Statutory demand for payment, Debt for liquidated sum payable immediately

[emmliss]

hi

can anyone give me some advice been to cab today they wasnt very helpfull,well i recieved a statutory demand under section 268(1)(a) on sat 9th its now wednesday 13th august the demand is from connaught collections for a credit card debt of £1044.00 which they say is from 2004 i cannot even remember a credit card from the company style.the stat demand was sent by second class post it doesnt give detail of which court i should contact it just says on page 3 if you believe this should be set aside contact our offices and then gives there phone number.

the date on their demand is the 26th july yet i got it in the post on saturday 9th august.i no i have 18 days to set aside so i went to cab and they sent me to the county court yet my local court doesnt deal with this i have to go to the next county suffolk and im in norfolk to have it set aside,yet the 18th day is today according to their letter .

 

What will happen do you think if i dont go to suffolk and get it set aside do you think its a threat/bluff or do you think its real. i have no assetts i live with my partner and 3 kids i dont own my own house i have no savings the only thing i have is my car.and im on jobseekers.

 

what would the next step be for them would they go as far as bankrupt me for a small debt if it went that far would they take my car as i use it each day as my mum is disabled and im on carers allowance and i have to use the car to see her and look after her each day.

 

should i contact connaught collections or wait and see or should i send them some kind of letter im really worried i carnt even remember the debt but if its mine i coulnt afford to repay the whole amount straight away but i could offer 20.00 per month at a push but i guess they wouldnt accept such a small offer.

 

any help would be great.

[PGH7447]

hi

can anyone give me some advice been to cab today they wasnt very helpfull,well i recieved a statutory demand under section 268(1)(a) on sat 9th its now wednesday 13th august the demand is from connaught collections for a credit card debt of £1044.00 which they say is from 2004 i cannot even remember a credit card from the company style.the stat demand was sent by second class Thats illegal for starters post it doesnt give detail of which court i should contact it just says on page 3 if you believe this should be set aside contact our offices and then gives there phone number. Sound like a threat-o-gram to get you to ring them and not a proper SD, can you post it up removing personal details first

the date on their demand is the 26th july yet i got it in the post on saturday 9th august.i no i have 18 days to set aside so i went to cab and they sent me to the county court yet my local court doesnt deal with this i have to go to the next county suffolk and im in norfolk to have it set aside,yet the 18th day is today according to their letter .

 

What will happen do you think if i dont go to suffolk and get it set aside do you think its a threat/bluff or do you think its real. i have no assetts i live with my partner and 3 kids i dont own my own house i have no savings the only thing i have is my car.and im on jobseekers.

 

what would the next step be for them would they go as far as bankrupt me for a small debt if it went that far would they take my car as i use it each day as my mum is disabled and im on carers allowance and i have to use the car to see her and look after her each day.

 

should i contact connaught collections or wait and see or should i send them some kind of letter im really worried i carnt even remember the debt but if its mine i coulnt afford to repay the whole amount straight away but i could offer 20.00 per month at a push but i guess they wouldnt accept such a small offer.

 

any help would be great.

 

If you do not recognise the debt then send them the prove it letter.

 

Have you phoned the Suffolk court to see if this SD is registered there

[42man]

Yup...ring Suffolk court to see if indeed it has been registered with them....it may not be genuine but call them to check.

 

However in the first instance send a request for a copy of your Consumer Credit Agreement....you can find it here ...letter 'N' - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt-issues/20758-creditors-dcas-letter-templates.html

 

Add to the bottom of the letter that you have NEVER had a 'Style' card as they claim.

 

You need to send this by recorded delivery, with a £1 postal order and do not hand sign the letter....

[emmliss]

thanks for your reply

 

i sent off for the cca with £1.00 recorded and ill see what comes back,i also contacted suffolk court they had nothing registered but suggested norwich county court might which is 30 miles away,so ive just phoned them the clerk looked and couldnt find it registered but told me to ring back tommorow as the relevant person who should really look into it for me with more detail has left for the day,the ref number on the stat doesnt correspond with anything from court he said its a long letter sequance and this is numbers their own ref number i expect.

so what should i do if it hasnt been registered should i ignore it or not ? if it is genuine whats my next step as 18 days is today even though i only recieved it on saturday.

thanks guys any further help would be great.

