Charging order help required**SORTED**

[smutley]

Apologies if I am in the wrong thread - but I am really worried about a charging order that my sister has just had imposed upon her. Briefy:

 

Sister - 6 children - recently divorced

Racked up numerous credit card debts - all sorted on minimum payments apart from one - The Abbey - although taking her £5 every month, refused to accept and obtained charging order on her house. Debt was 8k now just under 10K. Sister received letter today from Eversheds who in turn use Arrow(?) stating that unless debt paid in full by 18 Aug balifs will be sent or house sold to recoup money owed.

 

Now apart from the fact that my sister applied to the court to have hearing moved from Preston to Lancaster which apparantly was done, the hearing went ahead in Preston.

 

She has not defaulted on her mortgage and her ex husband has a charge on the house of 30%

 

Can abbey/eversheds/arrow enforce sale even though they are not first in line with the charges and also, surely ex husband could complain as his 30% is an investment to him until youngest child is 18/21 years old?

 

Any help appreciated as I want to help my sister before she falls to pieces

 

thanks

[Avesovum]

Hi Smutley,

 

Sorry to here of your sisters predictament.

 

I have been in a similar situation.

 

I went through Free Debt Management company | Debt Advice | Payplan to help me with keeping the creditors at bay except for one creditor which put a charge order on my property but failed to register it with the land registry, so i sold my house and they didn't get a penny. But i put that down to a stroke of luck.

 

First of all under no circumstances let the bailiffs in you are not under any legal obligation to do so. Also do not allow the bailiffs to look through the windows use curtains or blinds at all times. These are common tactics used by creditors to put the fear of god into you, but in reality don't have the clout the think they do.

 

Only a court bailiff can gain entry and they must have a warrant.

 

It is quite easy for companies now to obtain a charge order on your property, that seems to be the norm in the court circuit these days.

 

If the husband has got an interest in the property then the court cannot force him to sell, he has to agree voluntarily (This is the Law)

 

The County Court circuit is quite a shambles these days because if you admit the debt thats all the court is interested in and not interested in how your financial propblem came about.

 

 

Hope this helps

[FunkyFox]

Hi, I would imagine the mods will create your own thread in due course and move the posts as this is for the petition really, in the meantime I'll try and help if I can.

 

From the information you have given it is difficult to detemine exactly what stage matters have got to. I'm assuming that a CCJ has been granted and your sister did not enter a defence or make an offer of payment and judgment by defaul was entered for the full amount. Please can you confirm this?

 

Depending on when this happened then and the fact the letter may proceed an interim changing order or a final order. We need to determine the facts relating to the stage she is at.

 

In theory a creditor with a final charging order could make an order for sale request to the court but in my humble opinion it is HIGHLY unlikely that this would be granted against a single mum of 6 kids offering to make an affordable monthly payment. So, what next...?

 

Was a CCJ granted if so when and for how much? Are you able to scan judgement form?

 

Did the court confirm in writing the hearing was to be moved and then it still went ahead elsewhere. What were the actual circumstances of this?

 

Has an interim charging order been granted? If so When?

 

Has charging order been made final? If so when?

 

Has your sister made any payments during this time and was there an agreement before?

 

What exactly does the latest letter say?

 

I have had success getting charging orders dismised and CCJ's set aside but in order to help an accurate summary of the current situation is required.

 

Happy to help and tell your sister not to worry, the main thing is to be proactive and to take action.

 

FF

[saintly_1]

I have moved your post to its own thread along withthe replies you have had

[smutley]

Thanks for moving thread.... and thanks to all for the help - I will be speaking to my sister tonight (Im in Cardiff and shes in Lancaster) to get more info to ans. funkyfox and in the meantime I have asked her to scan in the letter from Eversheds that came today so I will be able to post it up.

[smutley]

Image - TinyPic - Free Image Hosting, Photo Sharing & Video Hosting

 

heres the letter - hope this works

Edited August 12, 2008 by smutley
its small going to have another go

[smutley]

Hi, spoke with my sister and here are the answers - hope they throw some light on situation....

 

Was a CCJ granted if so when and for how much? Are you able to scan judgement form? -

Ans. sister received county court sumons to which she filled in and sent back offering payment of £5 per month. This was refused by Eversheds and seems they got judgement by default. (but not received a formal ccj from court?)

 

Did the court confirm in writing the hearing was to be moved and then it still went ahead elsewhere. What were the actual circumstances of this?

Ans. No didnt get it in writing. Sister phoned Bradford (sorry I thought it was Preston) and they said they would transfer to Lancaster. My sister rang on several occasions to check on ths and the last phone call a few days before the hearing (7 Aug) clerk said that as they had received no reply from Eversheds agreeing to transfer, that they would just transfer it anyway..... famous last words, they have now admitted that they were in the wrong and it didnt get transferred and went ahead in Bradford

 

Has an interim charging order been granted? If so When?

 

Has charging order been made final? If so when?

When sister received court papers re the hearing 7 Aug, she filled in form and also sent letter offering £5 a month - the court are still waiting for a reply from Eversheds, but the hearing went ahead anyway and they got their charging order (not sure on interium order)

 

Has your sister made any payments during this time and was there an agreement before?

