Torbay Council/Smiths Bailiffs

[HideBehindthesofa]

Hi,

 

I am in reciept of incapcity benefit/income support however I recieved a discount on my Council Tax.

As it stands I owe the Council about £600 for this years Bill, & today I recieved a letter from the bailiffs wanting the payment by this Friday or they are going to send a removals van for goods to that amount.

After many calls to the council(who said it was out of there hands) and the Bailiffs who have informed me a bailiff will now call next Thursday to do a statement of means(see what we have got coming in/going out each week) and to discuss repayment options.

Where do I stand with all this do I A) Let them in to discuss payment options, B)Refuse entry. C) Send them a letter with my rights or something to show that I am not just going to let them walk all over me.

 

As you can see with regards the dates mentioned above it is very urgent so if anyone could help ASAP.

Edited August 27, 2008 by HideBehindthesofa
Spelling

[Conniff]

Definately refuse entry.

 

Whatever reason they give, if they are let it then it qualifies them to then enter again of their own free will and list all your goods. If they do want to do a means test then do it on the doorstep even if it is peeing down with rain.

 

They will either not bother with the means test once they are in or list all your goods at the same time as doing the means test, that is the way they are, and then they can ditch the means test.

[HideBehindthesofa]

Many thanks for your reply,

 

I have been thinking about this and would filling out a form to list all my incomings/outgoings be a good idea then present it to the Bailiff.

But I am slightly concerned because the letter stated that a van & man had been booked.

[Conniff]

A couple of points to remember. The bailiff cannot enter your house using force, but he can enter by an unlocked door or through an open window, so keep them all closed and locked.

If you go to talk to them, go out your back door and lock it behind you and talk to them out the front.

 

If they cannot gain entry after a few visits, they will hand it back to the council.

 

You cannot be sent to prison for non payment of council tax if you are in arrears because you can't pay it, you can be sent if you can afford it but refuse to do so.

 

Do as you have been thinking and list your income and expenditure. Remember you must leave enough to live on so list all utilities and food and rent hire purchase, credit cards, and not forgetting this years council tax.

You can then hand that to him when he calls with the amount YOU say you can afford to pay each week. If he don't agree with it then tuff, the council will send you a means form when it is handed back to them, or you should request one as soon as possible.

 

Don't be intimidated by them, they are just ordinary people who dress like the FBI to frighten you.

 

Are you male, female, old, young, ill or consider yourself vunerable, are you on your own?

[HideBehindthesofa]

Morning Conniff,

 

Cheers for that, however what is really worrying me is that the letter I have recieved about the van turning up and making a scene outside.

I am married with 2 young children and the last thing I want is to be brawling with the Bailiff on the pavement,

I am going to wait outside for the bailiff and then hand him my paperwork, but what happens if it gets ugly Do I like you mentioned refuse them entry and hope they pass it back to the council because the last thing I want to be doing is locking myself away 24/7.

 

[freakyleaky]

Thread moved to Baliff's forum.

[FairPlay77]

Hi,

 

I am in reciept of incapcity benefit/income support however I recieved a discount on my Council Tax.

As it stands I owe the Council about £600 for this years Bill, & today I recieved a letter from the bailiffs wanting the payment by this Friday or they are going to send a removals van for goods to that amount.

After many calls to the council(who said it was out of there hands) and the Bailiffs who have informed me a bailiff will now call next Thursday to do a statement of means(see what we have got coming in/going out each week) and to discuss repayment options.

Where do I stand with all this do I A) Let them in to discuss payment options, B)Refuse entry. C) Send them a letter with my rights or something to show that I am not just going to let them walk all over me.

 

I THINK you should do the following.

 

1. Tell the council that you have decided to exercise your right to pay them direct and that you will not, therefore, have any dealings with their bailiffs. Point out to them that they are obliged by law to accept your payments and that your want them to call off the bailiffs. Tell the council at the same time you are willing to fill in a form detailing your incomings and outgoings and are willing to negotiate a reasonable weekly or monthly payment but to them, not to the bailiffs. Explain, also, that as you are on income support etc., you are a vulnerable person and they are obliged to treat you as such.

