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JonCris

Paul & Sparkie RBS seem to have bigger fish to fry

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Two self-made millionaires were furious yesterday after Scotland's largest bank continued to delay producing crucial evidence which it claims proves it was authorized to leave them penniless.

Edmund Keane and Jimmy Jones are arguing that the Royal Bank of Scotland had no right to use their life savings to set off debts on accounts set up secretly in their names by Keane's brother, the former Celtic director and RBS bank manager Dominic Keane.

Yesterday at the Court of Session in Edinburgh the bank requested another six weeks to examine the "numerous" hidden accounts and produce documentation which it claims shows that Dominic Keane instructed it to act as it had done.advertisement

The request was agreed by Lord Angus Glennie on condition that the bank agreed to a call from the two men's lawyer for it to supply all documents relating to instructions given by Dominic Keane for the opening of and making of debit entries for the first two years of all the relevant accounts.

The order follows a three-and-a-half year battle by the two men who are suing RBS over claims that it lost their £10m fortune and left them several million pounds in debt.

Both of them had agreed to grant power of attorney to Dominic Keane in 1990 when they moved overseas after selling off their carpet empire Colonel Gees.

But neither of them had any idea that all their money had gone until 2005 when a cheque for Mr Jones's sons' private school fees suddenly bounced and Edmund Keane received a letter telling him he was more than £2.5m in debt.

Yesterday's order came the day after it emerged that Dominic Keane is accused of using the concealed accounts to carry out a 13-year multi-million-pound fraud.

Michael Jones QC, lawyer for the two men, the pursuers in the case, attacked the bank during yesterday's hearing for continually failing to provide proof that the instructions existed despite repeated requests by the pair's legal team.

He said: "They RBS have had three-and-a-half years to investigate their position on this."

Later he added: "We're talking about two pursuers'...life savings."

The bank had claimed that the power of attorney agreements provided "sufficient authorisation" for it to use the men's fortunes to set off debts on the unknown accounts without telling them.

At court earlier this week RBS revealed that it had also received specific instructions from Dominic Keane, prompting Lord Glennie to rule that it must now provide proof of that for the two men.

Paul Cullen QC, acting for RBS, requested the six week time period yesterday after explaining that it would take a considerable amount of time to examine the "hundreds" of debit entries on the numerous accounts.

Quizzed by the judge he confessed that he didn't have a "complete understanding" of the "nature or detail" of all the documents or what was involved in going through them.

But he said: "Much of the information is likely to be of an entirely routine, daily nature. It is a little difficult to say what will entail getting proof."

After the hearing a source close to the men told "Three-and-a-half years after sending a letter to Edmund saying that all his money had gone and that he now owed about £2.5m, and after bouncing Jimmy's school fees cheque, the bank are still not willing to provide the information that they say shows that Dominic Keane gave them instructions to authorize these transactions.

"This was these men's life savings but the bank is still saying it would be too time-consuming to trawl through files to find evidence of instructions from Dominic Keane. Meanwhile Edmund Keane and Jimmy Jones are penniless. They are really angry."

The case will be continued at a preliminary hearing to be held in October.

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Hi JonCris,

 

The net RBS use to catch their fish to fry hasvery small holes in it ,,,,,it is designed to catch every single unsupecting fish,,,,,,,,both Paul and I have one account...one account number......but that account hastwo "book debts" one book debt is Approximately twice the amount of the other..

 

sparkie

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Nice one JC - i will bet the amount contained in my falsely created RBS "loan account" that they will not provide any documents giving power of attorney.

 

Another link: Former Celtic Director At Centre Of Lost Millions Row (from The Herald )

Edited by paulwlton

An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last. <br />

Winston Churchill

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If the RBS can't find this power of attorney document....then they will have to face up to the fact that they have misappropriated the money as far as the fact .......they have edit it.

 

sparkie

Edited by HSBCrusher
please be careful as to what you post please

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Of course they could always 'reconstruct' it as appears their want ;)

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If the RBS can't find this power of attorney document....then they will have to face up to the fact that they have misappropriated the money as far as the fact .......they have edit it.

 

sparkie

 

I think Sir Fred should be stripped of his knighthood - RBS are a disgrace.

 

I'm surprised this has only been reported in Scottish media.

Edited by paulwlton

An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last. <br />

Winston Churchill

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edit (Can I say that??!)

 

They just do whatever they like.

 

Has anybody ever seen Sir Fred? Maybe he can't type or write! Never seems to reply to anybody.....not even MP's!!!

 

D

Edited by HSBCrusher
no you cant :-)

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Currently watching Dispatches & apparently Sir Fred is avoiding the press

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I've spoken personally to the chap in this thread and it looks like the amount RBS were claiming had been artificialy inflated by about £13k. As of yet RBS have not provided srtaements showing how this figure was reached. The judge threw the claim out when RBS failed to turn up with the judge stating "RBS want this buied".

 

Unsurprisingly his account/s were held at CMS Telford.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/135159-royal-bank-scotland-claim.html

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last. <br />

Winston Churchill

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Latest from the Keane case.

 

The judge has ordered RBS to go back through several key accounts for Mr Keane and Mr Jones and provide all documentation plus explanations for all missing documents. They were supposed to have provided all the documents already and said that they had done so, but today seemed to suggest there might be more info available. They also agreed to provide the explanations requested, which they hadn't done for today.