[surfaceagentx20]

There is no point in telephoning a court for information about the SD. SDs are served by creditors. They are not issued out of court offices.

The time for compliance with an SD runs from the date of service, not the date endorsed against the signature of the creditor in the SD.

Additionally servive of an SD must comply with Insolvency Rules 1986 r.6.3 which places the creditor 'under an obligation to do all that is reasonable for the purpose of bringing the SD to the debtor's attention and, if practicable in the particular circumstances, to cause personal service of the demand to be delivered.'

 

Hence, unless there is a reason which would make personal service impractical, the creditor should cause personal service. That is hand the SD to you in person. The requirement is not met by slipping the SD in an envelope and hoping it might come to your attention by second class post.

 

If the creditor should decide to proceed with a petition based upon your failure to comply with a SD, the creditor will need to swear an affidavit deposing to the truth of the contents of the petition. One feature of the petition is that the creditor must state the date on which and the method by which the SD was served. The creditor will not be able to honestly state the prcise date on which the SD came to your attention if all he did was send it out second class post.

 

For the moment therefore I would be inclined to take no further steps subject to the answer you give to the following question:

 

Is the SD headed 'Debt for Liquidated Sum Payable Immediately Following a Judgment or Order of the Court'?

 

I see that whilst I've been knocking out this answer you have sent a letter. Postpone sending it if you can until you have answered the question.

[ODC]

You really need to go to your local court and apply to have this Stat Demand set aside. Most SDs sent out by this shower are used as a scare tactic so keep yourself right. They do not need to put a Court on it yet. When you apply to have it set aside go for costs against CONnaught.

 

Of course an SD should be served in person or if this is not possible then by first class post. CONnaught are abusing the Court system and need to be punished. Getting costs awarded against them is an excellent way of doing this plus getting a few quid from them.

[surfaceagentx20]

Please don't allow the prospect of punishing the creditor with a costs order to influence how you proceed. Costs are always in the disacretion of the court, but more importantly, unless you are proceeding by a solicitor to have the demand set aside, the amount of costs allowed (if any) on succesfully setting aside the SD will be limited to [1] £9.25 per hour and [2] how well you know your way around the Litigants in Person (Costs and Expenses) Act 1975 and CPR Parts 43-48. Even if you are, these are not going to be major considerations for an outfit intent on knobbling you for a four figure sum. The costs will be trivial in comparison. They will only be considerations if you do retain a solicitor when the hourly rate will be 20 times your litigant in person rate plus 17.5% VAT. But in that scenario the solicitor keeps the money not you.

 

I am not ruling out the need to seek professional advice at this time. Depending on the way you answer the question I asked, I just might.

 

So what's the answer?

 

X20

[emmliss]

hi

yes sent for cca recorded this afternoon...was that a mistake....as for what it says on the deman it reads

 

statutory demand under section 268(1)(a) of the insolvency act 1986.debt for liquidated sum payable immediately.

 

everyone on forum said to send the template letter for prove of credit agreement have i now made things worse?

 

thanks in advance

[ODC]

Please don't allow the prospect of punishing the creditor with a costs order to influence how you proceed. Costs are always in the disacretion of the court, but more importantly, unless you are proceeding by a solicitor to have the demand set aside, the amount of costs allowed (if any) on succesfully setting aside the SD will be limited to [1] £9.25 per hour and [2] how well you know your way around the Litigants in Person (Costs and Expenses) Act 1975 and CPR Parts 43-48.

Several members on here have recently applied for and been awarded Costs against these wretches. They have received several hundred pounds. True this may not be a huge amount to the likes of CONnaught or First Credit but if everyone that received one of their confetti like SDs went to Court and applied to have it set aside and asked for costs then they would surely have to think of a new tactic instead of mass mailing SDs which they had no intention of following up on.

[surfaceagentx20]

As I thought. The creditor has not prosecuted a claim to judgment.

 

The reason I was asking was because if there had been a judgment then I'd be asking for information to consider whether to apply to the court to set it aside. But since there isn't one no need to worry.