 

2. If the bailiffs come, refuse to have anything to do with them and, of course, do not let you into your house. Remember, they have no right of entry (whatever lies they may tell you) without your permission. At the same time keep all doors and windows shut to stop them gaining entry.

 

Basically, bailiffs are paper-tigers who prey on the weak and those who do not know the law. Eventually, they will give up. The council will either take back the case from the bailiffs (and you have good grounds for making them do so) or the bailiffs will pass the case back to the council themselves when they find out you are someone who cannot be intimidated.

 

If you need further assistance, come back to this forum as there are plenty of people here who can help.

[letsmakeamark]

I would not be surprised if a bailiff working for the council reads what you are saying on this forum. The reason i am saying this is because if you were to say you were being bullied by bailiffs on behalf of a london borough . You would not be easily traceable through your details you have provided. However as torquay seems to be a small council any cases with them in is bound to catch a bailiffs attention.

[FairPlay77]

I would not be surprised if a bailiff working for the council reads what you are saying on this forum. The reason i am saying this is because if you were to say you were being bullied by bailiffs on behalf of a london borough . You would not be easily traceable through your details you have provided. However as torquay seems to be a small council any cases with them in is bound to catch a bailiffs attention.

 

IT's possible that the bailiffs might read this, but if they do they it will probably make them realise that, once again, they are confronted by someone who knows their rights and will not be bullied, and that they had better watch their step.

[letsmakeamark]

I thought i would warn the op and anybody else who has a problem with torbay council.

[Conniff]

Morning Conniff,

 

Cheers for that, however what is really worrying me is that the letter I have recieved about the van turning up and making a scene outside.

I am married with 2 young children and the last thing I want is to be brawling with the Bailiff on the pavement,

I am going to wait outside for the bailiff and then hand him my paperwork, but what happens if it gets ugly Do I like you mentioned refuse them entry and hope they pass it back to the council because the last thing I want to be doing is locking myself away 24/7.

 

 

 

They wont make a scene, they will just talk to you, continually trying to get the better of you and convince you that they should talk inside.

 

You wont have to be locked away, they cannot enter on the first occassion whether you're there or not.

 

You must continue to refuse entry and they '''''will'''' hand it back to the council as they can do no more if you wont let them in.

 

They will tell you all sorts of things, like, we will hand this back with a recommend that they send you to prison, anything that comes into mind they think will frighten you.

[UnitedFront]

Hi, I have had this problem previously with my local council and when I phoned them to try and have them take it back from the bailliff company they said that they didnt have the power to......this was complete rubbish!!!!

 

I sent them the following letter that I drafted:

 

 

 

Dear Sir/Madam,

With reference to the above named account, as you will see from your records, this account has been passed to XXXXXXX bailiffs for collection and I have previously written to you with regards to this account.

 

I have tried on a number of occasions to negotiate a form of repayment scheme, in writing, with XXXXXXX, however, they appear to be unwilling to listen to my offers or to take into account my situation as a full time student on virtually no income [AMEND FOR SITUATION].

I have an income now of less than £XXX per week from XXXXXX. I have to use this money to buy food and pay all of my other essential bills, travelling expenses and essential debts etc. I have, however, offered to pay £XX per month out of this to XXXXXXX Beillifs. They, in turn, are point blank refusing to discuss the matter with me, and instead insist that they will again send a bailiff to my house – where nothing nothing of any value can be found as I am not in a situation to afford any of these luxiries.

 

I have found XXXXXXXXX to be quite abusive. They have persistently attempted to mislead myself and my family with regards to their powers of entry. The bailiff that came round claimed that they had the power to force entry into the property, this is in fact, totally untrue, as I am sure you are aware.

 

If you look through the dealings that I have had with XXXXXX, you will see that I have been making regular payments to them since the beginning of XXXXXXX 2007, and yet they still insist that I pay £XX per week, which I simply cannot afford.

 

On a number of occasions, XXXXXXX have denied having received my correspondence, only to admit that they had received it, when faced with the proof that they had indeed cashed the Postal Orders that were stapled to the letters – which they initially denied having received. I feel that this type of untruth is wholly unacceptable.

