Citi cases ***WON***

[Enron]

Will PM you some details.

[veester]

Well...long story short, i had a default on my credit file from 2004

 

I'd recieved a Default and was not aware of it. :o:mad: - though i had entered in a "full and final" settlement figure for the loan i question - and had this in writing

 

After some to-ing and fro-ing with CF, i had a call with a nice chap from the central department who explained they would be removing the default information, as having carried out some internal research "elements were a-miss" I wonder what ???? lol

 

Cool! A Good result - All using the template for "removal of default" from his site.

NICE WORK

Edited June 18, 2008 by veester
Fuller details

[Enron]

Interesting, but have heard that Citi have a reputation of not sending out default notices.

 

In one instance someone had Citi register a default against them 2 years after they expected it to occur as well.

[mkandy]

Very good news, i suppose this shows it is possible to remove defaults now!

[Enron]

Fairly easy, if they haven't sent out a Notice Of Default then it hasn't been carried out lawfully.

 

Likewise if a default contains any unlawful penalty charges it similarly will be inaccurate and as such the recorded default will be unlawful.

[veester]

Absolutely - agreed on both counts.

[iwantoneplease]

Just would like some more advise please...

 

I've now received my court date with CITI 9th July, Do I have to attend as I would rather not and do you think I'm going to win I'm starting to get cold feet.

[gizmo111]

Yes you will have to attend to win - what does the notice from the court say?

Who is representing Citi? Is it eversheds?

[iwantoneplease]

The letter doesn't say, what will I have to do at court?

 

It just says the judge has considered the statements and allocation questionnaire submitted in this claim and has decided that an allocation hearing/preliminary hearing is necessary before a final decision about the allocation can be made.

 

says defendant: Citifinancial Europe Limited

Edited June 26, 2008 by iwantoneplease

[Enron]

Its an allocation hearing, so will likely be a case as to whether he stays it or allows it to continue to small claims court.

 

Did I previously send you details on compiling your bundle?

 

It won't be necessary to do the whole thing, but there maybe materials which will be handy to use to get the draft order adopted - if you didnt send in with your allocation questionnaire.

 

From the point of view of avoiding a stay, you can state that you beleive the claim should continue to hearing - as the current OFT court case relates purely to overdraft charges on bank accounts.

 

There is a report already in place relating to credit cards published by the OFT in April 2006 which the defendant has complied with. The issue here is whether the charges made by the defendant accurately represent its costs for an instance of a default of contract.

 

Previously the defendant has submitted conflicting cost exhibits to courts, as such you would appreciate the consideration of the draft order to bring all matters to the fore and avoid the waste of valuable court time.

[iwantoneplease]

Hi, just found a letter it is eversheds representing them, I sent all the information you sent with the allocation questionnaire, starting to get really worried about what I will have to say or produce in court now which is on the 9th?

 

Any Advice please?

 

This is what I sent with the allocation questionnaire..

 

When returning this, also include the following.

 

Copies of these 2 cost exhibits from Citi.

 

Exhibit 2 document:

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c1...osh/img203.jpg

 

Exhibit 2 revised doc:

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c1...Untitled-1.jpg

 

And the following letter, seperate draft order. Ammend with your details or to suit your claim.

 

(name)

(address)

 

(date)

(telephone#)

 

Judge xxxxxx

c/o The Court Manager

(court address)

 

Claim Number: xxxxxxxxxxxx

 

Dear Sir/Madam,

 

My reason for writing is with regard to my claim.

 

At present courts are receiving instructions to stay all penalty charge claims in ligh of a test case that the Office Of Fair Trading is taking to the high court. This case relates to overdraft charges on bank current accounts and not credit cards for which there is already an OFT report in place that the credit card companies have agreed to obide by. I am aware of a number of claims that have been allowed to proceed because of this fact.

 

As a litigant in person I would like to have my claim held at ****** County Court, I object to any transfer requested.

 

I also feel it important at this time to inform the court that the defendant is one of the few banks that will not settle before a hearing, hire legal representation and routinely requests stays without any intention of attempting to negotiate a settlement and generally delay to pertract a claim to take as long as possible resulting in the waste of valuable court time.

 

The defendant also seems unsure of it’s own costs, an exhibit giving a pre-estimate of £12.88 was submitted to courts for more than 6 months, recently a pre-estimate of £13.47 has been submitted in claims. As these are both based on the same years figures (2006), from the same formula, with the main body of text being exactly the same it does raise serious questions as to what the defendant is submitting.

 

In the Skeleton Argument that the defendant has been submitting to court the defendant states that using it’s own method prior to the OFT report its calculation for it’s pre-estimate cost per default was £27.42. However at the time it only charged customers £25.

 

Currently the defendant levies a default fee of £12 in the event of a default by a customer. It seems somewhat hard to believe that as a business within it’s rights that the full cost of a default is not being passed onto the customer if the aforementioned figures are correct and that the defendant is willing to accept a continual and sustained loss.

 

On occasion where courts have ordered full disclosure to validate these calculation the defendant has either decided to settle or default on the order. The defendant was taken to the Mercantile Court in London during December 2006 where it had ample opportunity to justify it’s figure of £12.88. An action that would have benefited itself by quashing all similar claims of this nature. Instead the defendant chose to settle.

 

There is also documented proof that the defendants process of handling a “late payment” penalty charge is a fully automated process, evidence of which will be produced at hearing through the claimants bundle of documents. This casts doubt as to the defendants pre-estimate exhibits being accurate.