 

On this basis what we face is a SD which the creditor will in all likelihood decide not to take to the stage of presenting a petition. I say this because the creditor

 

1 is in the business of collecting money, not spending it or devaluing its claim by ranking itself alongside all other unsecured creditors

2 will have to shell out as much as the claim again in fees to court, lawyers and the Official Receiever's deposit if it goes ahead with a petition

3 has employed the cheapest method to deliver the SD

4 has been slap dash in completing the SD

5 will be unable to prove service of the SD

 

The only time he will be able to prove service is if you go ahead with an application to the court to set aside the SD or write to him and acknowledge receipt. Which is why I was asking you to hold off writing until I knew whether there was a judgment.

 

If in your letter you have referred to receiving the SD then the cat will be out the bag in which event the creditor will be able to show service. In those circumstances I would apply to set aside the SD, even though there is, in my opinion, still only a mild risk the creditor would proceed with a petition. It's not a risk I'd be inclined to take especially if I didn't owe the creditor the money.

 

If in your letter you make no mention of the SD then all the better. All you will have done is confirm to them where you live these days and they probably knew that anyway. Plus, having the s77 request in the pipeline is serving to keep the creditor from taking steps to enforce until there has been compliance with the request.

 

X20

[ODC]

Emmliss I strongly suggest you read the following informative thread

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/108949-short-warning-thread.html

[emmliss]

hi

thanks for that i sent them the standard downloadable letter

 

The Loan Company

Company House,

Church Street,

Newtown,

Kent,

R1 7HG

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Re:− Account/Reference Number 4563210025897412

 

With reference to the above agreement, we would be grateful if you would send us a copy of this credit agreement.

 

We understand that under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (Sections 77−79), we are entitled to receive a copy of our credit agreement on request. We enclose a payment of £1.00 which represents the fee payable under the Consumer Credit Act.

 

We understand a copy of our credit agreement should be supplied within 12 working days.

 

We understand that under the Consumer Credit Act creditors are unable to enforce an agreement if they fail to comply with a request for a copy of the agreement under these sections of the Act.

 

We look forward to hearing from you.

 

Yours faithfully

Mr A N Other

and placed my name in and refrence number i didnt metion the sd at all,so what your saying is do nothing wait and see if they try to take it further and wait for the cca reply????????

[Loser4u]

hi

i no i have 18 days to set aside so i went to cab and they sent me to the county court yet my local court doesnt deal with this i have to go to the next county suffolk and im in norfolk to have it set aside,yet the 18th day is today according to their letter .

 

What will happen do you think if i dont go to suffolk and get it set aside do you think its a threat/bluff or do you think its real. i have no assetts i live with my partner and 3 kids i dont own my own house i have no savings the only thing i have is my car.and im on jobseekers.

 

Emliss don't know if it's any help but I have had a SD set aside in Norwich County Court today. Their were 3 other set aside hearings heard in the same court and judge before me

[emmliss]

hi

was it a real demand or bluff did you speak to court before whats your story what happens now that its set aside? i dont no what to do for the best

[2Grumpy]

Wouldn't that be 18 days after you received the SD, not 18 days after the date of their letter?

[Loser4u]

hi

was it a real demand or bluff did you speak to court before whats your story what happens now that its set aside? i dont no what to do for the best

 

 

It probably was a bluff but don't take that chance you need to treat it as real.

 

Get your C.C.A. request off asap by special delivery and then S.A.R. the original creditor.

 

Have a search on for Statutory Demand and look at the reasons other people have you used. Mine was based on no C.C.A. Unlawful Charges, no notice of Assignment, No default notice.

I used the text other people had used to complete the forms. I used the defence from here

 

I was c***ing myself

I only spoke with the court twice once when I took my forms in to apply for it to be set aside and again today and everyone was very helpful. I waited for the last minute before I submitted the forms so that the 12+2 + 1 month dealine would be up before the court date.

 

I can scan my form in if you want but you will need to adapt the detail to suit yourself and their may be other reasons you can defend it from looking at the threads on here.

[palomino]

Emmliss, are you sure you've had one of those credit cards?

