cahoot / abbey loan HHHHHHHHHHELP

[janice514]

hello there am needing some urgent help, i took out a cahoot internet loan in 2002 not long after taking it fell sick and was unable to meet the payments, i have paid a debt collecter 33.00 towards the loan in 2006 as they harrassed me and harrassed me, to be honest this loan was set up on line and i only used it to get me out of a sticky mess with charges on the cahoot bank account and credit card, robinson way dc have just sent me a letter regarding loan asking for immediate payment i have tried the barred letter but they hit me back with the payment made in 2006 yet this loan defaulted in 2002, what would be my next step, the letters are getting really heavy and i dont know in which direction to go

 

hope you can help me

 

xxxxx

[pompeyfaith]

As you made a payment in 2006 this will not be stat bared now until 2012 shame you made that payment.

 

I would say now you need to get a copy of the agreement to see if it is enforceable.

[Captain Rex]

Yep, go with a CCA and seperate detailed SARequest.

[janice514]

hiya captain thankyou for your help, can you help me to find the cca and the other details you said i needed

 

so grateful

 

janice x

[davey77]

SAR:

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/516-1-data-protection-act.html

 

CCA (Letter N):

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt-issues/20758-creditors-dcas-letter-templates.html

[janice514]

ty so much for that

x janice

[davey77]

Don't sign the requests for info by the way. Use a digital signature or just play around with the font making it look 'hand written.

 

There seems to be occasions where the Creditor asks for a signature and there is an aspect for lenders to take reasonable steps to confirm your ID but if they have been communicating with you for some time and sending statements then, generally, the only reason they would reply with 'please send us your signature' is to either delay matters or obtain copies of your hand writing! Cross that bridge if/when you get a response.

[janice514]

hiya davey just gone to type up letter, and thought on, they advised me when i made payment to them, does this mean that they have all the details, do i also need to see a signed document that i signed for this, it was a loan, but it was done on the internet, to be honest cannot remember what i signed with cahoot????????

 

 

is there any other letters i need to send, dont want to send this if i am sending wrong thing, sorry to sound stupid

 

xxx

Edited January 27, 2009 by janice514
forgot something ps its robinson way that want the money paying now not cahoot

[davey77]

If it's Robinson way asking for cash then for the moment you CCA them.

 

You'll need to ask for a Notice of Assignment to find out who the true legal owners of the account are. (If the account has merely been passed to Robinson for collection or sold outright.)

 

In the wording of the S.A.R add:

 

"I also require any Notice of Assignment, past or present, in relation to the above account."

 

Personally i would send the S.A.R to the original creditor (cahoot) and the CCA to Robinson way. (For now.)

 

You won't be sending the wrong thing. At the very most you may have to CCA Cahoot directly at a later stage but if it's Robinson causing you grief demanding cash right now then CCA them for the moment. The likelihood is they will not comply within the 14 days and that will put the account in dispute.

 

Everyone who has a loan or credit card has an agreement they are entitled to view upon request. Just wait and see what you get back, sooner or later, then post it up here with personal details removed for people to view it and then go from there, depending on what Robinson/Cahoot's response is.

Edited January 28, 2009 by davey77
spelling

[janice514]

ty here goes tytytytytytytytyty again

 

janice x

[janice514]

hlello there i am having bit of a problem at the moment with robinson way, I have sent a cca to them for an old loan i had over 6 years ago, with cahoot it is not barred as paid one payment to them 4 years ago, but they still keep sending me warning letters, and have been for the past 3 weeks, arnt they supposed to answer my cca, hope someone can help, as dont know what to do next.

 

thanks for listenning/ dont know which way to turn next

[janice514]

hlello there i am having bit of a problem at the moment with robinson way, I have sent a cca to them for an old loan i had over 6 years ago, with cahoot it is not barred as paid one payment to them 4 years ago, but they still keep sending me warning letters, and have been for the past 3 weeks, arnt they supposed to answer my cca, hope someone can help, as dont know what to do next.

 

thanks for listenning/ dont know which way to turn next

 

 

HELLO THERE

[maroondevo52]

Hi, janice.

 

If they are over their 12+2 days, you could send them this........

 

 

Account In Dispute

 

Ref:

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Thank you for your letter of xx/xx/xx, the contents of which have been noted.

 

You have failed to respond to my legal request to supply me a true copy of the original Consumer Credit Agreement for the above account.

 

On **DATE** I made a formal request for a true signed agreement for the alleged account under consumer credit Act 1974 s77/8. A copy of which is enclosed for your perusal and ease of reference.

You have failed to comply with my request, and as such the account entered default on **DATE**.

 

The document that you are obliged to send me is a true copy of the executed agreement that contained all of the prescribed terms, all other required terms and statutory notices and was signed by both your company and myself as defined in section 61(1) of CCA 74 and subsequent Statutory Instruments. If the executed agreement contained any reference to any other document, you are also obliged to send me a copy of that document.In addition a full statement of this account should have been sent to me detailing all debits and credits to the account.

