Log Book Loans want to take my car. I dont owe then anything.

[jolygreengiant]

Dear All

 

 

I slightly different tail.

Any help and advice will be gratefully received.

 

 

I bought a 2003 Nissan X-Trail low mileage, however it was declared off road.

 

Front window broken, bald tyres, no MoT, dead battery, you get the picture.

 

I got the V5 and the SORN from the seller.

 

Fixed it up, MoT’d etc.

 

However I have just found out the guy I got it from hasn’t cleared a LBL loan.

Hence LBL have threatened to come to my house to remove the car, even though it is registered in my name.

 

If the car is in my garage they will break in to remove it.

 

I hold my hands up; I was stupid not doing an HPI check.

 

Do I have a leg to stand on to keep the car?

 

The seller has moved from where I bought the car. I have his new address and new mobile number. However LBL don’t seem interested in trying to recover from the borrower, merely take the car from me.

 

 

The bill of sale was registered 10 days after signing, witnessed by a LBL underwriter.

 

 

Again any advice gratefully received.

 

Attached FilesJKZ6208BOS.pdf (96.7 KB, 2 views)

Edited December 8, 2008 by slick132
spelling error; link added from other (merged) thread

[sillygirl1]

You are not the person who took the loan out - therefore they will be stealing if they try to take the car from you. You need to take anything you have and go to the police and report them.

 

I'm not an expert on this subject but somebody should be along soon to give more advice.

[Conniff]

If a loan or hire purchase agreement is still outstanding on a car, the finance company will retain a legal interest in the vehicle until the loan is repaid in full. If the loan is not repaid, the car could be repossessed.

 

You need to write to them and ask them to give you legal title. They may agree and give you that title for free or agree as long as you pay what is outstanding.

 

If you should be asked to pay the outstanding finance, you could do this and then issue a summons in court for recovery of that amount from the person who sold it to you.

[jolygreengiant]

Thankyou.

 

The car is only worth about £3,500. The last owner owes LBL £4k, from a £2k loan 18 months ago. I cant afford to pay other peoples debts. Got enough of my own.

 

My disgust is that they are uninterested in persueing the last owner (lender).

 

Basically I will loose the money I paid for the car, plus the the money spent putting it back on the road. Never mind the time and now anguish.

 

Thanks for replying.

[Conniff]

At the end of the day jgg, the car was not the last owners to sell, it belonged to the finance company who have paid the dealer, and now that he no longer has it, they don't have the security of taking the car back off him.

 

Even if they do come and reposses the car, you can still take the seller to court to recover the amount you paid him and any out of pocket expenses as well.

 

Don't just let it lie, get onto LBL and see what arrangement you can come to and then decide if you can't afford it. Do it by letter though, not the telephone.

 

Any correspondence should always state that you bought the car in good faith.

[SteeveF]

Actually this is not correct. Log Book Loans are a Loan on the V5. NO Dealer is involved As long as you can support the fact you paid legitamately for the vehicle a fair market price, didnt buy it from a pal cheap etc. You are an inncent purchaser and thus have legal title. LBL have a debt with the Agreement holder and not you. They cant break into your property to take possesion , take other goods you own etc. Keep the car locked away until you have a letter from them giving you title.

Steve

[jolygreengiant]

Thankyou SteeveF.

 

I was aware of Conniff's misunderstanding.

 

I paid good money for the car. What's more gutting is the money spent putting it right.

 

The problem I'm having is sorting the Bil of Sale. It doesnt seem to have been registered correctly, hence hopefully I can sort it that way.

 

From other forums LBL seem hard to work with.

 

Do you have experience with them, as your clearly understand how they set up their finance arrangements?

[SteeveF]

The Bill of Sale , you mean the original loan agreement? Wait for them, in the meantime if you havnt done so already , obtain proof of purchase, ie. how you became aware the car was for sale (local Newspaper internet , roadside ad etc ) , how you paid,( bankers draft, cash withdrawal, statement copy ) unless your in the motor trade then if you have all the relevant info then you are ok. They will drag their heels but the ball is mostly in their court as they say! If they made mistakes on the agreement etc, its nothing to do with you. Because they lend on V5, its down to them to control their asset

Steve

[jolygreengiant]

Thanks again SteeveF.

