Just returned to the UK and ...

[henry147]

Hi

 

After just over 5 years we have returned to the UK

 

Yes my wife and I had some debt when we left and we are not proud of it.

 

We have only been back 4 months and we are living in rented accommodation but I have had my first letter off Lowell Portfolio yesterday asking me to acknowledge I am the same person as at my old address supplied byExperian - how do they find you so quickly?

 

I do not have alot of money and I am on Invalidity payments and also my wife does not work at the moment.

 

My debt is very little (credit card) but my wife's is considerably more (unsecured loans).

 

We both know we owe the money and thought if or when the creditors catch up with us we might be able to reach an agreement with them - but on finding your forums and viewing some of the cases on here it is very off putting.

 

At the moment they only seem to be looking for me.

 

Do I respond or sit tight with Lowell ?

 

Do I go through all the motions reccommended on here such as

wait for them to threaten more and then ask for proof of debt?

and if they supply it then make a final offer?

 

I remember who my credit card was with but my wife had 5 or 6 creditors and cannot remember all the details of each one.

 

Also may I ask - If I were to clear the debt in my name am I in any way responsible or liable for my wife's debts - they are all unsecured.

 

I suppose what I am asking is what would or could happen if my wife's creditors were to find I had savings of any kind.

 

And before anybody starts shouting about savings - Please I mean we have enough to live on for maybe a year if we live frugally - but hopefully my wife will get a job.

 

Many thanks

[Sol]

Do you know when you last made payment or contact with the credit card in question? If it was 6 years or more, it's statute barred, meaning it can't be enforced.

[ScabHunter]

There are two absolutely critical issues here. Are any of these alleged debts under a CCJ? Also, when was the last time any written acknowledgement or payment was made on these accounts?

 

The problem is, you are not likely to know the answer if you cannot even remember who the alleged creditors were.

 

As there has definitely been no payment or acknowledgement of any of these alleged debts for over five years, it would be extremely foolish to do anything which will attract the attention of enemies or potential enemies. Don't do anything about your wife's alleged debts until they come to you.

 

As far as Lowell goes, do you have any idea of when the last payment or acknowledgement in writing was made on this alleged debt?

 

SH

[version302003]

As you have been out of the uk for over 5 years and have been back for 4 months there is a good chance that any debt you had is now stat barred.

 

You will need to find this out idealy.

 

As you have been out of the uk for some time it is possible that any debt you left behind might of been through the county court and your creditors might have a ccj against you. You could get a copy of your credit file but doing so you will need to provide details of your last address (before you left the uk) which inturn will associate you with those debts you left behind and this info will be passed to the dca's eventually.

 

A tuff call to make to be honest. Hopefully someone with a bit more knowledge will be able to assist you further.

 

Ps Did or have you since returning applied for any type of credit? or given your past details to any company to check with the CRA's?

Edited December 8, 2008 by version302003

[henry147]

Hi Guys

 

And thanks for getting back so quickly.

 

The last payments on both our debts were last made in October 2003.

 

I do not mind so much if they catch up with me and I have to pay

 

But by making any kind of contact I am afraid of drawing attention to my wife.

 

Do you know if I am in anyway liable for my wife's debts - they are unsecured loans and in her name only?

 

Many thanks

[Sol]

Someone more experienced will help, but as far as I'm aware if the debts were not joint, then you would not be liable.

 

With regards to your debt you can either wait until they write again or send them a 'prove it' letter.

[henry147]

Has anyone ever had doorstep visits from these cretins or their associates?

[ScabHunter]

Alleged debts which are in one person's name are their responsibility only.

 

October 2003 isn't great news. That gives them a good ten months to wreak havoc before these alleged debts become statute barred.

 

It is absolutely imperative that your wife does nothing which could attract the sharks to her. Don't, for example, look at your credit report. If there is nothing going on right now, I would leave well alone. Every day which passes is one more towards the target.

 

With Lowell, I would leave responding to them a bit longer. Do these letters include the name of an original creditor and an account number?

