Right, this is WAR! Bookie v Barclays, Part Trois.

[Sunshine54]

Hi I've got a Barclays current account with an overdraft facility and I am over that facility by £500. I got bank statements for the past 6 years to raise a claim for unfair charges but notice that there are 20 x £22 charges for being over my Reserve (which I didn't ask for or want in the first place).

When I complained to Barclays they wrote a long detailed letter about how they wrote to me and told me that they were giving me the Reserve blah blah blah and sorry but they were going to now remove the Reserve facility which they know I would be disappointed about.

 

What difference did the removal of the facility make to me? = it saved me £22 per week in charges!

 

I'll crack on with the bank charges reclaim and see where we go from there. I know from this thread that the Reserve charges are outside of the Bank Charges issue being appealed but I'm still going to detail them separately in my spreadsheet.

 

good luck with the battle

[ianlufc]

keep me posted about your claim bookie. Im thinking about trying to claim reserve fees back. I was charged £66 for being £1.50 over my overdraft limit. I know my bank will say they warned me about the charges but I'm willing to get my money back

[roo85]

keep me posted about your claim bookie. Im thinking about trying to claim reserve fees back. I was charged £66 for being £1.50 over my overdraft limit. I know my bank will say they warned me about the charges but I'm willing to get my money back

 

I was charged the exact same amount for going £7.34 into mine. I wrote off to them, and like others received a letter saying that it was my fault and I should have received a letter telling me I'd been automatically opted in for a reserve fee system (I can't remember such a letter to be honest.) I'm looking forward to seeing the result of this, it's a modest amount of charges compared to some, but I am a student and that can buy sooo much value pasta!

[Bookworm]

Sorry for the delay folks, Easter hols mean all is on hold until the kids go back to school, as I can't hear myself thinking otherwise.

[thekat1979]

I may have some kind of answer for you on how they respond to claiming back Reserve fees fairly soon as I've gone to court asking for them back alongside other charges. Fingers crossed. Just sent off the Allocation Questionnaires, and asking for it to be put forward as I am in Financial Hardship, so hoping that it doesn't get stayed. If it does, I'll apply for it to be un-stayed.

[Bookworm]

Kat, the Reserve fees shouldn't be stayed, they are specifically outside the FSA waiver, so if you get a stay, oppose it!

[Guest wino]

Subbing

[yourbank]

Bookie I suspect they will be stayed but I think they are challengeable. The issue of UTCCR 1999 and assessability is still part of the OFT test case issues.

[Bookworm]

That may be so, YB, but the conditions of the waiver were that T&Cs wouldn't be significantly altered and B's themselves agree that the Reserve fees are not covered by the test case.

[kennyh]

Any update Bookie?

[Bookworm]

Nope.

[hilaryfrances]

good luck Bookie. I shall be watching with interest, but not the banks interest!

 

I have a question for you, I saw Caro has a link on her posts which is warning peeps that they have to change their claim if they are claiming penalty charges are unfair but to now claim under the utccr. I used your court bundle when making my claim and I know there was a reference in it to UTCCR, is this sufficient or do I have to change my claim. I see it costs £60 and I dont want to do it if I dont have to. Sorry to hijack your thread. Hils

[Thailand]

Hilary, if you used both arguments you're fine.

[Jamstar]

Hey guys

 

I'm new to this forum but have been reading around the subject for some time now. Not in any debts myself, but family members are struggling now and so I've decided to take action for them, and also claim back my own bank charges from HSBC.

 

This thread is of great interest, my brother went o/d by £3 (which was charges they applied to the account to send it o/d) and has had "Reserve Fees" of £440 added over a number of months. He doesn't use the account, moved house and so never knew anything about them till recently. Anyway, account closed, debt sold to DCA and now letters from solicitors. I've got the ball rolling by writing to them for a breakdown of the debt... delay tactics till i find out more info from here basically.

 

Anyway, I was gonna use the unfair charges line, but have read here that reserve fees are excluded from OFT case. Why are these different from overdraft fees?

 

Right, I'm gonna have to write to the FOS as well I think.

 

cheers

[tnook]

Hope you claim goes well Bookie!

 

I've already got a stayed claim from July 2007 in the system I was going to submit a new one with some more charges. Can I mix the old style charges with the new "reserve fees" in a single claim? Thinking of just going down the court route.

[Bookworm]

Anyway, I was gonna use the unfair charges line, but have read here that reserve fees are excluded from OFT case. Why are these different from overdraft fees?

 

Because Barclays changed their T&Cs to the Reserve after the OFT case was started, and part of the conditions of the FSA waiver were that no significant changes would be made to the T&Cs. So for Barclays to be able to introduce that radical change, they can't have them as part of the case, and that's why you can challenge those.

 

They are different because by their structure, Barclays, who must have thought they would lose the penalty argument (and must be kicking themselves now, lol), tried to disguise the Reserve as a voluntary fee for a service which would then not come under the "penalty" umbrella. Of course, we now know that the judge shot the penalty argument down and we now have to rely on the UTCCR instead, and there is nothing not to argue that the Reserve fees are still unfair under the UTCCR, in particular they are not individually negotiated, they are NOT clear and transparent (dishwater springs to mind), they have been unilaterally changed and imposed on the customer (the whole opt-in/opt-out thing is a farce) etc etc...

[Bookworm]

Hope you claim goes well Bookie!

 

I've already got a stayed claim from July 2007 in the system I was going to submit a new one with some more charges. Can I mix the old style charges with the new "reserve fees" in a single claim? Thinking of just going down the court route.