 

I have the V5 100% in my name.

[Fleeced73]

Fight them, fight them tooth & nail and fight dirty if you have to. Be aware, their 'agents' use very underhand and often unlawful tactics to seize cars knowing the police aren't interested in 'civil matters'. My advice to you is to get that car hidden somewhere safe until you have a clear legal position established or you will soon be a car down and they will have the upper hand. As to any moral implications, they are just not interested so don't waste your time looking for their good side, they don't have one.

Also, do not believe any of the lies told told by their agents about 'police searching for the car, it's stolen', or 'orders of the high court' they will say anything to get you to capitulate.

In all probability, the amount paid to them by the previous owner will be a lot more than he borrowed - they are in the business of having their cake (extortionate interest and set-up costs) and eating it (whack on dubious charges & take the car as well) - but you will need to challenge them legally ASAP or you will lose.

[sillygirl1]

You would know if you had a High Court order, these aren't handed out in default if you don't show, so they do tell porkies on this one. Whilst I don't own a car and can't help with the legalities that side I am willing to help on the 'civil matter' side which the police love hiding under.

[jolygreengiant]

Dear reader.

I have had some positive news.

Having had the Bill of Sale read by 2 solicitors, there is a minefield of errors any one of which would render the Sale invalid.

Please please please fight Log Book Loans. Don’t give up.

It cost nothing to go to the Citizen's Advice Bureau. They have challenged LBL previously and won. They are only too happy to assist.

MAIN POINTS TO CONSIDER:

The Bill of sale has to be registered within 7 days.

No ifs, no and, no buts, and the 7 days is not workings days. Weekends and holidays count.

The witness cannot be connected to the company.

The wording has to be exactly right.

LBL stand by their Bill of Sale. Here lyes the problem. The Bill of Sale is not theirs. Think of it as a government document. Any alterations render it null & void.

I hope this helps the countless affected by this loan shark company.

GOOD LUCK.

[bartonsmith]

hi please could you give my some more info on this matter. it has just happened to me but they have got my car. came home one day and it was gone. what is the bill of sale? i bought the vechile off someone who had a lbl on it.

thanks

Edited April 14, 2009 by bartonsmith

[wearecarless]

Sorry to hear you lost your car. The same happened to us in December 2008. Read the thread ARE YOU A THIRD PARTY VICTIM by wearecarless. We had our story in the daily mirror in march as we were given a fake hpi check on the car we had took from us. We have a solicitor looking into our case who have told us we have a good case.

 

You will find that as a third party you have no claim to the car that was took from you, other than taking the person you got the car from to court for fraud at your own expense.

[Sad sam]

Oh gosh guys

 

This sounds awful.

 

I do feel for you all.

 

How does this evolve in this day and age.

[jolygreengiant]

Dear All

LBL have now issued a Court Claim form, dated some four months ago.

Not fully filled in.

I find this interesting; I have not taken out a loan agreement with LBL, yet they pursue me and not the person who borrowed the money in the first place.

Anyway I am being sued for:

Taking possession of the car without their permission.

Converted the motor vehicle for my own use.

Damages for the conversion

Plus they claim interest.

Has anyone seen this before?

Thanks

[Fleeced73]

Their solicitor has so much to do, he does tend to cock up these claims forms. The person instigating the attempts at litigation is LBL director Iain Shearer, and they have already had cases struck as 'Abuse of Court Process' so fight it!

[Fleeced73]

Their solicitor has so much to do, he does tend to cock up these claims forms. The person instigating the attempts at litigation is LBL director Iain Shearer, and they have already had cases struck as 'Abuse of Court Process' so fight it!

[jolygreengiant]

Dear Victim of LBL

Perhaps there is hope!

I have contacted the Court regarding LBL claims against me.

There was a hearing in March, which I was unaware of.

The Judge through the case out as LBL could not prove that I had been served.

LBL asked the Judge ‘What should we do now’?

