Egg Bank Default Letter

[BeleagueredSinner]

I had an Egg Card, which was converted to an Egg Loan some time ago. The bad news is that the loan was taken out about 3 years ago, and thus I've probably signed a new-style, water-tight agreement for that, whereas I probably didn't for my loan.

 

However, I am minded that there was an unwanted PPI plan on my card, and charges too, which will have added to the value of the loan I was encouraged to take out.

 

Accordingly, I believe the top line of the loan value does not represent the true level of my debt to Egg.

 

I sent them a SAR, with my £10 on 7th August, 2008. They responded on 19th August with a list of charges for the Egg Card only - no agreements, statements, additional information.

 

So, I wrote back on the 23rd, telling them their response was entitrely unacceptable and that the SAR was unfulfilled and in dispute, and listing information I still needed. To quote from my letter:

 

'I am in receipt of your correspondence dated 19th August, 2008; this being a response to my Subject Access Request (SAR) dated 7th August, 2008. However, it disappoints me to report that the response to date is wholly inadequate. The information provided only relates to my Egg Card, I can see no detail whatsoever relating to the Egg Loan.

Accordingly, the SAR request is unfulfilled. I now require of you:

1) Copies of all documents (including a True Executed Copy of any Credit Agreements) which include any of my personal information including copies of any contacts or invoices, emails or computer records containing my personal information, or any records which pertain to this information

2) Full copies or transcripts of any correspondence in postal, email or any other format which you have entered into with any individual, organization or third party which contains my personal or financial, or which pertains to me

3) Where any previous information or records held have been deleted or disposed of, the methods used to do so, including dates, certificates or references confirming details of destruction. Where you are unable to provide such certificates, please provide a declaration, signed by an authorised officer of your company, confirming the dates and methods of destruction of this data

4) Full hard copy print outs of my personal or financial information, held in a digital, magnetic or any other format which is held in any archives, backups or other storage devices / locations

 

I would request that any data issued includes a statement of the ‘credit limit’ you assert applied to any credit account that was running at the time, as well as the prevailing interest rate.

 

Credit Card Repayment Protector

 

I am writing in relation to the above payment protection (PPI) policy which I wish to cancel with immediate effect, due to:

 

- I was self-employed when the policy was applied to my account (and remain so to date), and thus I can only conclude I was not asked about this

 

- I could not have been asked whether I already had any existing insurance or employer benefits that would cover my repayments as this was certainly the case

 

Not only to I wish for the cover to be ceased with immediate effect, I also demand repayment of premiums claimed to date; which I have identified within the table provided herewith. Compounded from date of transaction with an 8% interest rate, this sum totals £#########.

 

The FSA’s rules are very clear about what firms and advisers selling PPI should do at the time the insurance is sold; irrespective of whether the sale was ‘advised’ or ‘non-advised’. Most specifically, the adviser should have made me aware of any significant policy exclusions and checked whether any of these exclusions applied to my circumstances. This clearly and evidently did not happen in this case.

 

Other Charges

 

Other charges have been levied against my account for which I request reimbursement; such costs being cited on statements as ‘Unpaid DD Charges’ and ‘Late Charges’. I have listed these charges herewith; which, once compounded with interest as cited above sum £#### (£#### plus £####).

 

Account Précis

 

You are compelled to respond to a SAR within 12 days. The information relating to my Egg Card is sadly lacking, and that requested of my Egg Loan not present in any form. Accordingly, your actions have placed both accounts INTO DISPUTE. I hope you can forward the missing information as soon as is practically possible to remedy this fact. However, in the interim, please respect the disputed status your actions have placed both accounts into.

 

I do not believe the size of the balance on my Egg Card, transferred to my Egg Loan is a true reflection of my indebtedness to you; given it is swollen by the inappropriate PPI plan, plus charges I have been able to identify with the limited information provided to date. I request this situation be addressed immediately. I am happy for this to take place my means of a reduction in the outstanding balances across my two accounts with you.

 

Please be aware that this correspondence represents my ‘initial response’ to the limited information provided to date, and should not be consider as an exhaustive response. Further matters may arise as a function of receiving subsequent correspondence from you.