 

Doorstep visits are rare, but they do happen. As far as I know, Lowell's "Licensed Field Agents" are totally fictitious. I have heard many threats of home visits, but not of one actually being carried out. They usually send a postcard through the mail which says "Mr X called today", as if people are so stupid they can't see a postmark on the card.

 

Doorstep thugs are not a threat anyway. They have no right of entry, and you are not obliged to say anything to them. You can use a word of your choice followed by "off" if you choose, or you can just completely ignore them as they are too far beneath contempt to warrant a response.

 

SH

[cerberusalert]

At the minute they are still phishing...they are not certain that you are the person they are looking for....so ignore them for the time being.

 

The longer it drags on the nearer the statute barred date becomes. Although, Lowlifes have a reputation for dealing with statute barred & unenforcable debts due to the lack of a CCA anyway.

 

Don't do any baking or polish the family silver as the chance of them visiting is about the same as HRH The Queen knocking on your door with a hand delivered Knighthood:D Besides, even if they did they are not invited and would commit the tort of tresspass:D

 

As to your other question....no, you are not responsible for your wife's debts unless it is in joint names.

 

All you have to do now is wait until they get in touch again. When/if you receive any letters from them come back to this forum & we will deal with it!

 

DO NOT speak to them on the 'phone. If they do ring, tell them "Everything in writing" & hang up!

[henry147]

Thank you Scabhunter and Cerberusalert

 

I feel a little better now

 

and no the Lowell letter does not include the name of an original creditor and an account number.

 

I might sleep a little better well at least for tonight now and it I appreciate a bit of humour injected into the situation.

 

Many thanks once again

[cerberusalert]

Now you've found this site henry147 you will find a raft of information & a host of people who are only too willing to help. Remember, you are not alone the vast majority of us have been there and understand only too well how you feel.

 

You have been wise enough to ask for help from the beginning and believe me you have saved yourself a lot of grief which you might otherwise have had from these DCAs. No doubt you will receive their normal junk mail/threatograms and even telephone messages/calls. But don't worry, these can and will be dealt with, you'll be shown how.

 

You're the one in control now because you've taken the DCAs main weapon away from them...fear. And I promise you, as time goes on you will laugh at both the antics of the DCAs (especially when they start throwing their toys around) and some of the characters on here & what some of us get up to.

[ScabHunter]

and no the Lowell letter does not include the name of an original creditor and an account number.

 

This just shows how unprofessional this whole "industry", and Clownell in particular, can be.

 

So they expect you to pay them money. Just like that, as Tommy Cooper would have said. No proof that any alleged debt even exists. No name of a creditor who might be owed money. No account number to suggest what the alleged debt may actually relate to. No balance on the account, and no proof of how such a balance was arrived at.

 

Just "Give us money, because we say so."

 

In the real world, when debts are assigned to a third party, there are certain procedures which need to be followed. There should be a Notice of Assignment issued by the original creditor to inform you that the debt has indeed been assigned to the third party. The initial communication from the third party should of course reference the original creditor, the account number, and the balance on the account.

 

Without these, how are you supposed to know what you are paying money towards?

 

Assume, for a moment, that you genuinely owe the Scrooge and Leeches Bank money. They terminate your account, and pass it on to Conn, Lye, Cheete, Steele and Swindall, debt collection agency. Conn, Lye, Cheete, Steele and Swindall send you a demand for money, with no identifying account number. They do, however, comply with the need to inform you of the original creditor.

 

You say "Alright, Guv, it is a fair cop. I owe the Scrooge and Leeches Bank money. I will make payments."

 

So, you make payments to Conn, Lye, Cheete, Steele and Swindall for five years. By living in a single room with damp on the walls and no heating, and living on bread, water and mould, you manage to pay off the alleged debt. Apart from the illnesses you have contracted by your hard living, you are now back to square one.

 

Or, so you think.

 

The next day, a letter drops on to the mat. It is from Conn, Lye, Cheete, Steele and Swindall demanding money on the account you once had with the Scrooge and Leeches Bank. This time, your memorable old account number is staring you in the face. "No!", you cry. I have already paid this.

