CCA Advice? Debt Write-off?

[hobbes67]

Hi everyone. I've just joined this forum and have been reading through all the posts on CCAs.

 

I've recently fallen into financial hardship due to redundancy and have taken a lesser job to make ends meet. Unfortunately I have a large credit card debt (about £20k) and I am no longer able to pay the monthly payments, but have been making token payments instead. It doesn't look like my job/financial situation will be changing any time in the near future.

 

Based on the recommendations of this forum, I've just sent off two letters based on the recommended template requesting CCA info to my credit card companies, MBNA and Abbey (now owned by MBNA), and am waiting for their response.

 

I guess my question is somewhat naive, but I can't seem to find a very clear answer (at least for me) on the forums: If MBNA and Abbey's terms are unenforceable, is it likely that they will write-off my debt if I request them to do so? This is my main concern, as I don't see my financial situation improving any time soon.

 

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. I'm very happy to have found this forum!

 

-George

[blueda]

If the creditors cannot produce a valid CCA, and you stop paying them, the debt still exists but are unenforcable, they can still contact you asking for payment, but cannot make you pay, if at a later date they produce a copy of the CCA if it exists, then the debt becomes enforcable again, if after 6 years in England or 5 years in Scotland of non payment the debt becomes time barred. If they do produce evidence of valid CCA and after you have it checked here, one option is to letter them informing them of your circumstances and agree to much smaller payments and get the interest stopped. This link should take you to the letter templates page.

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/generel-debt-issues/20758-creditors-dcas-letter-templates.html

[hobbes67]

Many thanks. I'm waiting to hear back now and will go from there. Has anyone had luck in getting debt written off from MBNA or Abbey? Do they usually respond with valid CCAs to requests? I opened my accounts with them back in 2004.

[blueda]

Ive never heard of them just writing debt off ( perhaps others have ). I would say they are more likely to offer you a reduced settlement figure, as full and final settlement. maybe.

[dpick]

Hi MBNA wrote off my credit card £5400 but only after I started court proceeding against them to have the agreement declared unenforceable they settled out of court.

 

It depends on how much screaming you can stand from them.

 

dpick

[hobbes67]

I own my house and pay a mortgage -- I do not rent. Even though I am making token payments to MBNA and Abbey while waiting for the CCAs (£10 each per month), is it possible that they could take me to court and force me to sell my home? Could they do it even though I am faithfully paying them my token payments every month? Sorry for my ignorance here.

[blueda]

I own my house and pay a mortgage -- I do not rent. Even though I am making token payments to MBNA and Abbey while waiting for the CCAs (£10 each per month), is it possible that they could take me to court and force me to sell my home? Could they do it even though I am faithfully paying them my token payments every month? Sorry for my ignorance here.

Credit card debts are unsecured loans so they CAN NOT make you sell your house.

[hobbes67]

Phew, that's a major relief! I didn't think that a bank holding an unsecured loan could force the sale of property, but after reading through various threads around the CAG website I wasn't so sure. It seems like there are instances where a bank can get a court order to make you sell your property or at least guarantee them a piece of the action when/if the property is sold in order to recover an unsecured debt. I've seen it described as a "charge against the home". Maybe I just got confused and muddled up the info I read.

 

I just got confirmation that my CCA letters were received by MBNA and Abbey today, so now I'm just waiting to hear back from them.

 

I want to reiterate what a relief it has been to find the CAG board and all the great info posted here.

 

-George

Edited February 12, 2009 by hobbes67

[diddydicky]

unsecured creditors can apply for ( and increasingly will get) a charging order if you fail to keep up payments on a ccj they have obtained,

 

This simply means that they can take their money at the time your house is sold before you get your hands on the proceeds (and after any secured creditors by way of 1st 2nd mortgage etc)

 

This action is also notified to your mortgagors so they will become aware of the debt.

 

only in extreme cases where you continue not to make some payment to the creditor could they apply for force the sale of the property

 

Although at this present moment in time interest rates are very low, under normal circumstances, once a ccj is in place and if the payments are low enough it can pay you after a year or so to make an offer in full and final settlement - the longer the period of payback under the ccj the more likely they are to accept a reduced settlement as it costs them each time you make a payment

[hobbes67]

Well, the MBNA and Abbey CCAs have not yet turned up, but there are still two days to go to make the 14-day mark.

 

However, after also sending them an offer of a reduced monthly payment, MBNA has written back to me stating:

 

1) They appreciate my situation and are willing to discuss a level of repayment that would be acceptable to them -- and that their reduced payment programme would be recorded on my credit file for the life of the account and 6 years afterwards.

 

2) I should phone their debt management team with details of income, expenditures and the names of all my other creditors including balances owed to them.

 

3) They also offer to discuss a reduced settlement to the account, and say they may be able to write off a significant portion of my balance.

 

Abbey has not written back to me. I am currently only in arrears with MBNA and Abbey.

 

Any advice on what I should do at this moment, while waiting for the CCAs? I know I shouldn't call MBNA, but should I send them my budget spreadsheet? I don't think I should include the names and balances of my other creditors -- that seems like too much info. I also have the feeling that they will not want to accept my £10 reduced-payment offer. I wish I could negotiate to pay off the balance if they will reduce it substantially, but I just don't have any money to do this right now!

