Thames Credit - see their response to a CCA request...

[twinkle1977]

Hi all

Having got into the spirit of writing to all my creditors, my partner sent a CCA request to Thames Credit.

 

Here's their response:

 

You have requested a copy of the original Agreement citing the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

 

We are not the original creditor. We did not provide you with the original credit facility. we purchased your outstanding debt balance and the right to collect that balance, together with the right to apply interest in accordance with your original Credit Agreement. We did not purchase your actual Agreement, consequently we have no obligation to provide you with a copy of that Agreement.

 

However, as a matter of good practice, we will seek to obtain a copy of the original Agreement from the original credit grantor and if that is available we will forward a copy to you.

 

We are the legal owners of your account and your liability is now to us in respect of repaying the outstanding debt balance that was purchased by this Group of Companies.

 

 

... So - what do you all think? It reads to me that they're up the creed without a paddle. Anyone know how we should respond? Its not like my CCA request responses, where they say the account is on hold while they wait for the agreement.

 

My partner's stopped all payments. What else (any letter) that we should send?

 

Thanks all

[huggy41]

send them this.

your letter dated bla bla bla has been noted and filed

[Alex_DeLarge]

You have done your bit, just wait and see what arrives next.

 

I CCA'd them last week so I wonder if I will get the same letter.

[ADE&FAB]

Silly question as I have been reading many posts where DCA's have stated that they have "Purchased a Debt"

 

Has anyone ever asked for "proof of payment" to the debt!!!!!

[babybear39]

Silly question as I have been reading many posts where DCA's have stated that they have "Purchased a Debt"

 

Has anyone ever asked for "proof of payment" to the debt!!!!!

 

Excellent point

 

Everyone should request proof of this, they'd all soon be squirming

[ADE&FAB]

Then if they could show how much they paid, we could then challenge the amount they are charging us and then be in a better position to argue down the amount they are chasing.

 

I bet no one DCA could ever produce proof of purchase!

[babybear39]

I was joking...They would never provide it 'cos the documetation would show numerous accounts and other sensitive information as they bulk purchase these accounts.

[huggy41]

dear sir as you have stated in your letter that you have PURSHED my alledged debt i require you to prove you have the right to collect not just saying so. If you do not comply with my request then it comes to mind you are trying to obtain money by deception which is a criminal offence.

[ADE&FAB]

Then maybe we should start.

 

If anything it would give them more work to do on top of tall the work we give them already and maybe something would come of it.

 

As in if they can't produce a Proof of Purchase they can't get a claim.

 

Like if a shop, no Proof of Purchase no refund!!!!!!!!

Edited October 11, 2008 by ADE&FAB
Spelling and Rum

[ADE&FAB]

Huggy, well said, lets get a good letter going with lots legal stuff and go from there!

[babybear39]

The CCA or signed agreement provides the proof to collect, without this they're stuffed

[huggy41]

The CCA or signed agreement provides the proof to collect, without this they're stuffed

 

and without that ,then they are trying to obtain money by DECEPTION

[ADE&FAB]

I know, but in the case where they can produce a CCA (rare like a living Dodo) this can be the next spanner in the works.

 

We could even request a copy of the cheque used to purchase the debt!

[twinkle1977]

Hi

 

Thanks for responses - liked reading your brainstorming

 

Should we send them a letter then? Saying, screw you, or does anyone have a slightly better worded letter we could send?

 

Or do we just sit tight?

[ADE&FAB]

Rum makes the mind wonder.

 

Lets argue here.

 

If we have to request for an origional copy of a CCA, then could we not also argue they they have to produce an origional cheque/telegraphic transfer order etc of the purchase.

 

i think we are onto something.

 

MOD's, has this ever been raised before and if not are we onto something??

[babybear39]

Just sit tight and wait until the deadlines expire (12 + 2 working days). If they then request payment, without producing a valid reply to your CCA request, they are in breach of OFT guidlines and the CPUTR 2008 and should be reported to Trading Standards and the OFT forthwith.

[Allwood]

I would send an S.R.A to the OC and see what they have it will cost £10 put it is worth it. Thames are a very good at conjuring up agreements with false information and signatures.

[Alex_DeLarge]

I would send nothing for the time being, if they continue to send begging/threatening letters, just let them build up and use them as evidence later, the more they send the worse it will look for them at a later date if it goes to court.

 

Once the 12 days is up start scanning all the letters you receive, make copies and after a couple of months when you have a few letters send the lot to your local trading standards office, around this time send Thames a reminder letter regarding your CCA request and their none compliance. Send TS a copy of this letter and a copy of your original letter requesting a copy of your CCA request, put copies of these in with the other letters you send.