 

Furthermore

 

 

You are aware that the Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for a request for a true copy of a credit agreement to be carried out before your client enters into a default situation.

 

This limit has expired.

 

As you are no doubt aware section 77(6) states:

 

If the creditor fails to comply with Subsection (1)

 

(a) He is not entitled , while the default continues, to enforce the agreement.

 

Therefore this account has become unenforceable at law.

 

As you have Failed to comply with a lawful request for a true, signed copy of the said agreement and other relevant documents mentioned in it, Failed to send a full statement of the account and Failed to provide any of the documentation requested.

 

Consequentially any legal action you pursue will be averred as both UNLAWFUL and VEXATIOUS.

 

Furthermore I shall counterclaim that any such action constitutes unlawful harassment.

 

Please note you may also consider this letter as a statutory notice under section 10 of the Data Protection Act to cease processing any data in relation to this account with immediate effect.

 

This means you must remove all information regarding this account from your own internal records and from my records with any credit reference agencies.

 

Should you refuse to comply, you must within 21 days provide me with a detailed breakdown of your reasoning behind continuing to process my data.

 

It is not sufficient to simply state that you have a ‘legal right’; You must outline your reasoning in this matter and state upon which legislation this reasoning depends.

 

Should you not respond within 14 days I expect that this means you agree to remove all such data.

 

Furthermore you should be aware that a creditor is not permitted to take ANY

Action against an account whilst it remains in dispute.

 

The lack of a credit agreement is a very clear dispute and as such the following applies.

 

* You may not demand any payment on the account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.

* You may not add further interest or any charges to the account.

* You may not pass the account to a third party.

* You may not register any information in respect of the account with any credit reference agency.

* You may not issue a default notice related to the account.

 

 

I reserve the right to report your actions to any such regulatory authorities as I see fit.

You have 14 days from receiving this letter to contact me with your intentions to resolve this matter which is now a formal complaint.

 

I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter.

 

I look forward to hearing from you in writing.

 

Yours faithfully

 

 

Send recorded,*Edit to suit* and don't sign it.

 

Regards.

 

Scott.

[janice514]

THANKYOU so much will get on the case straight away

 

cant thank you enough

jan x

[janice514]

hello again,

 

 

received yet another reminder letter, getting heavier this time, threatening to send door collector to my house now.#

 

 

which way do i turn, they will not acknowledge anything.

 

hellllllllllllllllllllllp losing faith in myself

[cerberusalert]

Send the idiots this;

 

Dear Sir or Madam,

 

 

Account no

 

ACCOUNT IN SERIOUS DISPUTE

 

Re: my request under the Consumer Credit Act 1974

 

 

Your attention is drawn to the fact that this account is subject to a serious dispute. On ......... I requested that ........... supply me a copy of the credit agreement covering this account pursuant to the Consumer Credit Act 1974 section 78. To date ........... have failed to comply with my request. Without production of the said agreement I am unable to assess if I am indeed liable for any alleged debt to .............., nor does it give me any chance to evaluate whether any original agreement was ‘properly executed’ as required by the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

 

For the avoidance of any doubt I have included section 78(1) and 78(6) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974, which states…

 

78 Duty to give information to debtor under running-account credit agreement

(1) The creditor under a regulated agreement for running-account credit, within the prescribed period after receiving a request in writing to that effect from the debtor and payment of a fee of [£1], shall give the debtor a copy of the executed agreement (if any) and of any other document referred to in it, together with a statement signed by or on behalf of the creditor showing, according to the information to which it is practicable for him to refer,—

(a) the state of the account, and

(b) the amount, if any, currently payable under the agreement by the debtor to the creditor, and

© the amounts and due dates of any payments which, if the debtor does not draw further on the account, will later become payable under the agreement by the debtor to the creditor.

(6) If the creditor under an agreement fails to comply with subsection (1)—

(a) he is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement;

 

 

Clearly as no agreement was supplied on request, this in no way complies with the requirements of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 and I now draw your attention to section 78 subsection 6 which states If the creditor under an agreement fails to comply with subsection (1) he is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement;

 

Clearly this is a situation as described in S.78(6) Consumer Credit Act 1974 and the debt is unenforceable at this time. In addition, I draw your attention to section 127 (3) Consumer Credit Act 1974 which states

 

127(3) The court shall not make an enforcement order under section 65(1) if section 61(1)(a)(signing of agreements) was not complied with unless a document (whether or not in the prescribed form and complying with regulations under section 60(1)) itself containing all the prescribed terms of the agreement was signed by the debtor or hirer (whether or not in the prescribed manner).

 

This is backed by case law from the Lords of Appeal in Ordinary (House of Lords) the highest court in the land. Your attention is drawn to the authority of the House of Lords in Wilson-v- FCT [2003] All ER (D) 187 (Jul) which confirms that where a document does not contain the required terms under the consumer credit act 1974 the agreement cannot be enforced.

