Capquest - Returned CCA Fee ?

[Turnaround]

Hi All,

 

I am new to this forum and would appreciate your views or answers as to why many DCA's are returning the CCA fee. I have been searching for an answer, but to no avail.

 

I have recently been dealing with Capquest over a desputed debt with Citicards. After sending the "proove it" CCA letter plus fee, they eventually responded with this.

 

"Our debt purchase dept is unable to provide a copy of the signed agreement, so please find returned your cheque.

Please also be advised that this account has been placed on long term hold, whilst we proceed with returning it to Citicard."

 

I know that there is no such thing as long term hold in law, and this probably means they will chase later or pass it on.

 

However, why have they returned the fee? What is the relevance of this action?

and what implications or problems do you suppose it will have further down the line.

 

I understand the CCA law has or is about to change in respect of prooving the debt, do you suppose this is the reason and they are playing a waiting game?

 

Or more disturbingly, does returning the fee imply they have not requested the documents and are trying to get around the law. By this I mean, I am entitled to request these documents and a fee has to be paid. They then have to comply with your request within a time frame. If they can't produce them then the debt is unenforcable. So why would a company refuse a payment for a service they have to provide, its income after all(small I agree), it just does'nt make any sense.

 

regards....... Turnaround

[dw190]

Hi All,

 

I am new to this forum and would appreciate your views or answers as to why many DCA's are returning the CCA fee. I have been searching for an answer, but to no avail.

 

I have recently been dealing with Capquest over a desputed debt with Citicards. After sending the "proove it" CCA letter plus fee, they eventually responded with this.

 

"Our debt purchase dept is unable to provide a copy of the signed agreement, so please find returned your cheque.

Please also be advised that this account has been placed on long term hold, whilst we proceed with returning it to Citicard."

 

I know that there is no such thing as long term hold in law, and this probably means they will chase later or pass it on.

 

However, why have they returned the fee? What is the relevance of this action?

and what implications or problems do you suppose it will have further down the line.

 

I understand the CCA law has or is about to change in respect of prooving the debt, do you suppose this is the reason and they are playing a waiting game?

 

Or more disturbingly, does returning the fee imply they have not requested the documents and are trying to get around the law. By this I mean, I am entitled to request these documents and a fee has to be paid. They then have to comply with your request within a time frame. If they can't produce them then the debt is unenforcable. So why would a company refuse a payment for a service they have to provide, its income after all(small I agree), it just does'nt make any sense.

 

regards....... Turnaround

 

Your answer is in bold. The ball is now in Citicards Court. Await their response.

 

Keep the letter they sent as this is proof of your request.

 

What they are telling you is that they bought the debt with the intention of making a quick buck. Your request has stopped that happening so they have sent it back to Citicard.

[Turnaround]

Thanks for your reply,dw190.

 

I understand that bit. I dont understand why they should return the fee. Have they made the request for the documents free of charge, which I don't think so. Or have they not made the request, therefore denying me my rights and they can't charge for a service they haven't performed? And if this is the case is the debt still unenforcable. What could be the implications further down the line, should it go that far?

 

I would like peoples views on wether this practice is within the law, and why so many DCA's seem to do this. After all they do seem to enjoy impunity from the law sometimes.

 

Regards.......turnaround

[jo5ephedward5]

I have had this with CapQuest twice - they are still chasing me every day - i had a letter off them telling me that there computer made an error and the debt would not be returned lol - they are shocking!

 

my thread is in my sig and ther is a huge thread about them on Grumbletext, UK consumer complaints - post online and via SMS text message! if you search CapQuest.

 

they are by far the worst DCA i have ever come across - on grumble text there are 20+ peopel that they have not furnished with the documents and are still calling daily and writing from their solicitors (that are fake and have the same address as CapQuest!)

 

I dont think they request teh info tbh - after all when i asked my original credtior they didnt wnat anything to do with it!

