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And they will continue to sell it on to their extensive list of DCA monkeys. When one doesn't work and passes it back because the account is in dispute, Cap1 will just sell it on to the next.

 

I'm so glad I stopped paying them- I'd hate to be contributing to the postage on all of these letters...;)

 

Permission to attack the choccy, BC. You've done the angry letters for the day. I've got bored with the choccy and will be on to the Roast Beef and yorkshire puds next. Some days, even choccy is insufficient.

Nationwide-A&L-Halifax 1-Student Loans Company-NatWest-Virgin Media-Link-Capital One ALL WON!

Thames Credit -statute barred sent 13/11/08

BCW- prove debt letter- 14/08/08

Apex- CCA 14/08/08

Redcats UK- SAR 14/04/09

Call Serve- CCA 14/08/08

Littlewoods- no CCA letter 03/09/08- Lowells now

Wescot- CCA 19/9/08

Capital One/Debitas- now with Lowells

 

Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability. All information has been obtained from this site. If you are unsure, please seek professional advice. .

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Hi Emma, Cant eat anymore choccie - feel sick, although roast beef & Yorkshire pud sounds good.

 

Seriously tho' can't see the point of carrying on paying this lot, don't get any statements or the like have no idea how much they are adding in charges each month and don't even know where our payments are going, certainly don't get any acknowledgement regarding payments received.

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Completely confused, the opinion seems to be that I have no grounds disputing account as cca complies. I thought if account unlawful charges that also means account is disputed and the OC has to cease collection enforcement under OFT guidelines?

 

Have sent civil procedures letter, as recommended, no reply and time limit now expired - what's next step.

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If the CCA is enforceable and you want to try another angle- to reduce the balance of the debt by claiming back the unlawful charges- just follow the usual advice.

 

Add up the charges and any interest these charges have incurred, send the prelim letter asking for them back and putting the account into dispute.

 

You have already done the SAR so should have a full list of charges. Have fun. I think I'm onto this next, if yesterday's CCA is enforceable.

Nationwide-A&L-Halifax 1-Student Loans Company-NatWest-Virgin Media-Link-Capital One ALL WON!

Thames Credit -statute barred sent 13/11/08

BCW- prove debt letter- 14/08/08

Apex- CCA 14/08/08

Redcats UK- SAR 14/04/09

Call Serve- CCA 14/08/08

Littlewoods- no CCA letter 03/09/08- Lowells now

Wescot- CCA 19/9/08

Capital One/Debitas- now with Lowells

 

Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability. All information has been obtained from this site. If you are unsure, please seek professional advice. .

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Hi BC,

 

After Steven's opinion on the last page, it seems the agreement may be enforceable. Assuming it is, the next step should be to reclaim charges.

 

While you are doing that, the debt should not be pursued, but it probably still will be. It's not right or fair, but thats the way it seems to be.

We could do with some help from you

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Beachcomber, my alleged CCA is EXACTLY the same as yours! So if yours is unenforceable, so is mine.

 

And I have no definite idea or why!

Nationwide-A&L-Halifax 1-Student Loans Company-NatWest-Virgin Media-Link-Capital One ALL WON!

Thames Credit -statute barred sent 13/11/08

BCW- prove debt letter- 14/08/08

Apex- CCA 14/08/08

Redcats UK- SAR 14/04/09

Call Serve- CCA 14/08/08

Littlewoods- no CCA letter 03/09/08- Lowells now

Wescot- CCA 19/9/08

Capital One/Debitas- now with Lowells

 

Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability. All information has been obtained from this site. If you are unsure, please seek professional advice. .

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Just had a look at your 'agreement' on page one - it refers to the T&Cs and you agreeing to be bound by them, blah,blah; which would suggest to me that any prescribed terms would be in a separate document - which is not allowed:D

 

Secondly, it says please see overleaf how your info will be used; this would seem to be a reference to the data act. Nowhere does it mention please see overleaf for your T&Cs or prescribed terms....