 

This is what I did with Lowell, by the time it went to court I had over 30 threat-o-grames from them plus a letter back from TS confirming they were looking into it, and that they had copied all letters and had sent them off to the TS office in Leeds where Lowell are based.

 

I put all of the events into a time line which I read out in court, I only wrote to Lowell twice, once to request my CCA and the second time to remind them that the account was in default.

 

They know the law better than you and are fully aware of what they are doing.

Edited October 11, 2008 by Alex_DeLarge

[huggy41]

SEND THEM THIS

[ODC]

Hi all

Having got into the spirit of writing to all my creditors, my partner sent a CCA request to Thames Credit.

 

Here's their response:

 

You have requested a copy of the original Agreement citing the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

 

We are not the original creditor. We did not provide you with the original credit facility. we purchased your outstanding debt balance and the right to collect that balance, together with the right to apply interest in accordance with your original Credit Agreement. What Credit agreement??? Oh you mean the one you didnt purchase so how do you know what it says We did not purchase your actual Agreement, consequently we have no obligation to provide you with a copy of that Agreement.

 

However, as a matter of good practice,and in accordance with our legal obligation under S 175 of the CCA 1974 we will seek to obtain a copy of the original Agreement from the original credit grantor and if that is available we will forward a copy to you.

 

We are the legal owners of your account and are Creditors as defined by S 189 of the CCA 1974and your liability is now to us in respect of repaying the outstanding debt balance that was purchased by this Group of Companies.What account. You have no proof

 

 

... So - what do you all think? It reads to me that they're up the creed without a paddle. Anyone know how we should respond? Its not like my CCA request responses, where they say the account is on hold while they wait for the agreement.

 

My partner's stopped all payments. What else (any letter) that we should send?

 

Thanks all

This is the usual Bowlarks from these muppets.

[rameses_qc]

Don't forget, that in Court, they would need to produce proof that the debt has been lawfully assigned. They need a deed of assignment, but this can cover numerous debts purchased, or what these ****** bin rummagers like to call "portfolios" in order to give their industry a little respectability

If they are relying on "equitable assignment," then they can't take legal action without the original creditor. Weddell and Another [1988] 1 Ch 26 Besides, LoPA 1925 has been superceded by various other legislation. Not least CCA 1974 S 189

Edited October 11, 2008 by rameses_qc

[ScarletPimpernel]

If they claim not to be the creditor, then s.175 of the CCA 1974 requires them to pass the request to the creditor; 'good practice' doesn't enter into it - it's a legal obligation.

 

If the debt was an absolute assignment, s.189 says they are the creditor, because an assignment is of both rights and duties, not one or the other.

[ODC]

If they claim not to be the creditor, then s.175 of the CCA 1974 requires them to pass the request to the creditor; 'good practice' doesn't enter into it - it's a legal obligation.

 

If the debt was an absolute assignment, s.189 says they are the creditor, because an assignment is of both rights and duties, not one or the other.

 

You appear to have missed my sarcasm in my response to this thread about the river rats

[twinkle1977]

Hi all

 

Letter received today from Thames Credit. To put you all in picture, CCA letter was sent, the 10+2 days passed then received letter (wording as per first posting in this thread).

 

Ignored letter and filed away.

 

new letter received today stating:

 

"we are writing to you because our records show that we have not received payment from you in accordance with the agreement we reached.

 

It is important that any payment is received by no later than the agreed date, otherwise our automated procedures will return an account to our Collections Division. In those circumstances it is usually the case that all accrued interest is added back to the account and any discount offered to a customer is withdrawn. In other words the full balance will become due and payable.

 

Therefore we would ask that you telephone us immediately, so that you can make payment by debit or credit card, or agree another payment date.

 

If for any reason you cannot make your payment, again it is important that you telephone us without delay, to prevent further action being taken against you. We are sure you will understand that.

 

We therefore look forward to hearing from you as a matter of urgency."

 

blah blah.

 

So,

1) we won't be phoning

2) we're not unduly worried or threatened about this letter.

 

What I want (please help if you can) is the wording or a template letter to send back to them to say, in effect "no CCA = no payments, stop hassling" Or any other comments welcome.

 

Thanks

[ScarletPimpernel]

Try this:

 

Dear Sirs

 

I refer to your letter dated (date).

 

On (date) I made a formal request pursuant to s.78(1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. The statutory time limit for compliance expired on (date) and s.78(6) of the Act therefore applies. Whilst you remain in default, any demand for payment is unlawful.

 

Take notice that whilst you remain in default of my request, I will not enter into further correspondence with you. Any further unlawful demands will be reported to the appropriate enforcement agency.

 

Yours etc.