 

I respectfully request an answer to this correspondence within 7 days; so that the disputed nature of the accounts can come to an end, which – I suggest – will suit both parties.'

 

 

I heard nothing from them at all, and thus prodded them for response in a letter dated 15th September in which I stated:

 

 

'I make reference to my letter dated 23rd August, 2008; which followed on from the unacceptable response to my Subject Access Request dated 7th August, 2008.

 

Within the most recent letter, I respectfully made a request an answer to that correspondence within 7 days; so that the disputed nature of the accounts could be satisfied.

 

I am amazed that to date I have heard nothing at all, but would like it duly noted that I have made every effort to pursue this matter to a prompt conclusion.'

 

 

The above letter must have prodded them into action as a week later on the 22nd September, they wrote again and said the information would be with me by October 7th. No problems, I'll wait I thought.

 

 

Then, today, I get a default notice from them dated 23rd September, this being 47 days after my SAR request. This cannot be right, surely?

[42man]

Unfortunately they have put a default on because you haven't paid them, they can't put a default on for anything else....

[BeleagueredSinner]

Hi, thanks for the response. Given they haven't responded to my SAR, surely they placed the account into dispute, after which point I'm not obligated to pay them am I? Moreover, they shouldn't issue a default notice with regards to a clearly disputed account?

 

Or am I being daft (highly possible) :-?

[42man]

A SAR isn't a dispute, it is only a request for information.....however non production of all the items in a SAR is a good point..I can't answer that one....(maybe somebody else might add to this thread on that point)...

 

I would ask them for their official complaints procedures too !!!

 

A CCA request could be a dispute (or lack of production of one)....

[creditcardmug]

Hi, if the account is in arrears they can issue a Default Notice regardless of any SAR, If you send a CCA request and they dont comply within 14 days, you can send an account in dispute letter, with this YOU are putting the account in dispute.

 

Hope this helps to explain a little better.

[BeleagueredSinner]

Hi, wouldn't the CCA request be wrapped up in the SAR request? Given the SAR request was dated 7th August, I informed them that their response was unacceptable on 23rd August, and wrote to them again 15th September telling them the account was in dispute - well over a month after my SAR request; isn't their default letter on week after the 'dispute' letter wrong, this being dated 22nd October?

 

They have promised me the SAR will be satisfied on 7th October - 2 months after my request

[42man]

If you don't get the SAR then take them to court.....

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/6986-data-protection-act-non.html

 

http://www.ico.gov.uk/upload/documents/library/data_protection/practical_application/taking_a_case_to_court.pdf

 

The CCA request is a legal request made under the Consumer Credit Act, if that legal request is not adhered to then they are in default of your request, this means whilst they have not provided it they cannot enforce the debt...(although some try, but with knowledge and if you defend, then it is usually thrown out of court)......

 

This is the legal bit here for the CCA...

 

Consumer Credit (Prescribed Periods for Giving Information) Regulations

1983 (SI 1983/1569)

2 Prescribed period

The period of 12 working days is hereby prescribed for the purposes of each provision of the Act specified in Column 1

of the Schedule to these Regulations relating to the duty indicated in Column 2 in relation to regulated agreements

 

 

SCHEDULE

SECTIONS OF THE ACT IN RESPECT OF WHICH A PERIOD OF 12 WORKING DAYS IS PRESCRIBED RELATING TO DUTIES IN

RELATION TO REGULATED AGREEMENTS

Regulation 2

Section of the

Act

Duty

(1) (2)

77(1) Duty to give information to debtor under fixed-sum credit agreement.

78(1) Duty to give information to debtor under running-account credit agreement.

79(1) Duty to give information to hirer under consumer hire agreement.

and section 78 for running credit

 

 

78.

Duty to give information to debtor under running-account credit agreement.

— (1) The creditor under a regulated agreement for running-account credit, within the prescribed period after receiving a request in writing to that effect from the debtor and payment of a fee of [F1 £1], shall give the debtor a copy of the executed agreement (if any) and of any other document referred to in it, together with a statement signed by or on behalf of the creditor showing, according to the information to which it is practicable for him to refer,—

(a)

the state of the account, and

 

(b)

the amount, if any currently payable under the agreement by the debtor to the creditor, and

 

©

the amounts and due dates of any payments which, if the debtor does not draw further on the account, will later become payable under the agreement by the debtor to the creditor.