 

My advise is ignor them keep all correspondance and see what happens

[dw190]

I understand that bit. I dont understand why they should return the fee.

 

Because they can't provide what the fee is for.

 

You could write with the same request to Citicard but the DCA should pass on a copy of your letter. They don't want to be involved in non profit making disputed debts. They only want people that give in to their demands. Why? Because its the only way they make money.

[andrew1]

I would suspect that this is a wheeze to offset their obligation under the law of the CCA. If they don't cash your £1 they haven't been paid to excersise it.

 

Effectively they are refusing the cca request and I would imagine this is something for the authorities to take up.

 

I would send another request, recorded delivery, emphasise your rights to this info and if they haven't got it, like you have suggested, then they have to accept the consequences of the 12 day and 30 day rules. I would think it extremely unlikely that Citi Cards once having sold it are likely to buy it back. Now the DCA owns it they are left with it or they sell it on. Citicards are not in the business of buying debt!

 

They, Capquest and the likes buy these debts for roughly 7% - 12% of their face value from the card compainies so its like buying a batch of spuds from the market at 80% cheaper than the shop and finding a bad one or two. Does the trader want them back?

 

I have a Cit Card sold to Cabot in the same vein. I am claiming all my charges back from Citi and getting the money I paid Cabot if they dont reply by the end of this month:-D :-D

[Turnaround]

Great, thanks for your answers. Now I'm getting somewhere.

 

So, if they are refusing the CCA request which authorities do I inform & how?

 

And is the aledged debt still enforcable, if sold on?

 

Regards........Turnaround

[jo5ephedward5]

They have not complied with the CCA - so, you are within your rights to stop payment (if u started), and when they contact you again (not before) I would reply stating that they are in default, and that should the persist in trying to enforce the debt whilst in default you will contact Trading Standards.

 

they can still sell on the debt i think, and it all starts again - tho if CapQuest dont have the info i doubt if they sell it it will appear!

 

if they dont give you the info within 30 days they cant case you for it...

 

i'd like to know if they provide it after the 30days do you have to look at it seriously or is it too late?

[Turnaround]

Thanks jo5ephedward5,

 

I have just read yours and others threads on grumbletext. What a "carry on" to say the least. I had no idea this was happening to so many people.

 

We appear to be in a simlar boat, although you a little more advanced. What responce, if any have you had from Trading Standards? It would appear that many people have complained or piont out Capquest failings and yet no news on a result. Surely there is a higher body to approach or other avenues to take.

 

I have heard "davefromderby" is well respected on this forum for his knowledge and advice. How do you attract his attention to this subject?

 

Are you any further advanced in claiming your Charges/payments etc back, as this could well be my next step?

 

Regards.....Turnaround

[Turnaround]

Sorry "alanfromderby"

[jo5ephedward5]

Thanks jo5ephedward5,

 

I have just read yours and others threads on grumbletext. What a "carry on" to say the least. I had no idea this was happening to so many people.

 

We appear to be in a simlar boat, although you a little more advanced. What responce, if any have you had from Trading Standards? It would appear that many people have complained or piont out Capquest failings and yet no news on a result. Surely there is a higher body to approach or other avenues to take.

 

I have heard "davefromderby" is well respected on this forum for his knowledge and advice. How do you attract his attention to this subject?

 

Are you any further advanced in claiming your Charges/payments etc back, as this could well be my next step?

 

Regards.....Turnaround

 

I've not had a responce from Trading Standards yet - there are some people who have had trading standards ask what they would like to be done about it - think people have said have their DCA license (or what ever its called) revoked - they leave messages you cant herad just fuzz except the number to call, even whe nyou answer a call they do this till they can tell you have answered - their tactics are shocking!

 

One guy had a trading standards respose saying that his complaint had been forwarded to a different branch as they were taking a particular interest in CapQuest - i think things are moving just slowly...