 

 

To clarify S.61(1) states

 

(1)A regulated agreement is not properly executed unless—

 

(a) a document in the prescribed form itself containing all the prescribed terms and conforming to regulations under section 60(1) is signed in the prescribed manner both by the debtor or hirer and by or on behalf of the creditor or owner, and

(b) the document embodies all the terms of the agreement, other than implied terms, and

© The document is, when presented or sent to the debtor or hirer for signature, in such a state that all its terms are readily legible

 

In addition the prescribed terms referred to in section 60 CCA1974 are contained in schedule 6 column 2 of the Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations 1983 (SI 1983/1553) and are inter alia: - A term stating the credit limit or the manner in which it will be determined or that there is no credit limit, A term stating the rate of any interest on the credit to be provided under the agreement and A term stating how the debtor is to discharge his obligations under the agreement to make the repayments, which may be expressed by reference to a combination of any of the following—

 

1.Number of repayments;

2.Amount of repayments;

3.Frequency and timing of repayments;

4.Dates of repayments;

5.The manner in which any of the above may be determined; or in any other way, and any power of the creditor to vary what is payable

 

Therefore based upon the Consumer Credit Act 1974 this debt as it stands is unenforceable and should this proceed to litigation, a court is precluded from making an enforcement order under section 127(3) unless a true copy of the signed agreement is produced..

 

At the point where this account entered into the default situation as described in s78 (6) CCA 1974 no other charges are allowed to be added until such time as ............... become compliant with my request. As ................ are still not in compliance with my request I insist that the following takes place with immediate effect

 

All entries which refer to missed payments be removed from my credit file

All collection activities cease with immediate effect until ............. comply with my request from .date........... or such time as a court makes an enforcement order

In addition, I draw your attention to the Office of Fair Trading’s guidance on Debt Collection

 

The OFT guidance which was issued July 2003 (updated December 2006) relating to debt collections and what the OFT considers unfair, I have enclosed an excerpt from page 5 of the guidance which states

 

2.6 Examples of unfair practices are as follows:

 

h. Ignoring and/or disregarding claims that debts have been settled or are disputed and continuing to make unjustified demands for payment

 

What I Require.

 

I require that you send me a true copy of the executed agreement as required by the Consumer Credit Act 1974. If you are unable to supply the requested documentation because no such agreement is in existence I require written clarification as such.

 

I require that you comply with my request within 7 days of the date of this letter. I will not correspond any further with you until I either receive a copy of the requested documents as laid down in section 78(1) CCA 74 or clarification that such agreement doesn’t exist. I am advised that should you persist in pursuing this debt ignoring the above information you will be in breach of the Administration of Justice Act 1970 section 40 as well

 

No other correspondence will be accepted

 

Should you attempt litigation it will be vigorously defended and the failure to supply documentation under the CCA 1974 is a complete defence to any legal action and your actions will be vexatious and unlawful

 

You should also note that I will only discuss this matter in writing and should it be your intention to arrange a “doorstep call”, please be advised that under OFT rules, you can only visit me at my home if you make an appointment and I have no wish to make an appointment with you or any of your associates.

 

There is only an implied license under English Common Law for people to be able to visit me on my property without express permission; the postman and people asking for directions etc (Armstrong v. Sheppard and Short Ltd [1959] 2 Q.B. per Lord Evershed M.R.). Therefore take note that I revoke license under Common Law for you, or your representatives to visit me at my property and if you do so, then you will be liable to damages for a tort of trespass and action will be taken, including but not limited to, police attendance.

 

I trust this out lines the situation

 

Regards

[janice514]

hiya thankyou so much will send straight away, have been checking my bank account, they never cashed the 1.00 cheque i have the stub, does that matter, look worrying about everyting now

 

thanks again j

[janice514]

hiya thankyou so much will send straight away, have been checking my bank account, they never cashed the 1.00 cheque i have the stub, does that matter, look worrying about everyting now

 

thanks again j

should i just carry on ?????????????

[cerberusalert]

No it doesn't matter you made a legal request enclosing the money, if they chose not to cash it that's their problem.

[janice514]

should i just carry on ?????????????

 

all done and e mailed through receipt here for delivery, now i wait thanks again feel a little better now x

[janice514]

hello again, update had letter today from robinson way, saying will be in touch shortly have sent for details i have requested???????? and the account now on hold, does this look good or bad.

 

waiting now do you think i will hear from them again

 

 

regards

 

 

j

[maroondevo52]

Hi,

 

Yes, looking good, whether you'll hear from them again is anybodys guess

 

 

Regards.

 

Scott.

[janice514]

will be dreading post man now lol

 

keep you posted thanks again

 

x j

[janice514]

hello again received this letter this morning what do you think

 

please note we have noted the dispute/ query you have raised

 

we will make necessary enquiries and let you know the outcome in due course.

 

in the meantime we will stop all collection activity for this account,

 

please let us know if we can assist you any further.

 

yours faithfully

 

xxxxx

 

 

what do you think of that, is it a good sign, they have certainly changed now not bullying as usual

 

 

j xx

[cerberusalert]

Yes a good sign. The next letter you'll get will be probably offering you a fantastic discount if you settle the account, followed by a 'we are returning the account to our clients' missive;)