It may be that Connaught are looking for someone else with the same name as you. If that's the case then Letter N (the one you sent) is a bit premature.

 

Mind you, if they do send an agreement and it isn't yours then I can see a big, fat complaint to the Information Commissioner.

If, on the other hand, they do produce an agreement which is for you then it appears your memory is letting you down. Let's wait and see.

 

The important thing is to get the SD set aside so concern yourself with that for moment. surfaceagentx20 has given you good advice here.

[surfaceagentx20]

I think I need to clarify what I am saying about the wisdom of doing nothing at this stage contrasted with the advice of ODC strongly urging you to go to the county court to set aside the SD and his (Winston's a man right?) invitation that you consider the short warning thread. I repeat the relevant aspect of the short warning thread as follows:

 

Mistake 1 - statutory demands.

It is my view that you should never ignore a statutory demand. The advice that you should pretend that you never received it is in my view, at best, immoral. At worst it could lead you into severe criminal liability.

In order to have a statutory demand set aside, you need to do it within 18 days of receiving it. The process of setting aside a statutory demand REQUIRES you to swear an oath or affirmation to the effect of the date you received the letter.

Alternatively, you could go to the bankruptcy hearing, and lie saying you did not receive it.

In either case, you would be committing a crime if you were to lie about when you first received the statutory demand.

It is, in my view, inadvisable to ever ignore a statutory demand. Instead, you should get professional advice; I would suggest the National Debt Line.

This is particularly the case if you own your own home, or have substantial public investments in the stock market.

 

First, my advice is directed solely to emmliss as the person seeking assistance in the circumstances peculiar to him. It is not directed to a general, non-specific enquiry. Neither do I consider it my place in assisting emmliss to encourage persons to present DIY applications in court in order to rid society of the plague of empty SD threats.

 

Second, I have never encouraged emliss to pretend he has not received the SD. There is a world of difference between swearing on oath that you have not received a document when you in truth have (activity), and doing nothing about the document (inactivity). If my advice was treated as encouragement to positively pretend the document had not been served, please revise your assessment.

 

Third and as I said, the advice was specific to emmliss. The knowns about emmliss's case are as follows:

 

1 the debt is old and allegedly relates to a debt from back in 2004

2 emliss can't remember anything about the debt or the credit card

3 implicit in the absence of any recollection is that in the intervening 4 years emliss can not recall receiving one piece of paper designed to remind him that there is a debt owing going back to 2004. That would be no use of the card for 4 years, no statements for 4 years, no default notice, no termination, no chasing letters, no earlier demands from a DCA. Nothing until the SD arrived.

4 The SD is defective. It [1] neglects to identify the court to which emmliss should present his application to set aside and [2] does not give a contact address, merely a telephone number.

5 The creditor failed to serve the SD in accordance with rule 6.3 without good reason.

6 there are unknowns (see below)

 

The other 'almost known' is that the purpose of the SD was to scare emmliss into entering into a dialogue with the creditor in order that they might squeeze some money out of him. It was not delivered for the purpose of establishing his inability to pay his debts as and when they fall due.

 

Thus, in answer to emliss's question 'What will happen do you think if i dont go to suffolk and get it set aside', you have my answer. I don't think the SD will be followed with a petition.

 

If my prediction proves wrong and a petition is presented, emmliss's position is by no means lost or in any way impaired. He is perfectly entitled to advance a defence and protect his position, to include an application to restrain advertisement and so on. In his defence he can refer obviously to the SD he was served and explain the reasons why he elected to treat the SD as a sham. The reasons are all set out above at 1-5. In my opinion a court is likely, once it sees the SD and learns about the method of service (don't bin the envelope) to regard the SD as the work of a comic and accept that, in the eyes of a common man, the SD had all the appearance of a sham which might fairly and rightly be ignored. He need not and should not lie and say he had never seen the document before.

 

Assuming the court accepts the defence the petition will be dismissed. Job done. That said I do not know what the defence will be because apart from the 'never heard of you' argument, the preparation of a defence is in limbo pending receipt of the agreement the creditor relies on and the statement of account, followed no doubt by other enquiries concerning the service of a default notice etc etc. These unknowns are yet more reasons why it would be premature at this stage to submit an application to set aside the SD.

