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    • The Notice to Hirer does not comply with the protection of Freedoms Act 2012 Schedule  4 . This is before I ask if Europarks have sent you a copy of the PCN they sent to Arval along with a copy of the hire agreement et. if they haven't done that either you are totally in the clear and have nothing to worry about and nothing to pay. The PCN they have sent you is supposed to be paid by you according to the Act within 21 days. The chucklebuts have stated 28 days which is the time that motorists have to pay. Such a basic and simple thing . The Act came out in 2012 and still they cannot get it right which is very good news for you. Sadly there is no point in telling them- they won't accept it because they lose their chance to make any money out of you. they are hoping that by writing to you demanding money plus sending in their  unregulated debt collectors and sixth rate solicitors that you might be so frightened as to pay them money so that you can sleep at night. Don't be surprised if some of their letters are done in coloured crayons-that's the sort of  level of people you will be dealing with. Makes great bedding for the rabbits though. Euro tend not to be that litigious but while you can safely ignore the debt collectors just keep an eye out for a possible Letter of Claim. They are pretty rare but musn't be ignored. Let us know so that you can send a suitably snotty letter to them showing that you are not afraid of them and are happy to go to Court as you like winning.  
    • They did reply to my defence stating it would fail and enclosed copies of NOA, DN Term letter and account statements. All copies of T&C's that could be reconstructions and the IP address on there resolves to the town where MBNA offices are, not my location
    • Here are 7 of our top tips to help you connect with young people who have left school or otherwise disengaged.View the full article
    • My defence was standard no paperwork:   1.The Defendant contends that the particulars of claim are generic in nature. The Defendant accordingly sets out its case below and relies on CPR r 16.5 (3) in relation to any particular allegation to which a specific response has not been made. 2. Paragraph 1 is noted. The Defendant has had a contractual relationship with MBNA Limited in the past. The Defendant does not recognise the reference number provided by the claimant within its particulars and has sought verification from the claimant who is yet to comply with requests for further information. 3. Paragraph 2 is denied. The Defendant maintains that a default notice was never received. The Claimant is put to strict proof to that a default notice was issued by MBNA Limited and received by the Defendant. 4. Paragraph 3 is denied. The Defendant is unaware of any legal assignment or Notice of Assignment allegedly served from either the Claimant or MBNA Limited. 5. On the 02/01/2023 the Defendant requested information pertaining to this claim by way of a CCA 1974 Section 78 request. The claimant is yet to respond to this request. On the 19/05/2023 a CPR 31.14 request was sent to Kearns who is yet to respond. To date, 02/06/2023, no documentation has been received. The claimant remains in default of my section 78 request. 6. It is therefore denied with regards to the Defendant owing any monies to the Claimant, the Claimant has failed to provide any evidence of proof of assignment being sent/ agreement/ balance/ breach or termination requested by CPR 31.14, therefore the Claimant is put to strict proof to: (a) show how the Defendant entered into an agreement; and (b) show and evidence the nature of breach and service of a default notice pursuant to Section 87(1) CCA1974 (c) show how the claimant has reached the amount claimed for; and (d) show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim; 7. As per Civil Procedure Rule 16.5(4), it is expected that the Claimant prove the allegation that the money is owed. 8. On the alternative, as the Claimant is an assignee of a debt, it is denied that the Claimant has the right to lay a claim due to contraventions of Section 136 of the Law of Property Act and Section 82A of the consumer credit Act 1974. 9. By reasons of the facts and matters set out above, it is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief.
    • Monika the first four pages of the Private parking section have at least 12 of our members who have also been caught out on this scam site. That's around one quarter of all our current complaints. Usually we might expect two current complaints for the same park within 4 pages.  So you are in good company and have done well in appealing to McDonalds in an effort to resolve the matter without having  paid such a bunch of rogues. Most people blindly pay up. Met . Starbucks and McDonalds  are well aware of the situation and seem unwilling to make it easier for motorists to avoid getting caught. For instance, instead of photographing you, if they were honest and wanted you  to continue using their services again, they would have said "Excuse me but if you are going to go to Mc donalds from here, it will cost you £100." But no they kett quiet and are now pursuing you for probably a lot more than £100 now. They also know thst  they cannot charge anything over the amount stated on the car park signs. Their claims for £160 or £170 are unlawful yet so many pay that to avoid going to Court. When the truth is that Met are unlikely to take them to Court since they know they will lose. The PCNs are issued on airport land which is covered by Byelaws so only the driver can be pursued, not the keeper. But they keep writing to you as they do not know who was driving unless you gave it away when you appealed. Even if they know you were driving they should still lose in Court for several reasons. The reason we ask you to fill out our questionnaire is to help you if MET do decide to take you to Court in the end. Each member who visited the park may well have different experiences while there which can help when filling out a Witness statement [we will help you with that if it comes to it.] if you have thrown away the original PCN  and other paperwork you obviously haven't got a jerbil or a guinea pig as their paper makes great litter boxes for them.🙂 You can send an SAR to them to get all the information Met have on you to date. Though if you have been to several sites already, you may have done that by now. In the meantime, you will be being bombarded by illiterate debt collectors and sixth rate solicitors all threatening you with ever increasing amounts as well as being hung drawn and quartered. Their letters can all be safely ignored. On the odd chance that you may get a Letter of Claim from them just come back to us and we will get you to send a snotty letter back to them so that they know you are not happy, don't care a fig for their threats and will see them off in Court if they finally have the guts to carry on. If you do have the original PCN could you please post it up, carefully removing your name. address and car registration number but including dates and times. If not just click on the SAR to take you to the form to send to Met.
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attention all rbs/natwest breaches of 77/78 requests under the cca 1974