 

Alan is a great help, he has commented on my situation - see my thread (link in signature) for his comments, i'm sure you can use some of it

 

 

Good luck! - u may need it

[minkypinky]

Hello,

 

I've read through some of the posts here and through grumbletext and at the risk of repeating what other people have written i would just like to get more advice and some perspective as i'm pretty worried.

 

I received a letter from CapQuest regarding an egg account I had and that was terminated 3 1/2 years ago because I left my previous job where I was earning an absolutely pittance (£14,000) and being treated like crap. I found myself in a nasty situation of spending the next two years trying to get a job and being in and out of temp work and having a nervous breakdown due to money worries and being without a fixed abode, until i found lovely new employment in April of this year. Now I'm earning an okay wage but am facing the problem of having to deal with stuff I buried my head in the sand over whilst having absolutely no money and bulding up debts with my (absolute rock of a) boyfriend on his credit card.

 

I only got the letter last night dated 17th November asking me to reply by 30th November, I called them in a panic thinking if I was logical and reasonable they would accept my offer of £94 per month - which is pretty much stretching what I can afford. They point-blank refused and became tht=reatening saying that if i didn't have a card to make a payment (I don't, I have a very basic acount that allows me a cash card for use in their cashpoints only) i had to ask a 'friend' or 'family member' to make the payment on their card of £250. I can't make that payment?! and that all subsequent payments would have to be a minimum of £200.

 

I just can't do that, I explained this and the woman started shouting down the phone and interrupted me every time i tried to speak. I ended up putting the phone down andcalling back. The next person said that he would 'try' and negotiate with that department, but not to hold out any hope.

 

I'm so worried about this, I know people have posted that they 'probably' won't send anyone round, but is that true? Will I have to go to court? Shold I send them a prove it note or would this make my situation with them worse?

 

I do earn a good wage now, but it is eaten up by making good the loans from my boyfriend - he borrowed off his cards so that i wouldn't be evicted - and family and paying the rent, bills etc. They say they don't recognise that as a debt, but he can't afford for me not to pay his card off.

 

Any advice is much appreciated.

[andrew1]

Right young lady, the first thing we have to do is to stop you worrying. You are not alone - there's 90,odd thousand people behind you and we'll take you through every step to enable you to take back control of your life.

 

Capquest have a reputation. A reputation we are all very aware of and one which we can certainly control.

 

We have to establish two things. 1) you know who the debt belonged to - Egg. So we need to know if the money you owed is the same amount Capquest are asking for. Given what you have said about your circumstances I'd imagine you have charges for late payments etc ie: penalties on the balance. That enables you to say the debt is 'in dispute' because we are going to help you get all those back.

 

2) We have to establish whether or not Capquest are collecting 'on behalf of Egg' as an agent or whether they have 'bought' the debt from Egg and are chasing it for themselves.

 

First write this letter to Capquest:

 

Dear Sirs

 

I do not acknowledge ANY debt to your company.

 

I require you to supply the following documentation before I will correspond further on this matter.

 

1. You must supply me with a true copy of the alleged agreement you refer to. This is my right under your obligation to supply a copy of the agreement under the legislation contained within s.78 (1) Consumer Credit Act 1974 (s.77 (1) for fixed sum credit) - your obligation also extends to providing a statement of account. I enclose a £1 postal order in payment of the statutory fee, PO Serial Number xxxxx.

 

2. A signed true copy of the deed of assignment of the above referenced agreement that you allege exists.

 

3. You are notified that you are obliged to supply these documents, whether you are the original creditor or not under S189 of the CCA 1974.

 

Non-compliance with my request is a criminal offence under the above Act and will result in a report being submitted to the relevant statutory authorities.

 

As you are aware, a credit agreement that is not properly documented and signed by the customer is totally unenforceable under the CCA and therefore is a complete defence to any court claim that is issued.

 

Take note at this stage, that any legal action you may contemplate will be both vigorously defended and contested.