 

I am seriously considering making an official complaint to the relevant ombudsman regarding the company employed by the XXXXXX District Council in this case, as I feel that all of the above details are the mark of an incredibly irresponsible company.

 

I understand that XXXXXX District Council has an Anti-Poverty Strategy in place. I believe that by sending bailiffs to my house, and in effect increasing the size of my debt is in breach of your own policies, especially when I am actively seeking a positive resolution to this matter.

It is for these reasons that I again request that you remove this debt from the Bailiff Company employed, so that I can begin to send payment directly to yourselves. I understand that I have previously had an agreement with you with regards to this account, however, as you are aware, I was at the time going through a time of severe monetary turbulence, which obviously impaired my ability to repay. I would ask that you take this into account and also the fact that my situation is now more stable and so I do have the ability to begin repayments.

Having analysed my essential requirements each week, which must come out of my £XXX [name of benefit], I feel that it is realistic for me to pay £XX per week off of this debt, and I am incredibly keen to begin doing this in order to begin to rectify this situation. However, I reiterate that XXXXXX Baillifs simply refuse to negotiate with me.

 

I truly hope that we can work together to resolve this debt and as a gesture of good faith, I enclose a postal order for the sum of £X, which would cover payments of 25th January and 1st February 2008, if you would kindly accept my offer. I do fully understand the implications should any lapses in payments arise and I will guarantee that my proposed payments will be met until the debt is fully repaid.

 

Yours Sincerely

 

 

 

Most local authorities do have an active anti-poverty strateogy and so by bringing their attention to this you may have the same luck as me and they will call the debt back from the baillifs.

 

If the baillifs are coming round on Friday then I would personally deliver the letter by hand tomorow to the councils main offices council tax unit in a sealed envelope - and then just sit tight and follow all the other advice here eg.keep doors and windows firmly shut and locked.

 

I am not an expert and I have nothing to qualify me to advise on any issue like this. This is just giving you any possible benefit from my experience.

 

MY POSTS ARE JUST MY OPINION AND ARE NOT TO BE TAKEN AS ANY FORM OF ADVICE OR INSTRUCTION.

[Conniff]

I would not be surprised if a bailiff working for the council reads what you are saying on this forum. The reason i am saying this is because if you were to say you were being bullied by bailiffs on behalf of a london borough . You would not be easily traceable through your details you have provided. However as torquay seems to be a small council any cases with them in is bound to catch a bailiffs attention.

 

 

It matters not if they read this lmam, the advice given here is only the rights that the op is entitled to and you can be sure that the bailiffs wont tell her/him what those rights are, but it is worth keeping in mind nontheless.

 

United Front has made a really useful post and it worthy of your consideration, read it a couple of times and decide if it will be of use to you, I would say yes it is.

 

 

Are you out from behind that sofa yet?

Edited August 27, 2008 by Conniff

[kermit2482]

Just bare in mind though that Torquay council are 1 of the local councils whom are sending out warrant officer bailiffs and carrying out arrests, however in your case i would doubt this would happen as you are clearly in the vulnerable group, point this out to the bailiff when he/she appears.

 

However i get the feeling you might have to await all the process first before it would possibly get returned to council, even then they could attach your benefits, however alwys worth a try with the council, good luck

 

kind regards kermit

[robin9342]

Not strictly correct. Nobody gets arrested at the liability order stage. Its only if the council go for commital proceedings and even then, the debtor has the chance to prove to the judge that they are a "can't pay" rather than a "won't pay" Please try not to scaremonger too much....

[kermit2482]

Not strictly correct. Nobody gets arrested at the liability order stage. Its only if the council go for commital proceedings and even then, the debtor has the chance to prove to the judge that they are a "can't pay" rather than a "won't pay" Please try not to scaremonger too much....

 

 

There you go again reading in to it what you want to read in to it, you lot are boreing me now!!!!!

[robin9342]

Just offering the OP what I hope is sound advice, as opposed to other opinion.

[kermit2482]

Just offering the OP what I hope is sound advice, as opposed to other opinion.

