Appealing a ticket - how long for them to respond?

[katym609]

I received a parking ticket after waiting for too long on a single yellow line - the signage was a bit vague and took a bit longer than I expected to carry my friend upstairs (picking up for a hospital visit).

 

Directly in front of this lamppost, half on the kerb as it says but on a single yellow...

I wasn't causing any obstruction but I'm guessing I was probably officially in the wrong - "Parked on a restricted street during perscribed hours" apparently.

 

Anyway.. I wrote a letter the same day asking if they could let me off and didn't hear back for 1.5 months until now I have a reply to my letter saying that I've not made the case for cancellation (looks very mailmatched standard letter)

 

That seems to be too long for a reply and also I've not got the 'Notice to owner' they say I should have after 28 days.

 

Should I pay up now as it's £60, or just wait until they send something else and then complain and possibly end up paying £120?

[lamma]

need full details - there are applicable exemptions but can't tell if they apply without full knowledge. Pictures of the ALL of PCN - suitably washed of personal details, plus any letters from council, NTO and pictures of the signs and markings at the location.

[katym609]

Wasn't sure how much to blank out as I'm sure they could guess who I am from this, or if that matters...

 

Here's the PCN...

http://up2.it/katym609/pcn.png

 

Here's the letter I got, dated 29th oct, rec'd on monday (yeah, I probably should have dealt with this earlier in the week!):

http://up2.it/katym609/pcnletter.png

 

Sorry I don't have pics of the markings - I'll see if I can get my friend to take some pics.... the yellow line goes from the T junction with another road up to just after this lamppost pictured above which I was parked directly in front of - there was a car parked over the end of the line at the time so didn't realise the line stopped before most of the parked cars there.

 

Thanks.

[lamma]

PCN has two sides...

[katym609]

indeed it does ....

http://up2.it/katym609/pcnback.png

[Guest Ting]

The sign, (640.2 I believe) does not prohibit you at all as far as I can see.

 

I can only think that this is in one of the controlled parking zones and the sign is just indicating additioanl restrictions. Can't find maps on website.

 

Peculiar that they haven't said this in their reply?

 

Phone and ask if ennersdale rd is in a CPZ - then restrictions are signed at the entrances to zone - fair enough - BUT

 

Sounds to me from your description that you have a case of 'assisted boarding/alighting' and cases have been won on that issue. Yes fair enough for a PCN to be issued if you were gone for a while and CEO saw no activity but once you explain it then it should be cancelled.

 

You didn't actually say what your initial appeal said?

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[katym609]

Thanks for the reply...

 

I said prettymuch that - fair enough it was issued but please cancel it as I was just inside picking someone up to take them to A&E, and the signage is unclear anyway.

(don't have a copy of what I sent to hand)

 

SE13 5JD .. it's just off hither green road which according to http://www.lewisham.gov.uk/NR/rdonlyres/A2EBF1CD-8EB1-4165-8A8A-491604841F64/0/HitherGreenEastCPZDetailsFormsNov07.pdf this isn't in a CPZ - I've parked further down the street many times without problems (well, apart from having my motorbike nicked, but that's another story!)

[Guest Ting]

I'm getting very lost on the maps. can't find ennersdale on the A-Z to compare - with my old eyes.

 

If you are right then I can't see any contravention to start with. Why don't you just phone to ask to confirm if in CPZ?

 

Otherwise you fall back on two things-

 

a) Case law to support the 'assisted' issue i mentioned. Just from memory - and i hope this isn't something else entirely - Manaambwa v Newham.

There was also a case in Basildon I recall but can't remember if it went as far as Adjudication. Basically both said that you are allowed time to board or alight a passenger who requires assistance - and quite right too.

 

b) Although I think Lewisham claimed to have considered what you said it was quite clear that, in one sentence of dismissal, they hadn't really. They didn't, for instance ask for any evidence of the hospital attendance - and they had every opportunity to do so. they fell quickly back on the 'restricted street' issue.

Now, whilst discretion is just that - up to the Council - the failure to consider the matters you raise becomes a legal matter - they are required to do so.

An Adjudicator cannot rule on a matter of discretion but can rule on a failure to consider it. Also, the above cases say that there was no contravention anyway and Lewisham made no attempt, after what you told them, to find out the true facts.

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No garauntees, just my opinion. Up to you how you use it.

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[katym609]

It's not part of the CPZ.

.. so is the "parked on a restricted street..." bit only meant for CPZ violations and not for parking on a yellow line?

[Guest Ting]

A single yellow line means nothing on it's own. It needs 'plates' to describe restrictions. If in a CPZ (noted you say not) then the blanket restrictions for the zone apply.

The sign shown does not prohibit you at all as far as i can see. Seems to apply to vehicles over a certain weight and buses and at times way outside the time you parked.

 

In short, based on what you have shown and described, they have lied to you.

Not unusual for a response to an informal challenge - dealt with by the post boy. Next stage can go as high as the cleaning supervisor!

IMO, they play a percentage game - how many will fall for this and pay! they have the stats so they know it works for them.

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even if there is a restriction you still have a case re the other things i mentioned.

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