 

I enclose a draft order for your perusal, and would appreciate your consideration in adopting it for my claim.

 

Thank you for your time and assistance

 

Yours faithfully

 

 

 

(your name)

----

 

DRAFT ORDER

 

In the XXXXXX County Court

Claim number XXXXXX

 

Between

 

XXXXXXXX - Claimant

 

and

 

XXXXX - Defendant

 

Draft Order for Directions

 

The Claimant shall within 21 days of service of this order send to the Defendant and to the Court:

• a) A schedule setting out each charge repayment of which is sought, showing the date, amount, and reason given (if any) for that charge being made;

• b) Copies of any statement or other document relied upon as showing that each and every charge has been made;

• c) A statement of evidence of all matters relied upon as tending to show that the charges are irrecoverable as penalties or otherwise;

• d) Copies of decided cases and other legal materials to be relied upon.

If the Claimant fails to comply with this order, the claim will be struck out without further order.

 

2. The Defendant shall within 21 days thereafter file and serve a response to the Claimant's schedule, stating in respect of each item claimed;

• a) Pursuant to what contractual provision such charge was made, producing a copy of the contractual document relied upon;

• b) Whether such charge is accepted to be a penalty, and if not why not;

• c) If such charge is alleged to be a pre-estimate of the Defendant's loss incurred by the Claimant's actions (whether or not such action is treated as a breach of contract between the parties), all facts and matters intended to be relied upon as showing that such was a proper estimate of such loss, and all evidence to be adduced at trial as to what the true cost of dealing with the matter was;

• d) If such charge is not alleged to be a pre-estimate of the Defendant's loss incurred by the Claimant's actions then facts and matters intended to be relied upon showing the basis upon which the charge was calculated and all evidence to be adduced at trial as to show that the charge was fair and reasonable.

• e) Any witness statements.

• f) Copies of decided cases and other legal materials to be relied upon.

• g) Copies of "manual intervention" sheets relating to the customers account for 6 years in the absence that they have not been provided thus far

If the Defendant fails to comply with this order, the Defence will be struck out without further order.

[iwantoneplease]

Hi could someone just check if I need to take anyother documents into court please

[Enron]

First thing, is not to worry. It may seem a little daunting, but county court is relatively informal.

 

It is likely that your reasons for wanting the claim to proceed will be discussed, as in some courts it is the norm to stay penalty charges claims at present.

 

Basically the OFT court case relates only to overdraft charges on bank current accounts, there is an OFT report in place with regard to credit cards, so it is an issue under contract law as to whether the charges being levied against the customer represent the cost to the bank.

 

The draft order would help bring all matters to the fore at once and save court time if the claim was allowed to proceed.

 

As such I dont think you need much more than you already have, though I will defer to gizmo111 on procedure as it is possible that you may have to submit documents to the court and Citi if you intend to reference them in court.

[iwantoneplease]

Does this mean that the decision could go against me and I won't get any money back?

[Enron]

If your claim goes to court it is possible that you could receive no money.

 

The key is preparing well. I have a guide to compiling your bundle which includes all the supplemental materials you'll need.

 

Also as part of this I gave a description of my experience (my first appearance at county court). Its not as daunting as it may feel.

 

If the draft order is adopted for your case that is half of the battle, as Citi will refuse to supply a breakdown of costs relating to their pre-estimates. Its been orderred many times and on each and every occasion they have not complied - which means they're defence gets struck out.

 

Its most likely that the small claims track will be taken which means that costs are not chargeable against yourself.

[iwantoneplease]

Sorry about all the questions, my case for for under £500 so I didn't think any of this would affect me.

 

What do I need to take with me tomorrow?

[Enron]

Think it will either be a case that a stay might be argued for, or it will get allocated to the small claims track because of the amount.

 

I would suggest taking documents you have received and sent to Citi.

 

Though its likley that the majority of the discussion will be about the draft order, and the letter you sent in with it.

[iwantoneplease]

Just thought I'd give you an update, turned up at court today and I won, all the money will be repaid back to me.

 

The judge was not very happy that eversheds had made a full and final offer the day before court. I obviously had not got the paperwork but the judge had.

 

Great News I'll fill you in with more details a little later on.

[Enron]

Sounds good, might be worth submitting a wasted costs order if the judge was unimpressed - which will no doubt be reflected in his case management notes.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/85726-wasted-costs-order.html

 

Have editted the title for you.

 

The thing now is to clear your balance if you have one, and stop using this company.

[MARTIN3030]

Tis is the season of goodwill to all men-and of course women.

Since Eversheds and Citi appear to be in need of some memory revitalisation-as a gesture of goodwill I am presenting here a list of cases they appear to have "Forgotten about"

In fact take it as Ex Gratia (Brian can share it too)

 

Its nice to see that Tommy Coopers boxes of tricks are still in demand in your offices,but rather a pity that they dont quite do the job in front of Judges.

Edited December 24, 2008 by MARTIN3030

[MARTIN3030]

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/citicards/150591-citicards-ignoring-fos.html

[MARTIN3030]

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/citicards/124845-citi-not-responding-all.html

[MARTIN3030]

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/citicards/148773-citi-financial-default-removal.html

[MARTIN3030]

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/citicards/144032-citicards-advice-please-weve.html

[MARTIN3030]

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/citicards/130729-judgment-entered-against-citi.html