 

 

(2) If the creditor possesses insufficient information to enable him to ascertain the amounts and dates mentioned in subsection (1)©, he shall be taken to comply with that paragraph if his statement under subsection (1) gives the basis on which, under the regulated agreement, they would fall to be ascertained.

 

(3) Subsection (1) does not apply to—

(a)

an agreement under which no sum is, or will or may become, payable by the debtor, or

 

(b)

a request made less than one month after a previous request under that subsection relating to the same agreement was complied with.

 

 

(4) Where running-account credit is provided under a regulated agreement, the creditor shall give the debtor statements in the prescribed form, and with the prescribed contents—

(a)

showing according to the information to which it is practicable for him to refer, the state of the account at regular intervals of not more than twelve months, and

 

(b)

where the agreement provides, in relation to specified periods, for the making of payments by the debtor, or the charging against him of interest or any other sum, showing according to the information to which it is practicable for him to refer the state of the account at the end of each of those periods during which there is any movement in the account.

 

 

(5) A statement under subsection (4) shall be given within the prescribed period after the end of the period to which the statement relates.

 

(6) If the creditor under an agreement fails to comply with subsection (1)—

(a)

he is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement

 

 

 

A SAR is an official request for them to provide ALL they hold on you....

[BeleagueredSinner]

Thanks for the excellent response - greatly appreciated. So, the above is very clear with regards to CCA requests, but could I cite the above with regards to my SAR; given the CCA should be encompassed as part of the SAR process?

 

Sorry to sound thick, and/or pedantic - just want to be correct on this one. Cheers

[BeleagueredSinner]

Just bumping this one up to see if anyone can help on this final point. Thanks in advance

[42man]

There is clear government statute relating to a CCA request.....and if it gets to the position where you have to stand in front of a judge and an opposing solicitor, then you simply state the Consumer Credit Act 1974....

 

If they fail to enclose the CCA in a SAR, you may never know if they forgot to put it in or if they don't actually have it....!!

[42man]

A SAR is not covered under the Consumer Credit Act.....

[BeleagueredSinner]

Cheers, thanks. So, I'm guessing the fact they took over 60 day to provide the information (now arrived) does not mean that they placed the account into dispute?

 

Now I have the information, I can see that there's a PPI plan in effect, even though this would have been against my wishes and circumstances at the time of application (2000), and indeed now; that there's no 'opt in' situation on the application, or mention of a phone call with 'an advisor' within the SAR that shows a PPI plan being applied.

 

The PPI sums were from my card which was transferred to a loan in 2005 - quite a common ruse this from Egg as it nullifies any rubbish application forms they were previously holding as contracts.

 

The outstaning balance on the loan is £7,800, but the balance of the PPI sums collected when applied with compound interest at 8% is £4,500. There are also a number of late charges that add to £250 or so. So, looking at the outstanding balance of £7,800, some 60% of the total sum is disputed PPI payments and charges.

 

Given the above, I don't believe the balance showing as outstanding to them is a fair reflection of my level of indebtedness to them.

 

What options do I now have open to me? If I recommence my monthly payments, I do so against a balance I rightfully dispute

[creditcardmug]

I think i would write asking for their complaints procedure first.

Then put all these points to them, you never know they might just put all this right.

[BeleagueredSinner]

Hi, I will write to them for their complaints procedure. However, what do I do in the interim?

 

The deadline for me paying them my arrears is 20th of this month, otherwise the Default Notice issued last month will be registered.

 

However, it took them over 2 months to respond to my SAR, and in addition to that request a letter I wrote to them 6 weeks ago requesting repayment of PPI installments - which now I have a copy thanks to the belated SAR of the application form, I can tell what not a cited option, nor applicable to my circumstances - accounts for some 60% of the balance they show as outstanding.

 

What are the best options when one geniunely believes the level of indebtedness shown is not representative of the level of debt; but you can't go to the FOS becauise the bank won't write back on a timely basis; let alone issue a Final Response.

 

Just carry on paying, doesn't seem fair