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    • I came across this discussion recently and just wanted to give my experience of A Shade Greener that may help others regarding their boiler finance agreement.
       
      We had a 10yr  finance contract for a boiler fitted July 2015.
       
      After a summer of discontent with ASG I discovered that if you have paid HALF the agreement or more you can legally return the boiler to them at no cost to yourself. I've just returned mine the feeling is liberating.
       
      It all started mid summer during lockdown when they refused to service our boiler because we didn't have a loft ladder or flooring installed despite the fact AS installed the boiler. and had previosuly serviced it without issue for 4yrs. After consulting with an independent installer I was informed that if this was the case then ASG had breached building regulations,  this was duly reported to Gas Safe to investigate and even then ASG refused to accept blame and repeatedly said it was my problem. Anyway Gas Safe found them in breach of building regs and a compromise was reached.
       
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      The boiler was removed and replaced by a reputable installer,  and the old boiler was returned to ASG thus ending our contract with them. What's mad is I saved in excess of £1000 in the long run and got a new boiler with a brand new 12yr warranty. 
       
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    • Dazza a few months ago I discovered a good friend of mine who had ten debts with cards and catalogues which he was slavishly paying off at detriment to his own family quality of life, and I mean hardship, not just absence of second holidays or flat screen TV's.
       
      I wrote to all his creditors asking for supporting documents and not one could provide any material that would allow them to enforce the debt.
       
      As a result he stopped paying and they have been unable to do anything, one even admitted it was unenforceable.
       
      If circumstances have got to the point where you are finding it unmanageable you must ask yourself why you feel the need to pay.  I guarantee you that these companies have built bad debt into their business model and no one over there is losing any sleep over your debt to them!  They will see you as a victim and cash cow and they will be reluctant to discuss final offers, only ways to keep you paying with threats of court action or seizing your assets if you have any.
       
      They are not your friends and you owe them no loyalty or moral duty, that must remain only for yourself and your family.
       
      If it was me I would send them all a CCA request.   I would bet that not one will provide the correct response and you can quite legally stop paying them until such time as they do provide a response.   Even when they do you should check back here as they mostly send dodgy photo copies or generic rubbish that has no connection with your supposed debt.
       
      The money you are paying them should, as far as you are able, be put to a savings account for yourself and as a means of paying of one of these fleecers should they ever manage to get to to the point of a successful court judgement.  After six years they will not be able to start court action and that money will then become yours.
       
      They will of course pursue you for the funds and pass your file around various departments of their business and out to third parties.
       
      Your response is that you should treat it as a hobby.  I have numerous files of correspondence each faithfully organised showing the various letters from different DCA;s , solicitors etc with a mix of threats, inducements and offers.   It is like my stamp collection and I show it to anyone who is interested!
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Harassment by MBNA


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If anyone would like to help with witness statements - recounting what the MBNA telephone and text strategies are please Private Message me.

I am also happy to reciprocate and offer help where I am able to.

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To all those that I sent the draft witness statement to, I am told it was password protected and would not open - do contact me if you need a different template.

 

I must have a number of these before I can sit down with my lawyer and launch the action against MBNA

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As part of my wifes action in the County Court we have included in the particulars of claim the harrassment recieved by MBNA.

 

I would be grateful for any telephone calls and details from people prepared to make witness statements about their own experience of harassment from MBNA - and especially anythin odd like calling with the ID of another company or contacting any family member about a debt.

 

Also, if anyone has been defaulted while the account is in dispute please contact me.

 

I believe if we win this claim in the court it will lead to MBNA being fined by the FSA for a breach of TCF principles.

 

My husband defaulted whilst acc in dispute, as im sure i will shortly be also. however they have an out by saying they have complied with sec 77and 78 of cca and sent a true copy. what constitutes a true copy isnt what we think it should be... this means they wont accept that the account is in dispute... iv been over this with trading standards and a solicitor and this is how they get around the dispute issue. rats.

muffintop

Won Nationwide £900 and £1908 Bank Charges

Lloyds personal account 1,861

Lloyds Bus Account 2k

Abbey bank acc. Stayed 2008

 

CCA requested Barclaycard Nov 08 - n1 issued - GAVE UP

CCA Mbna Nov 08- n1 issued - GAVE UP

Marks and Spencer Money Nov 08 -lost found 2b enforceable.