 

'fraid not.

 

What you did was pay on an account owed by someone with the same surname and first initial. Because you never bothered to check the account number, you did not notice the payments were going towards the wrong account.

 

Now, because you believe that debt collection agencies have power, you sell the shirt of your back, the trousers off your backside, and some important body parts to medical science. All because of confusion over a number.

 

Back to the situation you are facing here. To be fair to Clownell, if they did send a letter with important account information to the wrong address, they could rightly get into trouble. So, they are trying to get you to confirm your identity. As ever, so many people will jump when they are told to, and will do exactly that.

 

It is best if you do not do that. Make Clownell work that little bit harder. There are some days at the end of this month where little work is done. Before we know it, we will be into the new year, and the days will start counting down towards October.

 

You have a pretty powerful card up your sleeve. It is known as the CCA request. This will force Clownell to produce a true copy of an enforceable agreement before they can begin to collect money on the alleged debt. What the odds are of such an agreement turning up is impossible to say. If it doesn't, then October will come, the alleged debt will be statute barred, and the game will be over.

 

Although the CCA request is a powerful card, it is by no means a knockout blow. Enforceable agreements do turn up, even for cards taken out in the 20th Century. It usually takes a bit of time before this happens, though. So, the more days you can allow to elapse before you play this card, the better.

 

Just be sure to be ready to play it if the need arises, in response to a statutory demand or a court claim.

 

SH

[henry147]

Many thanks Scabhunter

 

For taking your time and giving me so much details - I will take on board your advice and sit tight for now and play it by ear and wait.

 

Iam so glad I found this Forum

 

thanks again

[henry147]

Hi Guys

 

I have now recieved my 2nd letter from Lowells with more info than the first one.

 

Do I now send a prove it letter or wait longer?

 

Could you please advise?

 

Many thanks once again.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Dear xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx,

 

Our Ref: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxx

 

Original Creditor: Capital One

 

Balance Outstanding: xxxxxxxxxx

 

Original Address: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxx

 

 

I write to inform you that your Capital One account, reference number xxxxxxxxxxxxx , has been sold to Lowell Portfolio I Ltd on the xx/xx/xxxx. Lowell Financial Ltd have been appointed as duly authorised collection agents for recovery of the outstanding balance.

 

It is our aim to help you clear the indebtedness you currently have with ourselves by either agreeing a settlement or a repayment plan. You will find we have many flexible repayment plans designed to suit your current financial circumstances.

 

Please call the number below where one of our experienced negotiators will assist you in finding the ideal option for you.

 

PAYMENT CAN BE TAKEN OVER THE TELEPHONE BY EITHER DEBIT OR CREDIT CARD

 

Please note all future communications and payments must be addressed to Lowell Financial Ltd at the address below:

 

LOWELL FINANCIAL LTD

PO BOX 172

LEEDS

LS119WS

 

Please contact us immediately to discuss your account.

 

0844 844 4716

 

Yours sincerely

 

Andrew Bartle

 

Chief Operations Officer

[Goldlady]

Chances are with Cap One they will have a job and a half finding the agreement. Mine was sent off with the pony express.

 

This is the letter to send if you want to launch an exocet: Letter N

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt-issues/20758-creditors-dcas-letter-templates.html

[ScabHunter]

Go through the standard filtering process.

 

Firstly, do you recognize the details on the head of this letter? Do you believe that this is your alleged debt?

 

If not, send a PROVE IT letter.

 

If you do recognize the details, but you believe the alleged debt is statute barred, send a letter saying so. I remember from before that you felt none of your alleged debts will be statute barred until October 2009.

 

If the alleged debt is not statute barred, then you've got no real option but to play the CCA request card now. If this is for a Crap One card of that age which has been passed to Clownell, then the chances are very good that you can see this one off.

 

Crap One are among the worst for producing enforceable agreements, and they seem to have sold off a pile of rubbish to Clownell. Clownell are one of the predictable DCAs. They will send you a few harassing letters, then a couple of "offers" of full and final settlement in an attempt to con money out of you so they can still make a profit on the extremely low sum they will have paid for this dross, and finally a "we give up" letter.