 

Best of luck:)

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And I quote from the signature page –

Important: please read “use of information” overleaf (Section 23 of the agreement)

Can you see a section 23 on the terms and conditions page which are apparently overleaf – I can’t because they only go up to 3.

That’s enough to dispute if the two documents are linked – the only way anyone (including a judge) can be sure is to look at the original. If they aint got it then they aint got an enforceable agreement.

BTW did they send you everything in order to satisfy the s78 request – statement of account – cancellation document – full terms and conditions including the alleged section 23 – if they haven’t then they are in default of your request and not entitled to enforce the agreement. Section 78 is very clear on what documents the creditor is supposed to supply regarding such a request – don’t settle for noncompliance when they wouldn’t if they were in your shoes.

Keep going BC and well done for how you handled Power2intimidate. I had one of those Muppets turn up a couple of months ago. The idiot asked me if I wanted to speak to blahdeblah on the phone about an outstanding balance on a credit card. How we laughed when he was introduced to my rather large Akita who was due for a run around my front garden. Needless to say I didn’t feel like talking and he didn’t feel like hanging around – shame really, the dog was hungry as well.

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Hi Beachy and all.

 

Sorry guys - what I'm saying is that the next step IN ANY EVENT is to reclaim the charges on the a/c to reduce the balance.

 

Steven made comments about how the agreement could be enforceable and I'm not saying it is, or isn't. :)

We could do with some help from you

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EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

                                            Have we helped you ...?  Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

Please give something if you can. We all give our time free of charge but the site has bills to pay.

 

Thanks !:-)

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I totally agree – the issue of enforceability will only be resolved via the court. The agreement you have is improperly executed - at the very least - because it isn’t in the correct format according to the 1983 regulations. So the agreement breaches s61 (1)(a) of the CCA 1974 and only a court can enforce it.

Whether they will or not is another matter and it doesn’t stop you claiming back charges – so that’s something positive you can be doing in the meantime - although if it does go to court then your counter claim would include these anyway.

The most important thing is not to let it worry you so much that it makes you ill.

And remember – they haven’t complied with your request yet so they are on a sticky wicket to start with.

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So move on from the CCA to the charges? No problem. I had just previously thought that the CCA was enough and to only go after the charges if and when they produce an enforceable agreement.

 

I already have my SAR, I'll get on it this weekend.

Nationwide-A&L-Halifax 1-Student Loans Company-NatWest-Virgin Media-Link-Capital One ALL WON!

Thames Credit -statute barred sent 13/11/08

BCW- prove debt letter- 14/08/08

Apex- CCA 14/08/08

Redcats UK- SAR 14/04/09

Call Serve- CCA 14/08/08

Littlewoods- no CCA letter 03/09/08- Lowells now

Wescot- CCA 19/9/08

Capital One/Debitas- now with Lowells

 

Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability. All information has been obtained from this site. If you are unsure, please seek professional advice. .

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Exactly my line of thinking, charges would make a good counter claim together with harrassment. Strange email from them - although the account has been terminated had email stating monthly statement on line, went to log in only to get a message that they had to new password and to ring them for password -another ploy to get me on the phone ?

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Hi Beachcomber!

Just to offer moral support as i am new to this game as well!i am in same boat as you that capital one can not come up with an enforceanle CCA!In my case they keep insisiting they have sent me a signed one! LOl but they have not sent me anything signed!Just a letter with current terms and conditions and they have not even sent me the signed application form which they try to fob of as a CCA on other people who have requested a cca from them!Very odd they keep saying i have recived signed documents from them when they havent!:eek:i took citazens b advice and asked them to resend signed document as i told them they were mistaken in thinking they had!i am waiting with great interest to see what they come up with! i saw on your thread that apparently you can claim charges back when an account is in dispute and they have not provived an enforceable cca as i though you couldent do that as on some threads i saw that you canot do this and put account in dispute at same time! So now i am abit confused!I hope all goes well in your battle against crapital one!:D

Im happy to help with support and my own opinions but as i have no legal qualifications If I offer any thoughts to your problems please take it as from my life experience only and not of any legal standing. Always take further advice from the legal experts in your final action,

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When you send in your prelim letter asking for your charges to be refunded, you are disputing the balance owed- therefore the account goes into dispute.