The Judge stated that he was not there to offer legal advice.

Just perhaps the antics of this company are filtering through, and the powers that be are not standing for it.

Fight, fight, fight.

I hope this brings a little positiveness to those affected by vultures.

[trooper68]

hi please could you give my some more info on this matter. it has just happened to me but they have got my car. came home one day and it was gone. what is the bill of sale? i bought the vechile off someone who had a lbl on it.

thanks

 

Your car was STOLEN, no ifs, no buts, plain and simple.

 

Contact police, report it stolen, it is no a civil matter if the police states it is so..You are the owner and Keeper. Section 12 of the Theft Act 1967 -Produce your V5 and Recipt for the car (if you have one)

If the police still refuses take his/her number and report it to the Police complains commision. They MUST invistigate, duty by Law as a complaint has been made.

Send this off to them by registerd post

 

I make this complaint because on [DATE] the bailiff executed an invalid levy by taking a motor vehicle [MAKE AND MODEL] registration [ABC 123] belonging to me as collateral for somebody elses debt.

The motor vehicle is my own property and the bailiff has taken it as a colateral for somebody elses debt I understand to be a [traffic offence] [or] similar debt which may have been committed by a previous registered keeper or owner. I also understand the bailiff is committing an offence under Section 12 of the Theft Act 1967 and I reported the vehicle stolen to the police who said [they could not get involved/it's a civil matter].

I attach a copy a copy of the V5 to confirm I am the lawful owner of the vehicle.

[The vehicle is a necessary tool for my day to day business function and I understand these types of goods are exempt from being used as colateral by a bailiff in any event.]

I tried to seek an amicable resolve with the bailiff who ignored my request.

I ask for my vehicle to be immediately returned to me at no cost to myself and undamaged and ask that I am compensated for my financial losses in relation to this levy and in aquiring a replacement a rental vehicle whilst my vehicle was in the bailiff's possession.

SIGN {your Name} DATE

(edit to suit)

they will try to sell the car and you will need to make up the outstanding. do it quick. If the car has been sold you will need to report that to the police (usally these guys are part time dealers who sell the cars between them off the books for far below price) If anyone buys it the police will have it flagged as stolen.

[TV_researcher]

I'm a researcher for the BBC and interested in hearing people's experiences with Log book Loans, contact me on 07841698942. Thanks

[Conniff]

I'm a researcher for the BBC and interested in hearing people's experiences with Log book Loans, contact me on 07841698942. Thanks

 

How about a landline number to make it more of a genuine enquiry and not just spam.

[TV_researcher]

Hi - apologies, the mobile is handier, but landline is 02890 338380 or [email protected]

[Conniff]

No need for apologies - just so much spam around now. I hope you get all the assistance you require.

 

I think most people are happier with email rather than telephone especially in the first contact.

 

 

 

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Edited September 27, 2009 by Conniff

[applecart]

Hi Laura

 

You advise that you are looking for 'experiences'.......

 

Perhaps you would be good enough to impart on us what the documentary will cover, considering this forum does go to some length to outline personal experiences of those clearly affected by their involvement with Log Book Loans.

 

My thoughts are, that whilst there is a wealth of 'experiences' that can be gained within the forum that your time and interest would be best used researching the civil right of those affected by entering into agreements that are secured by way of a Bill of Sale.

 

This, of course would mean that you provide the public at large with information advising them in any forthcoming programme, what the Bill of Sale is, what it's purpose is, how to defend in a court of law when an invalid Bill of Sale is executed etc etc

 

And.... then add within your programme, the role of the various bodies set up to protect the consumer and what they are doing to protect them, or not as the case may be.

 

You could perhaps report on the role of the OFT - and the extensive length of time the processes take to bring unscrupulous lenders to task.

 

Then perhaps you could look at the Government and ask questions as to why it is - that whilst they are actively implemented new regulations at the drop of a hat - that this information can take too long to get to the average man in the street?

 

This represents just a few of my thoughts - but I'm sure such a programme with relevant and constructive content would better justify the licence payers costs in the current economy - don't you think?