Tomson Holiday - WON

 

if I help you tip my little scales it gives me a thrill. MT

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Do please send me all the information about this strategy that you can with a PM.

 

This is my interpretation of the matter:

 

1. Only a properly executed credit agreement can be defaulted.

2. The burdon of proof is on the creditor to show it is properly executed.

3. Failure to provide a copy of an agreement with a signature precludes the creditor from defaulting the account since it is an essential ingredient in demonstrating a properly executed agreement.

 

I would be interested in the name and contact details of the trading standards officer that has a different opinion to this.

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what is your basis for saying that only a properly executed credit agreement can be defaulted? You cancertainly be defaulted on, say, a £35k second mortgage which is not regulated and therefore has no requirement for being properly executed (s61 does not apply)

Steven

 

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Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability. Do not take any legal action on my advice alone. Almost everything I know concerning the law I learned from this site.

 

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You can only default on the basis of a breach in contractual terms.

A contract is an agreement to those terms in a written contract.

If an agreement is not properly executed (signed) it does not constitute a binding contract.

 

Furthermore all contract terms must be present at the time of signing or it is arguably an agreement to agree.

 

A default must be notified to the credit reference agencies - without a signature agreeing this - information cannot be passed on as it is a breach of data protection laws.

 

Finally, if the default is registered after a claim is served for non-compliance, but before a hearing - CPR pre-action protocols should be shown to have been observed and this is difficult without a proof of signed contract

 

what is your basis for saying that only a properly executed credit agreement can be defaulted? You cancertainly be defaulted on, say, a £35k second mortgage which is not regulated and therefore has no requirement for being properly executed (s61 does not apply)
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There is a big difference between an agreement merely being signed and being properly executed. To be properly executed it must also conform with all the provisions set out in schedule 1 to the Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations 1983

Steven

 

Using CAG Toolbar will generate much needed income - Download Here

 

Confused by Simple Interest? Confounded by Compound Interest? Read my Interest Tutorial

My Wins

 GE Money Won unconditionally May 2007

NatWest Won unconditionally August 2007

Brighthouse Won unconditionally August 2007

Goldfish Won unconditionally April 2008 (including CI on the basis of Sempra)

Clydesdale Financial Services (now BPF) Won unconditionally February 2008

 

Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability. Do not take any legal action on my advice alone. Almost everything I know concerning the law I learned from this site.

 

Please note, I will not give advice by PM. Please send a link to your thread and I will do my best to answer there.

 

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You are correct of course in the case of a product issued under a regulated agreement , but since you correctly brought up the case of an unregulated agreement (perhaps a Buy to Let mortgage), then the issue is that if it is signed and there is agreement to the terms, the other requirements you mention are not applicable (as you pointed out earlier).

 

However, that said, just because an agreement is unregulated does not mean it can bind an unsuspecting consumer to terms that are judged to be unfair.

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absolutely

Steven

 

Using CAG Toolbar will generate much needed income - Download Here

 

Confused by Simple Interest? Confounded by Compound Interest? Read my Interest Tutorial

My Wins

 GE Money Won unconditionally May 2007

NatWest Won unconditionally August 2007

Brighthouse Won unconditionally August 2007

Goldfish Won unconditionally April 2008 (including CI on the basis of Sempra)

Clydesdale Financial Services (now BPF) Won unconditionally February 2008

 

Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability. Do not take any legal action on my advice alone. Almost everything I know concerning the law I learned from this site.

 

Please note, I will not give advice by PM. Please send a link to your thread and I will do my best to answer there.

 

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Hi All

 

SO you guys are saying that if MBNA fails to provide me the signed (my signature) copy of agreement they are cannot enforce the debit and can not take any legal action against me?

At the moment I am bombared with calls from them every hour although contacted payplan for DMP (I was introduced to payplan By MBNA).

I have made two voluntarily token payments in a week to MBNA but they still passing it to debit collection agancy?

I am diabetic and having sleepless nights .

Please help me with the above question have I understood it correctly or have made myself a total Fool.

I am a newbie here Please help me steve and others.

I shall be grateful to all of you.

MBNA has made me sick and Harassed while other lenders especially Capital one are very helpful (so far).