 

I hope this clarifies my position and explains why notwithstanding the general information in the short warning thread, I do not recommend that you apply to set aside the SD at this point in time.

 

X20

[palomino]

surfaceagentx20, I'm quite interested in this although the situation is not relevant to me at all. I hope you don't mind some discussion.

 

Can you clarify one point : If emmliss doesn't apply for the Statutory Demand to be set aside 'at this time' he can't apply at all. If this goes to court it will be a Bankruptcy Petition, not a SD.

 

 

Secondly you are recommending that emmliss should do nothing for the moment. I was one of those advocating an application to set aside. Do you think the arguments you have given for defending the Bankruptcy Petition would also be pertinent in a SD set aside application?

 

Lastly, what is an "application to restrain advertisement"?

[ODC]

Surfaceagent you seem to make it appear that people should not make ''DIY applications to court''

 

Why not?

 

Getting an SD Set Aside is a simple straightforward, cost free procedure.

 

We can all be 99.99% certain that this is just a ploy by CONnaught and merely used as a scare tactic that they have no intention of taking any further but I see no harm in applying to have it Set Aside.

[pt2537]

When issued with a Statutory Demand you MUST make an application to set it aside!!!!

 

you can then obtain costs as well upon setting the SD aside,

 

for a good guide to SD's have a read here, http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/135078-me-1st-credit-stat.html#post1426635

 

also i would say that Tomterms advice is always spot on in my opinion

[ScarletPimpernel]

Applying to have SDs set aside is important, especially if they are being used, as so often, as a scare tactic. Such SDs are clearly an abuse of the Court system and should be brought to notice.

[ODC]

When issued with a Statutory Demand you MUST make an application to set it aside!!!!

 

you can then obtain costs as well upon setting the SD aside,

 

for a good guide to SD's have a read here, http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/135078-me-1st-credit-stat.html#post1426635

 

also i would say that Tomterms advice is always spot on in my opinion

 

Applying to have SDs set aside is important, especially if they are being used, as so often, as a scare tactic. Such SDs are clearly an abuse of the Court system and should be brought to notice.

I think the new member is trying to make it appear that its difficult to get an SD Set Aside when many people on here have shown its a very simple procedure

[surfaceagentx20]

To palamino

 

A debtor has a right to apply to the court to set aside a SD at any time during the period of 18 days from the date of service or date of advertisement under rule 6.3(3). If the 18 days have expired his right to present an application is conditional upon his first succesfully making an application to the court for an extension of the 18 day time limit.

 

If an application to set aside is not made, the creditor is at liberty, at any time after 21 days have expired following service of the SD, to present a petition.

 

Sorry, forget about advertisement of the petition. It is the winding up petition which is advertised, not the bankruptcy petition, although a SD may be advertised under rule 6.3(3).

 

To ODC

 

I have no recollection of writing anything would would cause a careful reader to conclude that I believe people should not make DIY applications to the court. Likewise that I expressed the opinion that it is difficult to get a SD set aside. For this reason I should be grateful if a member more experienced than I would care to produce the text in which it is claimed I advance such opinions.

 

The facts are these: Applications to set aside which show good grounds succeed and those that don't don't. Simple as that.

 

Readers should bear in mind that as a matter of practice, courts do not issue applications to set aside SDs on presentation. Before issue they are vetted by a District Judge and only those which set out an arguable case are issued. The remainder are dismissed without a hearing.

 

X20

[ODC]

To ODC

 

 

The facts are these: Applications to set aside which show good grounds succeed and those that don't don't. Simple as that.

 

Readers should bear in mind that as a matter of practice, courts do not issue applications to set aside SDs on presentation. Before issue they are vetted by a District Judge and only those which set out an arguable case are issued. The remainder are dismissed without a hearing.

 

X20

I have no desire to get into an argument with you over this but I value the advice of Tomterm and PT in this matter to that of someone who has only joined the forum.

 

Good grounds for getting an SD Set Aside are non compliance with a CCA request. I have not heard of too many members on here having their applications for Set Asides dismissed. The contrary would appear to be the case.