 

 

Yours Faithfully

 

 

Put a £1 Postal Order with it and send it recorded delivery keeping the receipt it'll cost you about a £1 postage.

 

That will stop it in its tracks for the following period:

 

They have 12 +2 days posting time from posting to respond with the documents you have asked for. The Deed of Assignment is only if they have bought the debt (but is also not a legal requirement for them to send- however Egg should have written to you and informed you they sold it if they did.) If they don't send them in that time then they will need to go to court and get a court order before they can collect the debt only after they have found and produced the documents) IF after another 1 month they still haven't supplied it then they have commited a CRIMINAL OFFENCE and the debt is unenforceable until they find the documents.

 

Now, that sounds hairy but whilst all that is going on at Capquest you need to be sending a Data Protection Act Subject Access Request letter with a £10 Postal Order to EGG to get all the statements for the last six years ( or however long you had the account) They have 40 days to reply. The Data Protection Act S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) letter is in the Templates Library at the beginning of the forum. Once you have them you can look to see what penalties you have and you can follow the step by step guide to getting them back ( starting your own thread ) and asking all the questions you like to get you through.

 

THEN, once you know what the exact position is you can start to deal with the actual debt itself and getting yourself back in control.

 

That's when you can decide exactly what you can afford and we can help you get a negotiated deal struck to suit YOU not them.

 

Next on the List:

 

STOPPING THE PHONE CALLS

 

When writing to Capquest inform them that under no circumstances will you communicate with them on the telephone and that all communication MUST be in writing. If they keep calling, come back here and we'll give you a letter to send which will shut them up once and for all. If they phone in the meantime, just say you will only communicate by letter and politely put the phone down.

 

Once you have all that done and you start to feel back in control take your boyfirend down to the pub and enjoy your life ! PM me your thread and we'll keep an eye on you. If you have any other problems like this with any account the format is much the same Most of all - DO NOT WORRY - Money? - It's only numbers

[minkypinky]

Thank you so much for your advice, have copied the letter and will send today with postal order. It's actually put my mind at ease reading that other people are in the same boat as I know what to expect now and won't let them bully me! x

[andrew1]

Thank you so much for your advice, have copied the letter and will send today with postal order. It's actually put my mind at ease reading that other people are in the same boat as I know what to expect now and won't let them bully me! x

 

 

Empowering isn't it ?

 

keep an eye on this thread too http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-bailiffs-advice/28420-capquest-debt-recovery-can.html#post300295

[minkypinky]

Empowering isn't it ?

 

keep an eye on this thread too http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-bailiffs-advice/28420-capquest-debt-recovery-can.html#post300295

 

absolutely! but still aware there's more of a sturggle ahead.

[pj41]

Hi Both of you,

 

I have to say what a superb reply to minkypink you did there Andrew, well done mate.

 

Minkypink as Andrew said we can give you loads of help just ask, and DONT WORRY !! its only money.

 

I will do my best to keep an eye on you too and If I can help I will, if not, I'll get you some.

 

 

All the best

 

 

pj41

[minkypinky]

Hi Andrew1 (and PJ41),

 

Thanks so much for your advice last time... I need to pick your brains again!

 

I copy and pasted the letter and set it recorded delivery on 7th December with the postal order for £1 and have had two letters back (but no statement of account).

 

First was dated 9th december saying that "further to recent contact with our office and your request for further information in relation to the above account, we would confirm that your acount is now on hold for 28 days whilst we obtain the information required.

 

If you have proof of payments or correspondence that would assist with your query, please forward these documents with a brief covering letter to our Collections Administration department, so that we can resolve this matter as soon as possible."

 

The second letter was sent 4th January 2007 and said "We can confirmation we have requested this information directly from Egg Banking plc, however we are still awaiting a response. Your account is currently on hold, and if interest is being applied this will be frozen.

 

We will be contacting you again in 28 days to advise of the situation.