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Allowing the recreation of agreements isn't part of the 1974 act - if it exists anywhere it would be a SI.

It might be just that the OFT said that it was OK.

Wherever it is, at best it would just be for the s77-79 request. Even then, there must be the presumption that they have enough info to get it right and that a bank would not just take a guess & produce any old document & T&Cs!

Who's using loopholes now?

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Think I'll be joining in also for my OH. He handed his CCA request for his unsecured 2005 loan into the branch on Friday 31st Oct. This was with his complaint - nothing from them yet, not a dickie bird.

 

The reason I really want to see it is, now that I know a bit more, the figures do not add up. When he was offered the loan he was quoted 5.9% - thought this was a great deal and went in to see them. When he came home after signing I cracked up because the agreement stated 6% something. We argued, he was still happy with the deal so let it go.

 

I have had a look and he seems to be paying way more than that - I still have the original somewhere (self confessed hoarder) and am dying to see what they supply.

 

As for re-creating agreements - WTF? This thread is a great idea as the only way to prove the OFT wrong is to prove that the bank's document control is in no way accurate or consistent enough to warrant that amount of leeway and trust. They might let the odd 'genuinely lost' agreement pass - but when it becomes habit?

 

Arrogant buggers:mad:

Dipply75

 

I am in no way a legal advisor and only speak from my own experiences and the helpful advice of those in the same boat! :p

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Allowing the recreation of agreements isn't part of the 1974 act - if it exists anywhere it would be a SI.

It might be just that the OFT said that it was OK.

Wherever it is, at best it would just be for the s77-79 request. Even then, there must be the presumption that they have enough info to get it right and that a bank would not just take a guess & produce any old document & T&Cs!

Who's using loopholes now?

 

Well worth a listen.

 

BBC - Radio 4 You and Yours -Royal Bank of Scotland debt mistake

An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last. <br />

Winston Churchill

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it appears that in 2000 the NatWest cards were issued by

 

NatWest Card Services

see

 

NatWest Card Services CRM Strategy Increases Profits With Prime Response Integrated Marketing Solution; NatWest Cards' CRM Investment Will Offer a Return in First Year | Business Wire | Find Articles at BNET

 

 

"CAMBRIDGE, Mass.--(BUSINESS WIRE)--April 11, 2000

NatWest Card Services, the major credit card issuer in the United Kingdom, has recognized some exciting results from its CRM strategy, through its use of Prime Response's (NASDAQ, EASDAQ: PRME), integrated marketing solution, Prime Vantage. NatWest Cards is one of the first organizations to quantify the impact of deploying its CRM strategy and demonstrate a strengthened relationship with its customers."

 

however by 2001 the amended nat west credit card terms and conditions referre to "we, us ,our "as national westminster bank plc

 

despite this triton in the future (a few years later )were to refer to our client as "NatWest card services" ??????

 

the word assignment comes to mind

 

has anyone got an old agreement to see who the early agreements were between ?

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having just referred to the NatWest notice of variation of the t & C issued in march 2006

 

it now defines "we,us our " as national westminster bank plc , and any person our rights and duties may be transferred to.

 

meaning the early t & c did not say

 

and any person our rights and duties may be transferred to.

 

 

 

 

draw your own conclusions what that means :grin::grin::grin:

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Interesting points ROAS; if I ever receive my application form/agreement from 1998, I'll take a look and let you know. It's been two months since my request - silence except for admitting they had received the request and then lots of letters demanding payment whilst the account was in dispute;) Tut, tut, RBS:D

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Where they have then reconstructed a "True Copy" that differs materially from the original (or there was no original) and said that you must pay based upon their production of that.

 

Since that reconstruction is not based on the original and it is incorrect, I have already suggested that what they are doing might be fraudulent.

 

But further, because it is the bank's policy to reconstruct the "True copy" and then demand payment when they can't find the original agreement (there is a copy of an in-house magazine boasting of this around here somewhere), this might constitute conspiracy to defraud, where the group who approved this policy plus any managers / directors who were aware of it (that would be lots of them) might be in the mire.