Please Reply

Hussy

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Hi Hussy786

 

Welcome to CAG

 

THe simple answer to your question is that MBNA cannot take any action against you if they cannot produce a document signed by you with the prescribed terms on it (prescribed terms are a statament about your credit limit, a statement about repayment terms and a statement about the interest rate) and with a statement about your rights to cancel.

 

I should note also that the above does not automatically apply if your MBNA card was taken out after the CCA 2006 came into force (which I think was 1 January 2007 - no doubt someone will correct me if I have remembered wrongly)

Steven

 

Using CAG Toolbar will generate much needed income - Download Here

 

Confused by Simple Interest? Confounded by Compound Interest? Read my Interest Tutorial

My Wins

 GE Money Won unconditionally May 2007

NatWest Won unconditionally August 2007

Brighthouse Won unconditionally August 2007

Goldfish Won unconditionally April 2008 (including CI on the basis of Sempra)

Clydesdale Financial Services (now BPF) Won unconditionally February 2008

 

Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability. Do not take any legal action on my advice alone. Almost everything I know concerning the law I learned from this site.

 

Please note, I will not give advice by PM. Please send a link to your thread and I will do my best to answer there.

 

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Hi steve

 

Thank you for your Kind reply. My MBNA card is i Think 2003/2004 well before 2006.

So what it means to me.

Please explain briefly.

Sorry for being thick lol

Hussy

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THanks VS - I couldn't quite remenber (and TBH couldn't be bothered to look it up knowing that someone like youir good self would be along in a minute :D)

 

What it means to you is as in the first main paragraph of my post above.

Steven

 

Using CAG Toolbar will generate much needed income - Download Here

 

Confused by Simple Interest? Confounded by Compound Interest? Read my Interest Tutorial

My Wins

 GE Money Won unconditionally May 2007

NatWest Won unconditionally August 2007

Brighthouse Won unconditionally August 2007

Goldfish Won unconditionally April 2008 (including CI on the basis of Sempra)

Clydesdale Financial Services (now BPF) Won unconditionally February 2008

 

Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability. Do not take any legal action on my advice alone. Almost everything I know concerning the law I learned from this site.

 

Please note, I will not give advice by PM. Please send a link to your thread and I will do my best to answer there.

 

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Hi steve

 

Sorry I was bit confused or rather over excited. I was actually meant to ask that is it True that unenforceable credit means that it is unlawful and Lender have no right to pursue the payment.

I am baffled as there are Companies here In Bham saying that it means I dont have to Pay MBNA a single penny but 10% to Them (companies:eek:) to get my debits wiped off.

 

so That is why. Obviously if i have 10% I would rather pay towards my debits. How true it is and does anyone has got their debits wiped of in this way.

 

Sorry for being pain :razz:

Hussy

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Some people do, no doubt. Our attitude is why pay someone 10% when you can do it yourself for nothing.

 

An unenforceable agreement means just that - they would not be able to get a court to enforce it. The debt would still be there, just that MBNA would not be able to collect it and, in theory, not be able to sell it on or issue a default.

 

In practice, though, they do both and you have to fight them to get the default remoed.

 

Plus there is the moral issue of having had the money and not paying it back. If you have had the card for a while, at their interest rates, I would guess that you have paid back what you owed and then some.

 

In theory, you could just stop paying, wait for them to well the debt and then for the purchaser to take you to court and then fight them (with our help of course :)). MBNA never take people to court themselves. In the end you would win, but it would be hard work and there is a small risk that a court might find against you initially (as lots of district judges seem woefully unaware of the consumer credit act) but you would evemtually win on appeal.

 

An alternative is to write to MBNA, tell them that the agreement is unenforceable and why and make them an offer, say 3p to 4p in the pound as afull and final settlement. (3p-4p in the pound is what they would get if they sold the debt).

 

The letter could go something lke this:

 

Dear MBNA

 

Thank you for the copy of the agreement you have sent me. I have taken advice and I am convinced it is unenforceable becaue it deos not have both my signature and the prescribed terms as required by s127(3) of the consumer Credit Act 1974.

 

I therefore have decided not to pay you any more on this account.

 

I am fully aware that you do not take people to court as a matter of policy but sell accounts like this to a debt collection agency. This would be a lot of bother for both of us and you would only get a few pence in the pound for the account anyway.

 

I am therefore willing to make a full and final offer of £xxxx to close the account and end my relationship with MBNA. This offer is valid for 30 days.