 

If Egg Banking plc respond to us within that time period, we will contact you immediately to resolve this matter."

 

Should I respond to any of this in writing, or just wait. How long should I wait?

 

Thank you in advance MP x

[andrew1]

HA HA What'd I tell you?

 

This says they can't find your agreement. Capquest should have had a copy of the agreement BEFORE they chased you for the money. SEND THEM NOTHING ! Just so that there's no confusion SEND THEM NOTHING!!!

 

Now they need a court order from a judge to enforce the debt. Assuming the 12 + 2 working days days from the 9th Dec ( a Saturday!) they should have sent the documents by say 28th taking Christmas into account.

 

By now ( 9th Jan ) you should have had the documents even taking the holiday into account. So,, just sit back and wait.

 

If you want to write then you can acknowledge receipt of their letter and inform them that you now understand that they have now committed an offence and that the debt is unenforceable without a court order and therefore no further payments will be made until such times as they have produced said documents as outlined in your letter of 7th December.

 

You can also remind them that if they have not provided the documentation by 28th January 2007 they have committed a Criminal offence and you will report them to the appropriate authorities.

 

... and then tell them as Norman Tebbit ( who you are probably far too young to remember - one of Maggie T's Cabinet members) said - On ya bike

 

 

Edit: actually Minkypinky ( I do love that name!) I would not be being responsible if I didn't say this, just remember that the debt still stands even after the period expires if they come up with the documentation. However, they will need that documentation AND obtain an order from the court whilst explaining to the court why they have committed a Criminal Offence, so it's unlikely they will try. Just remember that though.

[minkypinky]

Great advice, thanks again!

 

I won't get in touch with them, unless they call or write demanding the money again.

 

I'm perfectly happy to pay the debt, but not with their added interest and solicitors fees when i wasn't notified at any point before and not by being harrassed.

 

Once the documentation is through, and i set up a payment scheme, how much information are they legally allowed? Previously they demanded copies of my wage slips and bank statements to prove how much I have coming in and how much is going out.

 

I don't really understand the whole Data Protection aspect of it, and how a credit card company or bank, that you gave your private details to on the understanding it would not be privy to anyone else, can suddenly sell confidential data to a third party.

 

Ho-hum....

 

MPx

[andrew1]

Hijacked thread - apologies to all..

 

POSTS ABOVE 9th JAN transferred to Minkypinks own thread...http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-bailiffs-advice/57031-minkypinky-capquest-update.html andrew1

[shellyfromshields]

i recieved a letter today of letter before action. They talk about litagation and if that is succesfull bailiffs coming to get my thing i am so worried as they only thing of value is my sons computer and my little car my brother bought for me which i am paying him back . I am a lone parent with 3 boys and have in the past said to capital one to accept £2 a week but they wouldnt this has gone on for 4 years and even when i asked for my agreement all they sent me was my application for with a small space with what looked like my signature saying sign here if your agree to the terms of the credit agreement. please help

[gearjamma]

They returned the fee because that's the law ,if they cannot comply with your request then BY LAW they MUST return the fee.Also this long term hold is rubbish,they bought the debt ,so they are the ones who must provide the CCA,regardless what they say,also the CCA act states that if the creditor cannot comply and they have let you know this ,then the debt CANNOT be enforced,so just ignore any threats or calls,but keep your original letter if in the very unlikely event they go to court(very very doubtfull)the judge will have a good laugh,because they have put in writing that they cannot honour your request.

[gearjamma]

The £1 fee is required by law,and by law if they cannot honour your request the fee must be returned by law,it has nothing to do with them,it is what the CCA statute tells them they must do.

[gearjamma]

Just tell them to get stuffed ,remember its only a bit of plastic you hold to your ear ,if they keep calling put the phone to one side then watch telly,its their money being wasted.These people are bullys and try to obtain money you can ill afford ,ignore them,there are so many complaints lodged against them with the office of fair trading,its a wonder they can move.