BB23 V HSBC Managed Loan (SAR)

[bb23]

After numerous problems and queries regarding a Managed Loan i hold with HSBC i am now in the process of waiting for them to return on the Subject Access Request i sent on 16th Feb.

 

As yet, i have had no confirmation that they received my letter (except Royal Mail site saying it was 'delivered' on 17th.....?

 

And

 

The cheque for £10 has not yet been debited from my account.

 

Does this mean they have not even started on gathering the HUGE amount of information i requested.!

 

Im disputing the loan due to the fact that after i CCA'd them last June they have not been able yet to provide a signed copy of my loan agreement. Their first reply was by letter simply saying "we cant send this to you" and the 2nd was after a phonecall and they just sent digital print outs with no signatures on.

 

Im still unsure on how to proceed should they NOT be able to provide it when the 40 days are up (30th March) but at the moment my main concern is that they arent even working on it

 

i know that may work in my favour if they have no complied by 30th March but they might be trying to swing it by saying "we never received your letter"

 

One thing that worries me is that i asked for Recorded Delivery but she did Special Delivery.............does that make a difference?

[PGH7447]

who cares wether they are or are not working on it, they know the time scales so just chill and wait

[johnnymitch]

Hi BB23 , welcome back to the forum

 

If the Royal Mail says it was delivered on 17th Feb they have 40 calendar days from then to produce everything you are asking for . They cannot deny having received it ,and Special Delivery is more reliable than Recorded because sometimes they don't get a signature for it.

 

So, as PGH7447 says , it's not for you to worry whether they're working on it..... if there's nothing or not enough stuff in your possession by then , come back and we can give you a letter to call it up -

 

Don't worry yourself about what they're doing or not doing... the ball is in thier court , they have to run with it ......

[bb23]

Thanks guys! they have 22 days left and counting!

 

im assuming if they fail to provide what i asked for, in particular the signed copy of my loan agreement then it becomes un-enforceable? where do i go from there?

[PGH7447]

you send the account in dispute letter

[johnnymitch]

Come back when the time is up and if necessary, and I (or maybe someone else) will dig up an 'Account in Dispute' letter for you BB23 .

 

There's always plenty of help on here .......

Edited March 8, 2009 by johnnymitch
afterthought ......

[bb23]

Come back when the time is up and if necessary, and I (or maybe someone else) will dig up an 'Account in Dispute' letter for you BB23 .

 

There's always plenty of help on here .......

 

Is it possible to show me how an Account In Dispute letter reads? i'd love to know what goes in it

 

thanks

 

B

Edited March 9, 2009 by bb23
adding quote

[johnnymitch]

I think we've jumped the gun a bit here bb23 ,

 

If they don't reply satisfactorily to your SAR then you send a callup letter :

 

 

NON- COMPLIANCE WITH SAR

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/6986-data-protection-act-non.html#post38561

 

Article title 13 is the one you use - adapt it to suit your circumstances ....On the letter you list what you consider is still missing and give them 14 days to reply ........

 

You could also add to this letter that , until they have fully complied with your request , this account must be considered to be 'In Dispute' .

 

If they still cannot produce the Managed Loan agreement , then you bring up the big guns , but let's take it a step at a time ......

Edited March 9, 2009 by johnnymitch
erasing font markings

[bb23]

cool thank you. hehe i know its a long process they sent me a letter thing morning saying "thank you for your letter requesting your statements"

 

did they even read what i sent !

[johnnymitch]

Maybe you should nip this assumption in the bud now bb23,by sending them a letter which says :

 

I acknowledge your letter of xx xxx xx in which you make the mistaken assumption that I asked for only statements of my account .

I sent you a SAR on xx xxx xx . This is not just a request for statements as you have so mistakenly assumed , a SAR means :

You must send me anything with my name on it for any account(s) of mine you have for a single Subject Access Request. It is a request for all and any data you hold concerning me, this includes

copies of correspondence,

copies of internal notes,

copies of any telephone recordings or a transcript of the recording

copies of statements of account

and last but not least a copy of the terms and conditions agreed to by you governing the account.

You must also be aware that the original SAR is due to expire on xx xxx xx and if ALL the information required is not in my possession by that date , further action will be taken to ensure your compliance .

Edited March 9, 2009 by johnnymitch
fine tuning .......lol!

[bb23]

i was thinking of sending something similar but at the same time, if they're not bothering to read my letter properly or comply then doesnt that work in my favour?

[johnnymitch]

I'm not sure , bb23:confused: are you saying you'll be happy for them to default on compliance with your SAR?