 

Indeed and i too am also only giving the poster FACTS, and i repeat it would be most unlikely for the op to be arrested, again just pointing out what Torbay do in some instances and we all know of one such lady whom was and convicted!!!!!!!!!! Now try and tell me im just scare mongering, IT WAS IN THE NATIONAL PRESS FOR LONG ENOUGH!!

 

Fact not fiction!!!!!!!!

 

The difference being that this poster wants to pay and this clearly goes in their favour!!

[HideBehindthesofa]

Indeed and i too am also only giving the poster FACTS, and i repeat it would be most unlikely for the op to be arrested, again just pointing out what Torbay do in some instances and we all know of one such lady whom was and convicted!!!!!!!!!! Now try and tell me im just scare mongering, IT WAS IN THE NATIONAL PRESS FOR LONG ENOUGH!!

 

Fact not fiction!!!!!!!!

 

The difference being that this poster wants to pay and this clearly goes in their favour!!

 

 

Hi Guys,

 

Many thanks for all your advice I have spoken to the Council and they are checking to see if they have an Anti Poverty Strategy in place(the receptionist did not have a clue what I meant) and I am awaiting for them to return my call.

In the meantime thanks yet again for the advice given so far and keep up the good work.

[robin9342]

IT WAS IN THE NATIONAL PRESS FOR LONG ENOUGH!!

Would be obliged if you could point me to the news article for this. The only ones I have found so far involve those refusing to pay. Many thanks.

[kermit2482]

Would be obliged if you could point me to the news article for this. The only ones I have found so far involve those refusing to pay. Many thanks.

 

 

Exactly why i say its highly unlikely to happen to this poster but as per the norm you choose to ignore that fact!!

 

Hope the poster does get this sorted soonest and im sure the council will get back to you soonest, in the mean time advise the bailiff company what you have done in writing and ask if they can put the account on hold for a while to allow a response from the council, they should oblige!!

[robin9342]

Ah, I see. Your previous post implied that someone who couldn't pay was sent to jail. So you concede that it was actually people who refused to pay: BIG difference!

[kermit2482]

Ah, I see. Your previous post implied that someone who couldn't pay was sent to jail. So you concede that it was actually people who refused to pay: BIG difference!

 

 

Like i said i DIDN'T imply anything its only because im a bailiff that you lot get the knives out, If i were not to of admitted to being a bailiff your responses to my posts would be much different, you see the trouble here is that SOME of you on here are just as bad the very people you seem to have a problem with and call them bullies, In my honest opinion all most of you on here have done is try to bully me with your ramblings and slanderous remarks just because im a bailiff, however i too am big and enough and ugly enough not to be intimadated so easily Great isn't it

 

Again i repeat you read in to the post what you want it to read and not what it states, some of you are very unwell people.

 

As for the original poster please keep us informed

[robin9342]

Not at all. I readily admit that my opinion of bailiffs is not exactly favourable. However, I have nothing against you personally. I, and others simply don't wish to see the less well-informed on this forum being misled by dubious advice. Absolutely nothing to do with bullying or intimidating you.

 

Please point me to one of my slanderous remarks as I am a little puzzled. You do seem to react quite badly to having your advice called into question, but this is a public discussion forum after all. As much as I enjoy our little exchanges, I have no intention of further hi-jacking the OPs thread, but I will continue to watch the thread and hope the OP has good luck with the council.

[kermit2482]

Not at all. I readily admit that my opinion of bailiffs is not exactly favourable. However, I have nothing against you personally. I, and others simply don't wish to see the less well-informed on this forum being misled by dubious advice. Absolutely nothing to do with bullying or intimidating you.

 

Please point me to one of my slanderous remarks as I am a little puzzled. You do seem to react quite badly to having your advice called into question, but this is a public discussion forum after all. As much as I enjoy our little exchanges, I have no intention of further hi-jacking the OPs thread, but I will continue to watch the thread and hope the OP has good luck with the council.

 

Oh how you make me larf, but yes im in agreeance with 1 thing lets get this back on track and allow the op to have the board back, happy days