 

Any advice would be great.

[hobbes67]

Do you folks think I should send MBNA a list of all my creditors and the balances owed, as they are requesting with my budget info? I'm pretty uneasy about that.

[diddydicky]

well personally i would do nothing about discussing repayment until it is established (via the receipt of an enforceable agreement) that you have a debt that requires repayment!

 

seems to me like they are fishing at the moment

[Capricorn1601]

maybe you should put the same question to the general Debt Issues team. The advice there is good. Not that I'm saying yours on here isnt.

 

The general gist on that board appears to be if the CCA isnt responded to then you can issue them with a default notice as the contract is unenforceable until they send what you have asked for. They cannot chase payment during this time, or harass you. The general feeling there too is do not attempt at this stage to negotiate reduced payments. Doing so would imply that you acknowledge the debt is legally yours.

[diddydicky]

if you have to offer a repayment there is an argument for making a really low offfer and lettting them get a ccj (or they may not bother and write it off)

 

the reason i say this is because a ccj payment is likely to be VERY low and at least you are clear in 6 years (wheras their way you will be credit hampered for the duration of paying back AND another 6 yrs)

 

the difference between a ccj and their black mark for defaulting and entering into an arrangment is non existent since both ways will effectively balcklist you

 

then again there is an argument for that not being a bad thing until you get your finances onto a good track anyway

 

just athought

[hobbes67]

Thanks for the advice, as always. As you suggest, I'll post this over on the General Debt Issues board and see what they have to say. Still have not received the CCAs from MBNA and Abbey and it's been 21 days since they received my requests.

[diddydicky]

my advice, if they actually produce the agreement and it is valid would be to write to them and tell them that you ahve been seeking debt counselling advice and you didn't like the fact the the companies doing this seem to want to add to your debt so you decided to do the work yourself the first part of which they told you was to ascertain if the debt was actually due, and then make an offer of reduced payments etc- that way you can avoid starting out on negotiations on the wrong foot with them

[diddydicky]

with regard to owning your own house- and if you have major debts- perhaps you have a family member who has helped you out with large debts in the past and you have not kept up the repayments to them- if so perhaps they might take a 2nd charge on your property to secure their debt- this in turn would have the fortunate, if purely conicidental effect of creating a buffer between your main mortgage provider and anyone else who might decide to place a charge since they would then become third charge

 

please note that in the case of charges against property the money is not shared equally in the event of foreclosure- the first second third charge etc get their full chare of the pickings until there is nothing left

 

In the event that a third charge tried to force sell your home then if for instance your mortgage company's charge was for 150,000 and your friends was for 40,000, then the third charge would only get a look in if there was anything left after these two had been paid (and who knows your friend may decide to re lend you the money afterwards to help you get back on your feet

 

i am not of course in any way suggesting that you have a friend who will just dream up a debt to claim against you!

 

however when in the Sh*t - make sure you play the same game as your c reditors

[B3rty]

if so perhaps they might take a 2nd charge on your property to secure their debt

 

Great post..

[hobbes67]

At this point, I have CCA'd MBNA and have received no reply (it's been over a month). If they sell the debt to a DCA, what happens then? Would I need to CCA the DCA, and would they then shift it back to MBNA? Or would MBNA no longer be responsible for the CCA, full stop? Does having your debt sold to a DCA destory your CCA trump card?

[blueda]

At this point, I have CCA'd MBNA and have received no reply (it's been over a month). If they sell the debt to a DCA, what happens then? Would I need to CCA the DCA, and would they then shift it back to MBNA? Or would MBNA no longer be responsible for the CCA, full stop? Does having your debt sold to a DCA destory your CCA trump card?

If MBNA sell the debt to a DCA, then you would request a CCA from DCA who would ask MBNA for copy of the original CCA, It would not destroy your CCA trump card.

[hobbes67]

Whew, that's a relief!

[Potless1]

Hi, I Owe £15k On A Cc With Mbna & I Got Made Redundant Back In July 2008 & I Am Still Unemployed & Since Then Have Not Paid Anything To Mbna After I Phoned Them & Told Them Of My Situation, They Have Contacted Me Every Month For An Update & In January Gave Me A Settlement Figure Of £4,000 & Woulf Write Off The £11k Which Sounded Great But Getting That Kind Of Money Would Be Difficult. Last Month They Asked Me To Pay £240 Which Funnily Enough Is Bang On My 4 X £60 Jsa Payments, They Said Paying This Would Keep My Arrears Being Passed Onto Debt Collectors So I Paid Them This Amount, Today They Called Me Again & Asked For Another £240 So That It Keeps The Arrears From Going Into Debt Collectors Hands & This Time I Tild Them I Did Not Have The Money & That They Should Do What They Have To Do Because I Am Potless, They Said They Are Sorry & The Debt Collectors Would Be In Touch With Me.

I Am Awaiting The Cca Which I Requested From Them About 8 Days Ago & This Is Where I Stand At The Moment, Can Anyone Advise Me On What I Should & Can Do Next ?

As I Am Now Getting Headaches Through Worry & Have Just Been Diagnosed With High Blood Pressure Possibly Through Worrying About My Increasing Debts & Lack Of Work !!!