You can do, but remember that your claim will get stayed until resolution of the test case anyway, as part of your claim will have charges that come under it. Still, better to get your claim in now this way you'll get 8% APR accumulating until then. ;-)

[Jamstar]

Of course, we now know that the judge shot the penalty argument down and we now have to rely on the UTCCR instead, and there is nothing not to argue that the Reserve fees are still unfair under the UTCCR, in particular they are not individually negotiated, they are NOT clear and transparent (dishwater springs to mind), they have been unilaterally changed and imposed on the customer (the whole opt-in/opt-out thing is a farce) etc etc...

 

Thanks for the info Bookworm. Like I say I'm doing this on behalf of my brother, but fees of £440 is ridiculous for being £2.58 overdrawn. It infruriates me just thinking about it!

 

If they don't drop the charges then I'm willing to take this to court. The DCA has already threatened this after my bro never replied to them. Bring it on I say.

 

Will be following this thread with interest.

 

cheers

[kennyh]

we now have to rely on the UTCCR instead, and there is nothing not to argue that the Reserve fees are still unfair under the UTCCR, in particular they are not individually negotiated, they are NOT clear and transparent (dishwater springs to mind), they have been unilaterally changed and imposed on the customer (the whole opt-in/opt-out thing is a farce)

Thanks again Bookie; like Jamstar I too have family waiting in the wings so I'll go after Barclays and get in the queue on 'standard' bank charges but treat 'Reserve Fees' as a sep. entity to be dealt with now. Is it safe to assume that Barclays know they've dropped a 'rickett' and that Reserve Fees fall outside the waiver?

[poochball]

I too am considering taking on Barclays. I received a Reserve, used it a couple of times and got the charges. Originally, the charges were debited the day after the offence. So in effect, the £150 reserve I had - turned into a £128 reserve. Only recently are the charges debited 14 days after your next statement.

 

Also, my thoughts are this, Lets say under the new rules I go £100 overdrawn for 3 weeks (No way would I do this). I would be hit with £66 of charges made up of £22 per 5 working days period. Now if I took out a pay day loan (I am not supporting this by the way), it may cost around £25 for a month.

 

Extortionate in my opinion for a Pay Day Loan and well I cannot put into Words my thoughts on the Personal Reserve.

 

Guess what my overdraft is? Go on? Yes £10 and a £150 personal reserve. I used to be with Woolwich (remeber them?) and had a £50 buffer. Once my account moved to Barclays I got a megre £5.

 

I asked instead of a reserve if Barclays could give me a £100 overdraft. They said no. Shocker!

 

I have since changed Banks and have the overdraft now, although I don't use it! There is another way!

 

PS not hijacking thread, just subbing and moaning

[Squidy]

Hi Bookie,

 

Any update on barclays?

 

I have a question; if I apply to get my overdraft fees back from halifax, is it correct that it will be put on hold and I will have to wait until after the test case to get them back? If thats true then how can they continue to charge me these fees when I cannot challenge them? Can I not ask them not to apply anymore until after the test case?

 

Surely it should work both ways.

[carpinjoy]

I have the same problems with there reserve fee and other charges £800 in 10 months, I am watching this with new hope. I put in for the charges to be refunded,They did not send a letter, I got a phone call telling me nothing was going to be paid back as I knew what I was doing as they sent the letter out explaining the changes. Of course I told them the matter would not end there as I was of the opinion that there charges were unfair and most likely unlawfull, her reply was ( you can complain to the FOS if you are not happy. It seems to me as if they are not worried about us taking these cases forward. any thoughts!!

[carpinjoy]

I have heard nothing from barclays since I put in a LBA letter regards reserve fees and the usual unfair fees, no response at all from them, has anyone gone down the court route regards the reserve fees yet, or are we best to wait.

[Darkmatter]

Hi bookie!

 

I was suggested by Slick132 to have a goosey gander at your little war going on, i have had a read through, wow your inthe same boat as me, but may I ask how to you keep the pressure on the banks for your charges to be refunded etc? is it just the same letter sent repeatedly? or some other method?

 

Im sure im not the only person who will benefit from your take on how to play the banks at their own game...

 

DM

[Desperate Daniella]

Hi Bookie,

 

Any update? I've been following this thread with interest.

 

Have just had another row with Barclays about the Reserve. I'm in the same position as Carpinjoy - about £800 in a year. Asked again if I could have an overdraft (which would I was told cost £50 a year for a £250 overdraft) and told I cannot. She did say I could go into a branch and ask (for ritual humiliation I guess) but I was extremely unlikely to get one.

 

In fact she told me that as I was using it as an overdraft it would probably be removed soon anyway. I wish I'd turned it down in the first place.

 

On one occasion I took out £30 at 6.15 p.m. which made me £2.36 into the reserve. I had over £200 in a business account. I had forgotten something was going out of the personal account - stressful day, tired child, the usual. I checked the accounts at 11.00 p.m., realised that I was £2.36 into the reserve and made a transfer. For being £2.36 into the reserve for about five hours (most of which time the banks weren't open anyway) I got charged the £22 and it was the only time I was overdrawn for weeks, and of course the Barclays smuglet (who said that she didn't even have a reserve) said that I could have used the facility for five days and the fact that I used it for 15 minutes of actual open time was irrelevant.

 

I asked her if she knew what usury meant and she hadn't a clue. Suggested she read The Merchant of Venice but that was lost on her too.

 

Clearly they won't let me have the overdraft because I am challenging three of their credit cards, although Smuglet says it's down to my "conduct" on the account.

 

They will let me go £250 overdrawn, although Smuglet says this is "not an overdraft", but only if I pay £22 a week for it. I'm wondering if OFT as well as FOS might be interested in this.

 

What do you think, Bookie?

 

DD