the entire duration of the credit agreement.

 

3. Any other documents you seek to rely on in court.

 

 

I will require this information within the next fourteen days. I must advise you that if the information is not forthcoming, it will be reported to the Court that you are trying to frustrate proceedings and denying me the opportunity to file a defence and counter claim.

 

Yours sincerely,

this is basically the letter you need to send to bullocks and clarke they have to send you the information in order for you to file a defence.

this will give you a good idea of what they intend to produce in court

, you can then post up the info with your details blanked out and get further help on the matter

[fluffycloud]

Thank you trouble is they are saying as its a nursery fee debt it does not come under normal guidelines!!

 

My daughter left the nursery 2 years ago

 

so I am not overly concerned apart from the naffing CCJ threat which I need like a hole in the head!!

 

Any help is appreciated.

[havinastella]

Thay are bull sitting

 

You are quite within your rights to ask what contract you have signed.

 

Jogs

[Kraken1]

first thing that I note is that this appears to be a breach of contract claim, not a claim founded on the consumer credit act. This means that all the standard fayre about DN and copy agreements is out of the window, it is irrelevant. I really would not send the letter quoted above. This will make you look a bit daft.

 

The CCA will only come into it if you borrowed the money (somehow) to pay for the monthly bills.

 

In order for them to win their case, they need to show that there was a contract, that this was breached and that they have incurred a loss as a result.

 

for starters - questions -

 

What happened when - the timeline. When did you start and finish the nursery? How much notice did you give?

Contract - what does it actually say?

 

Incorporation - were the terms that they are seeking to rely upon incorporated into the contract?

How were they given to you?

When?

Is there a reference to them in the paperwork you were given?

What did you sign?

Note - not signing anything does not necessarily absolve you of any responsibility for the contract

- a contract does not need to be in writing.

 

How was the bill paid?

By Direct Debit, cheque, invoice?

 

Fairness - are the terms they are seeking to rely on fair under UTCCR?

 

Evidence - what evidence do they have of your breach?

[dx100uk]

urm..

so what court is this make believe CCJ is from!!

have you got a copy of it..

 

me thinks this is more of the DCA's 'could' threats again.

 

stay off the phone to them and send them the deny any debt letter.

 

stop joining in their own Fictitious game.

 

dx

[fluffycloud]

Northamton MCOL court!!

 

I am so confused I dont know what to do they refuse to send me a copy of the contract I supposedly signed,

they are adamant they are in the right because they have a photocopy of the nursery T&Cs which do say 2 mth notice period but I have never seen them,

 

my argument is purely I have not seen it before, nobody made me aware of such and since my daughter left there was a whole year before any one came to me alledging I owe this money, I have no notice of assignment that the nursery had sold the debt on, handing it to a DCA, nothing, out of the blue was the letter saying I owe money!

 

first thing that I note is that this appears to be a breach of contract claim, not a claim founded on the consumer credit act. This means that all the standard fayre about DN and copy agreements is out of the window, it is irrelevant. I really would not send the letter quoted above. This will make you look a bit daft.

 

The CCA will only come into it if you borrowed the money (somehow) to pay for the monthly bills.

 

In order for them to win their case, they need to show that there was a contract, that this was breached and that they have incurred a loss as a result.

 

for starters - questions -

 

What happened when - the timeline. When did you start and finish the nursery? How much notice did you give?

Contract - what does it actually say?

Incorporation - were the terms that they are seeking to rely upon incorporated into the contract? How were they given to you? When? Is there a reference to them in the paperwork you were given? What did you sign? Note - not signing anything does not necessarily absolve you of any responsibility for the contract - a contract does not need to be in writing.

How was the bill paid? By Direct Debit, cheque, invoice?

Fairness - are the terms they are seeking to rely on fair under UTCCR?

Evidence - what evidence do they have of your breach?

 

They are saying the T&Cs are the contract, they have yet to furnish me a copy that I have signed, they have said they have this evidence but will not give me a copy, this was all argued before they started the CCJ against me, they are very heavy handed on the phone, I tell them I will not speak to them verbally everything has to be in writing.

 

What can I do?