I think I need to put together a well-reasoned, clear & concise complaint to give to the boys in blue and a last chance type letter to NatWest to withdraw their demand.

I'm sure that NatWest won't back down - they never do except at the last minute, but I think that they will mis-understand that this is their last chance if the police get involved - but I will enjoy supplying a list of those who might risk a significant fine / jail time

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Hello to All

I have waited almost 3 years for my true copy of CCA, i have been chased by no fewer than six different Debt Collecting Agents, once i ask for the CCA they never come near me again. I would like to know if there is a time scale on this, ie: after a certain time without producing the right documents are they still allowed to chase the debt or does it become unenforcable?

 

Jack508

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Hello to All

I have waited almost 3 years for my true copy of CCA, i have been chased by no fewer than six different Debt Collecting Agents, once i ask for the CCA they never come near me again. I would like to know if there is a time scale on this, ie: after a certain time without producing the right documents are they still allowed to chase the debt or does it become unenforcable?

 

Jack508

 

 

6 years from last payment or acknowledgment of debt

You may receive different advice to your query as people have different experiences and opinions. Please use your own judgement in deciding whose advice to take.

 

If in doubt seek advice from a qualified insured professional. Any advice I have offered you is done so on an informal basis, without prejudice or liability.

 

If you think I have been helpful PLEASE click the scales

 

court bundles for dummies

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has anyone got an old agreement to see who the early agreements were between ?

 

Hi REST ON A SUNDAY ;-)

 

Sorry I can't help with an agreement or T&Cs, but how old is old?

 

My NatWest credit card started it's life as an 'Access' card, you remember, the old 'flexible friend' ;)

 

I have statements going back to 1987 and possibly earlier if I have a good dig.

 

Cheers

Rob

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Thanks for your input so far:grin:

 

Counting in the caggers so far

 

Me, for loans, credit card and naughty naughty no agreement for advantage gold account services. In fact they have never sent me any agreement whatsoever:rolleyes:

 

2Grumpy

underdog13

Paul Wilton ( and he knows of 5 more)

Fedup

Neilap

Oscar52

 

There must be hundreds more:grin:

 

 

Hi HHNF

 

Add me to that list (and sorry for joining the discussion so late)

If my advice or input has helped, by all means tip my scales

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A further thought that I have already posted in another thread:

 

Where they have then reconstructed a "True Copy" that differs materially from the original (or there was no original) and said that you must pay based upon their production of that.

 

Since that reconstruction is not based on the original and it is incorrect, I have already suggested that what they are doing might be fraudulent.

 

But further, because it is the bank's policy to reconstruct the "True copy" and then demand payment when they can't find the original agreement (there is a copy of an in-house magazine boasting of this around here somewhere), this might constitute conspiracy to defraud, where the group who approved this policy plus any managers / directors who were aware of it (that would be lots of them) might be in the mire.

 

Grumpy

 

 

Excellent point..............

You may receive different advice to your query as people have different experiences and opinions. Please use your own judgement in deciding whose advice to take.

 

If in doubt seek advice from a qualified insured professional. Any advice I have offered you is done so on an informal basis, without prejudice or liability.

 

If you think I have been helpful PLEASE click the scales

 

court bundles for dummies

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Excellent point..............

 

Hello Everybody:D

 

The information relating to the staffs conmments re-reconstruction of agreements is on post 45 posted up by Paul:D

 

The plot thickens:D We need to be looking as to how they think they can do this:rolleyes:

If any of my posts are helpful, please feel free to click my scales. All information is given as my opinion only, based on my own personal experiences. I have no legal training, but have educated myself in aspects of consumer legislation. My motto "NEVER GIVE IN, NEVER SURRENDER", THERE IS A WAR ON YOU KNOW

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The T&C's on my reconstructed agreement & the T&Cs in their leaflet differ - values, company name & address etc.

 

There's also no mention of updating my credit file or sharing data in either the reconstructed agreement or separate T&Cs either

 

So how naughty are they being?

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lol wonderful....mind and add your list of charges payable to you when THEY mess up, if you have to write etc :D

Dipply75

 

I am in no way a legal advisor and only speak from my own experiences and the helpful advice of those in the same boat! :p

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Well, after getting a reconstructed CCA, NastyWest finally threatened (unspecified) "further action" if I didn't contact them about payment within 7 days of the date of the letter ...

Of course with their delays & the post, that didn't leave time for a reply to get to them in time. Oh well.

I did write saying ...

If you were going to telephone - don't

If you were going to send the boys round - forget it

If you are going to start court action - great - but as part of that you will have to provide me with all of the documents that you will be relying on as part of your case, so why not just send me a copy of the signed original agreement & we can avoid court action completely.

If you start court action anyway I will show this to the court as a genuine attempt to avoid wasting the court's time.

Forgot to say if you are going to throw your toys out of the pram, don't expect me to pick them up.

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