[bb23]

im kinda hoping they cant provide my loan agreement, they have already sent me a printout with no signatures on. if they cant provide it then that works in my favour right? the managed loan could become unenforceable if they cant provide what i'm asking for?

[johnnymitch]

Absolutely , bb23 , but you have to be sure they can't provide it and a SAR is the best way to do this, getting them to admit they haven't got it - t'would look a bit daft if they suddenly produced it in court - saying you hadn't asked for that specific document .

 

This way , if you had to eventually take them to court(underCPR) for not producing it and they did produce in court ..... they'd have some explaining to do ....

[bb23]

cool that's what i sent, a SAR on 16th Feb. I guess if they arent even going to bother reading it properly its not really my problem if the 30th March rolls around and i've not had my transcripts and signed copy of my loan then its on to the next phase. i dont think i'm going to chase them over the fact they seem to have assumed my letter was about something else cuz it definitely gives me the upper hand that they arent actioning my requests really.

[johnnymitch]

Go for it bb23 !

[bb23]

little update: so far all i have received are the bank statements for my managed loan. no other correspondence. they have 7 days left to provide full transcripts of ALL telephone calls i've ever had with them along with the managed loan agreement.....tick tock hsbc, tick tock!

[bb23]

Me again! well, their time is up ! 40 calendar days is this saturday - so, if i've nothing from them on Monday its onto the next stage! (i will definitely need some guidance on the next part!)

 

im under the impression that despite the clarity in my SAR they thought i was just after bank statements! they never cashed the cheque i sent and stated in the letter they sent me just before my statements that it had been destroyed!

[johnnymitch]

The fact that they didn't accept the cheque does not absolve them from having to comply with your SAR ...... the deadline still stands so the next step is ...... ;

 

NON- COMPLIANCE WITH SAR

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/6986-data-protection-act-non.html#post38561

[bb23]

is it 17: data protection act non compliance?

 

i cant believe they didnt send ANYTHING i asked for!

[johnnymitch]

Sorry bb23 - I should have said .......

 

that's the one ..... just pick the one which best suits you ..

 

http://www.consumerforums.com/resources/templates-library/48-bank-templates/129-data-protection-act-non-compliance-template-letters-.html

[bb23]

Well, still nothing from HSBC (other than the ML statements), thought i'd give them a few days grace and wait till today which was 43 days i think. So letter is written and dated 30th March and going out tomorrow giving them 7 extra days from receipt of 2nd letter

 

its so weird, i almost thought i'd produce the agreement! but they havent, or the rest, transcripts and credit card statement etc...... how rubbish and they're shooting themselves in the foot but NOT doing it.

 

hypothetically, what happens if they STILL don't provide what i want after this letter? i take them to court as per the 2nd letter but what exactly happens? will they write off the loan?

[johnnymitch]

Hi BB23

 

 

hypothetically, what happens if they STILL don't provide what i want after this letter? i take them to court as per the 2nd letter but what exactly happens? will they write off the loan?

 

Yes, you take court action against them using Form N1 and Particulars of Claim shown in Article 18 of the templates link :

 

The Consumer Forums - Bank charges templates (consumer)

 

If they haven't got the stuff which you're looking for they may discontinue the loan before it gets into court proper.... but at this stage you're trying to force them into admitting (in writing) that they haven't got the relevant documentation ....

 

Once you've got that , you can take it on from there ......but hypothetical guessing is always iffy........ so if you don't mind I'll pass on that

[bb23]

well, NADA from HSBC. They have not replied to my recent letter giving them 7 days to provide all the information i requested in my previous SAR from this Feb....

 

eeeek!!! ... what do i do now?

 

Johnnymitch, i'm sorry to seem thick but i just don't understand that particulars of claim thing ?

[johnnymitch]

Don't panic , bb23- and you are not thick - ........ . It always seems a bit daunting if you're not used to claiming in court......

 

Basically , with the POC you are telling the court that :

 

a. You have or had an account with xxxx bank

 

b. On xx xxx xx (date ) you asked them for a SAR as is your right under the Data Protection Act .

 

c. To date they have failed to comply with your request as they are required to do by law and you would like court to make them comply.

 

A lot of the Red Ink stuff you can ignore if you like - for instance the section on damages and distress ...... just try to keep it simple and

follow the above objectives .........

 

Attach copies of any letters you have sent or received from the bank to support your claim .....

But if you ask at the court when handing in the N1 they're usually pretty helpful if they know you're a novice ......

 

 

Perhaps someone else might like to add some advice , too - so keep an eye on the thread ........