Nationwide-A&L-Halifax 1-Student Loans Company-NatWest-Virgin Media-Link-Capital One ALL WON!

Thames Credit -statute barred sent 13/11/08

BCW- prove debt letter- 14/08/08

Apex- CCA 14/08/08

Redcats UK- SAR 14/04/09

Call Serve- CCA 14/08/08

Littlewoods- no CCA letter 03/09/08- Lowells now

Wescot- CCA 19/9/08

Capital One/Debitas- now with Lowells

 

Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability. All information has been obtained from this site. If you are unsure, please seek professional advice. .

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Sunflower, if you make a request under s77-79 of the CCA the creditor is obliged to reply – if they don’t comply fully then they are in default of your request and are not entitled to enforce the agreement. The agreement at this stage is still valid (regardless of the copy they send you) and the question of enforceability is irrelevant – so you can claim back any unlawful penalty charges.

If the creditor (or his agent) tries to pursue the debt in court (most likely) you can then ask for a ruling as to whether the agreement is enforceable. If the agreement is not enforceable then the debtor will be unable to enforce the debt – not only that – they lose all rights that they would have had if the agreement was enforceable.

Just what you can and cannot claim back in the event of an unenforceable agreement is the subject of much debate. Some people (including myself) believe that there is an argument to claim back all payments made into the account. Others do not because they believe that this would be unjust enrichment.

I don’t agree because if the right of the creditor to demand payment has been rescinded by an act of parliament (s127 (3) for instance) then there can be no claiming that the recovery of these payments are unjust because the creditor was never entitled to them in the first place. To claim unjust enrichment regarding reimbursement would be to claim that an act of parliament itself is unjust and that wouldn’t be upheld.

In the case of Wilson vs FCT She (Wilson) kept her car (that she pawned for £5k) and was reimbursed with the £6900.00 she had handed over in payment to get the car back. The point on unjust enrichment is clearly argued in that case. It seems harsh on the creditor but that is the penalty they face for improper execution of a credit agreement.

The government (probably on the advice of the banks) has now amended the act so that s127 3-5 (which precludes the court from enforcing an agreement) no longer applies but only on agreements made after April 2007.

Thats how I look at it anyway.

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Another thing to consider when challenging the balance; interest charged on default sums is supposed to be simple not compound;

Taken from the CCA amendments 2006

 

"In addition, interest on default sums will also be restricted to simple interest.

Failure to comply with the above requirements will impact on an agreement’s enforceability"

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And I only scraped a pass in Maths o' level, lol:D

 

Basically I think it runs like this (please someone correct me if I'm wrong) if you have a debt of say, £100, a default charge of £12 and they add £100 to £12 and add interest to both sums, and then continue adding interest that is compound interest, ie you are paying interest on the interest.

 

The debt should be set out showing two different interest applications

original debt and the rate of (compound) interest

default sums and the rate of (simple) interest

 

Hope that makes sense:)

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Received a Notice of Immediate Action from debitarse for failing to contact c1 to arrange a payment plan, I've been trying to do this for six months now.

 

Every letter is sent recorded delivery and is ignored by c1 & debitarse including the 'Civil Procedures Protocal' (post #86) every one ignored without any form of acknowledgement from them.

 

Although I have continued to pay by standing order what I can afford, I have no idea where this money is going as the balance never changes.

 

Don't know what to do, ignore their threatogram, resend Martin's letter or what?

 

One thing I won't do is telephone them as stated in their letter.

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