 

You would be very unlucky indeed if you could not see this over the six year target line.

 

SH

 

PS If you do use Letter 'N' from the templates, make sure you write "I ACKNOWLEDGE NO DEBT TO YOUR COMPANY, NOR TO ANY COMPANY YOU PURPORT TO REPRESENT" at the top. I am glad to see that the letter 'N' has now been updated to include the sentence "Note that these funds are not to be used for any other purpose."

 

You don't want to do anything which could be construed as an acknowledgement in writing, nor do you want to encourage these idiots to misappropriate your funds. It is a fair bet that with an alleged debt of this age, they will credit your £1 statutory fee to the account, and try to make out that it is a payment to restart the limitation clock. Don't give them any chance to argue this.

[henry147]

Many thanks Scabhunter

 

The details of the debt are indeed mine - not sure about the ammount though?

 

I will get the letter off and hope like you say Crap One have not got the paperwork.

 

Will update you on this as soon as I hear anything

 

Many thanks once again for your advice and also Goldlady too.

 

and also hopefully a Merry Christmas to everyone.

 

H

[blipvert]

and don't forget. Don't sign the letter, print your name,

[henry147]

Hi again

 

The letter (N) I am about to send off - Had I better send it registered?

 

Many thanks

[Ell-enn]

Hi there, send the letter recorded delivery (or special delivery), keep a copy of the letter together with the receipt for posting. Check on the Royalmail website in a few days to print off the signature receipt. Keep all together safe in case you need to prove they received it (we wouldn't want them to say they didn't get it )

 

Print on the back of the postal order "payment for CCA request only".

 

Kind Regards

 

Ell-enn

[henry147]

Thanks Ell-enn

 

for all your advice - I will do all you suggest:)

 

cheers

 

Henry

[miaow99]

Just a thought - you might consider holding out a little longer before you send the "I acknowledge no debt to your company - prove it" letter.

 

Remember that it will take a little time for them to process the letter, then more time for them to trying to find an agreement, all of which gets you closer to october 2009.

 

Of course, it's a balancing act between dragging it out and not leaving it so long that they issue a claim.

[henry147]

Sorry folks

 

Just another thought

 

Does it make any difference who I send the letter to?

Lowell Financial Ltd or Lowell Portfolio1 ?

 

I do not want it to go to the wrong ones and the right one uses it as an exscuse,

 

and Miaow99 - I take on board what you say - I was thinking the end of next week sometime to get Christmas over with first.

 

Thanks once again folks.

[ScabHunter]

In the love letter they sent you it says that the account has been sold to Clownell Portfailio, and that Clownell Farcical have been appointed as the agents.

 

What that means is, whichever bunch of goons (who are all the same anyway) you send the request to, they will have no excuse not to comply with it.

 

It tells you to send all communications to Clownell Farcical so I would do that.

 

SH

[henry147]

Hi Folks

 

I sent off CCA request to Lowells

They signed and recieved it at the end of dec

Sent me a letter acknowledging my request a week later

 

Have now recieved a letter 15 days after they recieved my request stating that- Cap One have requested that my credit agreement be retieved form archive,

 

and that once it has been retrieved I will be required to pay the outstanding balance in full and if deemed neccesary may initiate legal proceedings which could eventualy see my outstanding balance increase due to court costs and interest.

 

They also say in an attempt to resolve this matter in an amicable way they would like to offer me a settelment to bring this matter to a close and as long as payment is with them in 14 days they are willing to accept xxx amount ( this works out at only 40% of the original debt ) as full and final settelment. If payment is not recieved within the time we reserve the right to proceed to collect the full balance. If I want to take the offer ring the number below blah blah etc.

 

My questions are why would they offer me a 60% discount on the debt if the requested CCA could be retrieved from archive?

 

also could anyone advise me of my next steps I should take

 

Should I send of a letter stating they are in breach of my request or wait and see what they plan to do next?

 

Many thanks in advance.