Ans. Yes, sister has continually paid £5 per month to them although they will not agree to it and went ahead and got the charging order

What exactly does the latest letter say?

Ans - see above letter scan in (if link works!)

 

.... I should get my sister to join the group..... will work on that one, but think she is so depressed right now I might have to do the mediating!!8)

[FunkyFox]

HI ignore most of this our posts crossed

 

Hi Smutley

 

Well from the letter it would appear to be the case that they have a CCJ and a charging order.

 

We need to establish the circumstances of the CCJ and charging order especially the dates and locations (was the hearing moved etc). Did she enter an admission etc. All this will help with possible next steps.

 

Also was the debt assigned to Arrow Global? Does she have a letter of assignment?

 

Thanks, FF

[FunkyFox]

Apart from the question about Arrow Global - important as they would appear to be the claimant so bought the debt I assume.

[smutley]

hi ff, thanks for your help with this... yes as far as I know (will check exactly with my sister later tonight on the details) but I remember her saying months ago that the debt had gone to Arrow - and boy did they harrass her with phone calls. I presume by her offering the £5 per month payment she has admitted liability to debt...

[FunkyFox]

So she sent an admission offering £5 per month? This was refused (by the court - not eversheds its not up to them) and the court made a forthwith order? I would think this quite unsual if she completeed the Income and Expenditure section of the claim form and demonstrated this is all she could afford. Sorry to be so pedantic but the devils in the detail.

 

Also you mentioned she is depressed (who wouldn't be when being harrassed like this) - is she receiving treatment, has she been to the doctors at all.

 

It would seem that matters are very advanced to be honest. I suspect the only option will be to try to get the CCJ set aside and the charging order discharged on the basis the hearing went ahead without her being aware it hadn't been moved.

 

In the meantime she needs to begin to see if she has a possible defence and needs to request a copy of her agreement from Arrow and also send them a dpa request. All the details to do this are on the site, shout if needs be.

 

A N244 form is whats required to apply for a set aside this can be downloaded from here The requested resource (/HMCSCourtFinder/tiles/Her Majesty's Courts Service -Forms and Guidance) is not available

 

The fee is £75 but she may well be exempt.

 

Its a disgrace that an organisation should consider an order for sale against someone in your sisters circumstances for what was an unsecured debt. I will do all I can to help as I'm sure will the other CAG'ers.

 

FF

[smutley]

.... when my sister got the cc summons 28 may it said to send back to Eversheds, this she did, filling in the income and expenditure part and offered the £5 per month and filled in the omission form N9A. Judgement for the claimant after determination 18 June from court arrived - the claimant has objected to the rate of payment you offered, the court has therefore decided the rate of payment you must pay the full amount forthwith - also note that said if you object, you must reply within 16 days. My sister did this - sent redetermination form, but whilst waiting for reply from court on that, she got an interium charging order on 5 july, which set the date for the final charging order hearing of 7 aug. So she wrote to the court asking them to transfer hearing to Lancaster, didnt get wrtten reply so phoned and was told they were waiting for a reply from eversheds re the redeterination order and then today found out that the charging order went though anyway - hence the letter.

So it seems that eversheds are able to ignor the redetermination order request.

[FunkyFox]

She needs to get on to the court asap in the morning and find out what happened to her redetermination hearing. It seems odd that the final charging order hearing went ahead without taking that into consideration.

 

Just out of interest what did her income and expenditure say at the bottom line? Was £5 a reasonable offer? Did she give details of her other debts and what they had accepted?

 

With an admission its going to be very hard to get judgement set aside. I think she needs to concertrate on this 'missing' redetermination hearing as the route to get matters resolved.

[smutley]

My sister thanks you very much for all your help and will be ringing the court tomorrow to pursue the redetermination hearing and attempt to ask the judge to accept the £5 per month.... and also point out to them again that it was their fault that the hearing went ahead when she was told on the phone that it was being transferred to Lancaster.

with regard to the income and expenditure form, she did list all her other debts and the amounts that they were accepting (£1 - £2) and even the CAB advised that £3.50 would be the maximum that she could afford to Arrow - but she up't this to £5 as a gesture of goodwill!

will post the response she gets from Bradford cc tomorrow.

Thanks again

[smutley]

Hi, but of a break through on this, my sister got in touch with Bradford cc today, and was told that it had been put before Judge again today and he has ruled that her house cannot be sold and has agreed to the £5 per month payment! Think he realised that court has made a mistake in hearing the case as it was supposed to have been moved to Lancaster. Anyway, my sister should receive this in writing.... so fingers crossed that this happens. I have told her to still write into the court and get her side of the story in writing and on record. Ultimately she still has the charge on her house, but at least now she will have a manageable repayment scheme for the foreseeable future. And yes, she knows that she cannot default on any of the monthly payments!!! So much thanks to you all and especially ff - you are a star:D

[FunkyFox]

I'm thrilled for you and your sister. Under the circumstances its probably the best and only realastic outcome.

[saintly_1]

Well done smutley glad you havent lost that fighting spirit

[smutley]

oh yes, still plenty of fight left in me....just wish I was more knowledgeable to help others like you and ff do so well xxx