So essentially the case continues until next month.


An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last. <br />

Winston Churchill

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Watching this with interest.


Advice offered by ENRON is without prejudice and is for your judgement as to whether to take it. You should seek the assistance or hire of a solicitor or other paid professional if in doubt.

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Latest from the Keane case.

 

 

The judge has ordered RBS to go back through several key accounts for Mr Keane and Mr Jones and provide all documentation plus explanations for all missing documents. They were supposed to have provided all the documents already and said that they had done so, but today seemed to suggest there might be more info available. They also agreed to provide the explanations requested, which they hadn't done for today.

 

So essentially the case continues until next month.

 

Exactly what they did and are doing with me.

December 2005........We have no documents on you, Mr sparkie.

6 months later.......ICO makes them supply 3 docs ....RBS said

We haven't got any more

18 months later March 2007 produce all my personal bank statemets...... in court.

Produce my copied credit file ...in court.

Produce records of my "Router Account" .....in court.

6 months later after the court case produce copies of my long closed business account.

In Feb 2008 Tell my MP they do not have any more.

In June 2008 produce another 25 documents.

 

They still havent produced records of how 5 cheques carried out 10 transactions some 14 days apart.

Havent produced a copy or any records of an "alleged" loan agreement.

Although admitting a sum of money was taken from my personal account, say they don't know where it is. and havent offfered it me back ....its been missing for 10 years.

 

sparkie

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Media update on the Keane case.

 

I can't beleive RBS would open accounts without the customers knowledge (not)

 

RBS Told To Produce Papers For Keane Accounts (from The Herald )


An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last. <br />

Winston Churchill

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The arrogance of RBS & their legal representatives beggars belief

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Paul I note sparkies post 4 was edited you may wish to do the same with your post 6 just so there is a match on the word used.

 

Just a thought but a bit late in the day.

 

aa


I have no legal training and the advice I offer is a matter of support. Before you commit to any Legal action you are advised to contact a qualified legal practitioner.

------------------------------------------------

Bank charge successes:

Halifax - Full settlement incl interest.

HSBC - Settlement, goodwill no admission of liability about 75% of claim.

RBS - Settlement, goodwill no admission of liability about 70% of claim.

2 ongoing claims for bank charges with HSBC with more to come. (Supreme Court ruling could have upset these claims) They did :mad:

PPI Successes

PPI 4 settlements on 9 loans. FOS involvement on 7 added on the 8 % Statutory interest another 30% to both.

2 claims settled in full with LV without FOS involvement.

2 claims settled in full with HSBC without FOS involvement

 

PPI Claims ongoing with:

Cap one Now with the FOS

Barclays. Paid up today 24/04/10 cheque received for over £4,500 and in the bank.

LTSB still have to decide on this as their SAR production was abysmal. Papers data mixed up documents missing etc

1 Complaint not upheld by FOS they said it was ICO issue. Complaint upheld by ICO. See this..

Post 290 from

***RBS PPI Claim Long fight but, WON***

Please do not PM me for advice as it may be sometime before I can respond.

 

Keep at them. Do not give way and do not accept all they tell you, they will delay and stall for as long as they can to prevent repaying you your mis-sold PPI.

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Paul I note sparkies post 4 was edited you may wish to do the same with your post 6 just so there is a match on the word used.

 

Just a thought but a bit late in the day.

 

aa

 

Well spotted, although i agree with him.

 

Paul


An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last. <br />

Winston Churchill

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Paul and Sparkie,

 

On the RBS front you may be pleased to know I have one little victory coming up and two fights still on with reference to PPI.

 

This is the thread very long but probably nowhere near Pauls thread....:eek:

 

alanalana PPI claim against RBS (looking for some help) please

 

apologies if you have already viewed:)

 

aa


I have no legal training and the advice I offer is a matter of support. Before you commit to any Legal action you are advised to contact a qualified legal practitioner.

------------------------------------------------

Bank charge successes:

Halifax - Full settlement incl interest.

HSBC - Settlement, goodwill no admission of liability about 75% of claim.

RBS - Settlement, goodwill no admission of liability about 70% of claim.

2 ongoing claims for bank charges with HSBC with more to come. (Supreme Court ruling could have upset these claims) They did :mad:

PPI Successes

PPI 4 settlements on 9 loans. FOS involvement on 7 added on the 8 % Statutory interest another 30% to both.

2 claims settled in full with LV without FOS involvement.

2 claims settled in full with HSBC without FOS involvement

 

PPI Claims ongoing with:

Cap one Now with the FOS

Barclays. Paid up today 24/04/10 cheque received for over £4,500 and in the bank.

LTSB still have to decide on this as their SAR production was abysmal. Papers data mixed up documents missing etc

1 Complaint not upheld by FOS they said it was ICO issue. Complaint upheld by ICO. See this..

Post 290 from

***RBS PPI Claim Long fight but, WON***

Please do not PM me for advice as it may be sometime before I can respond.

 

Keep at them. Do not give way and do not accept all they tell you, they will delay and stall for as long as they can to prevent repaying you your mis-sold PPI.

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