 

I look forward to hearing from you.

 

Hussy786

What do you think? (indeed what does anyone else think?):)

Steven

 

Using CAG Toolbar will generate much needed income - Download Here

 

Confused by Simple Interest? Confounded by Compound Interest? Read my Interest Tutorial

My Wins

 GE Money Won unconditionally May 2007

NatWest Won unconditionally August 2007

Brighthouse Won unconditionally August 2007

Goldfish Won unconditionally April 2008 (including CI on the basis of Sempra)

Clydesdale Financial Services (now BPF) Won unconditionally February 2008

 

Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability. Do not take any legal action on my advice alone. Almost everything I know concerning the law I learned from this site.

 

Please note, I will not give advice by PM. Please send a link to your thread and I will do my best to answer there.

 

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Here is a claim thrown out today because of unenforceable CCA http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/178543-help-court-court-claim.html

Steven

 

Using CAG Toolbar will generate much needed income - Download Here

 

Confused by Simple Interest? Confounded by Compound Interest? Read my Interest Tutorial

My Wins

 GE Money Won unconditionally May 2007

NatWest Won unconditionally August 2007

Brighthouse Won unconditionally August 2007

Goldfish Won unconditionally April 2008 (including CI on the basis of Sempra)

Clydesdale Financial Services (now BPF) Won unconditionally February 2008

 

Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability. Do not take any legal action on my advice alone. Almost everything I know concerning the law I learned from this site.

 

Please note, I will not give advice by PM. Please send a link to your thread and I will do my best to answer there.

 

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Hi Steve

 

Thank you very Much . Yes as for as moral point of this debit is concerned To be perfectly honest with you I probably have paid them twice if not more from the amount I originally borrowd from them. I never have luxrious life on credit cards and used them in emergency (unexpected utility bills or car repairs) these debits are just mounted up (spiral) by their interest rates charges and few late payments. Even if they honestly work out the actual debit and If i still owe them few hundered pounds I am willing to pay them but not the current debit.

I have template (from here) asking them to provide the copy of my agreement) but was not sure that shall I post them and request that.

MBNA has given me written threat that they will pass the debit on DCA and were calling me every hour. I have made them token payment of £10 day before yesterday and since then have not received call from them.

so I am confused a little that shall I proceed to ask them agreement details as not sure what would happen if I do. On a personal front I am diabetic now and have High blood sugar levels and having sleepless nights.

I know your time is precious but If you kindly feel that you can guide me more on that I shall be really Grateful.

Keep smiling:p

Edited by Hussy786

Hussy

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  • 1 month later...

49 signatures on the No.10 petition so far - COME ON PEOPLE :evil:

 

Petition to: Request a special investigation by the FSA and OFT into the harrassment by consumers and their families through the debt collection practices of MBNA and specifically the practices related to telephone calls and defaults while in dispute

 

 

 

 

Please check your spam folder for the acknowledgement email so you can respond and include your name on the list. Thank you :)

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Duly Signed:D

If any of my posts are helpful, please feel free to click my scales. All information is given as my opinion only, based on my own personal experiences. I have no legal training, but have educated myself in aspects of consumer legislation. My motto "NEVER GIVE IN, NEVER SURRENDER", THERE IS A WAR ON YOU KNOW

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  • 4 weeks later...

Hi all, am glad I have come across this website and forum. I am having harrassment from MBNA too. I contacted them first to ask for interest to be frozen and to be honest re my financial situation, what a mistake! I spent ages on the phone in one call going through all my incomings/outgoings and was told they would consider my situation as it appears I am suffering sever hardship re money and I didnt hear anything back for a while until RMA started hassling me.

 

I rang MBNA and was told that someone ad deleted all the details I had given re my situation and that it had been cancelled and basically its a ploy for them to not try and help but to just pass to their inhouse debt agancy.

 

I have had several calls from RMA and I have made calls to MBNA and I get the same rubbish about how they will look into it and stop RMA etc, all lies from MBNA. I have tried to sort it with them and they arnt interested they just want to squeeze the life out of me instead.

 

This website looks very helpful re advise and templates and I can sympathy with everyone havng hassle from MBNA. I have told them on the phone that it is harrassment and I am under a Mental Health Advisor at present. I await their next move.

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