Jump to content


PPI rejected Natwest... HELP!!!!


style="text-align: center;">  

Thread Locked

because no one has posted on it for the last 4751 days.

If you need to add something to this thread then

 

Please click the "Report " link

 

at the bottom of one of the posts.

 

If you want to post a new story then

Please

Start your own new thread

That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help 

 

Thanks

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 77
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

I think that's a good idea Karen. :)

 

You need to be aware that before escalating a complaint to the FOS or filing in court, you need to have offered NatWest every opportunity to provide you with the information and documents you are asking for.

 

You need to keep to timescales (ie, 40 days for SAR, 14 days for LBA etc) and be able to prove that you did so. You will also need to demonstrate that you have entered into 'sincere dialogue' with NatWest and given them sufficient time to investigate your complaint and provide evidence that they have acted fairly, in other words, prove to you that they have not mis-sold PPI.

 

This was good advice that one of the Site Team posted up many moons ago on CAG relating to any kind of claim against banks, etc, and it is advice that has helped me achieve success in my claims.

 

The lender may not keep to timescales and that is more evidence in your favour to present either in court or to the FOS/Information Commissioner.

 

 

Let us know on here when the 40 days are up and we can takes things from there.

'Fortune favours the brave.'

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Any advice given is purely on the basis of my own views and opinions and offered in good faith.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Well there is an update..finally. I get a parcel from NW in ref to my SAR letter and inside is lots of info, but nothing re my loan agreement or PPI. Enclosed was the balance of the loan, showing what has been paid to date, when loan started etc, but the actual loan papers were not included. When I looked on some of the bank notes it shows my requests for loan agreement and the notes say these can not be found.!!! Yet they have cashed the chq for £1?

 

I then notice that I have another letter delivered from NW sending back my £10 chq stating the following:

 

For teh data protection act to apply info which is not stored electronically needs to be held in a certain structured format which is easily accessable. An example of this would be if info was filed in alpha order referring to the name of the customer and then the file itself was broken down into different topics. Info held in such a strcutred format is known as a Relevant Filing System.

 

Part of your Subject Accedss Request, the CCA would not generally be held by the bank in a relevant filing system and as such would fall out with the scope of the Act. This would mean that you would not be entitled to it uner the Data Protection Act. PLease find enclosed your cheque.

 

HELP! What does all this mean and what should I do now.

 

Is this good news re taking it to the FOS????

 

Gratfeul for your help x x

Link to post
Share on other sites

hello karenc,

 

Well there is an update..finally. I get a parcel from NW in ref to my S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) letter and inside is lots of info, but nothing re my loan agreement or PPI. Enclosed was the balance of the loan, showing what has been paid to date, when loan started etc, but the actual loan papers were not included. When I looked on some of the bank notes it shows my requests for loan agreement and the notes say these can not be found.!!! (you could use this to put the loan in dispute and stop making payments until they produce the CCA) Yet they have cashed the chq for £1? (This means they have taken the fee and failed to produce the CCA which they have a legal requirement to do within 14 days. After that they are committing an offence and cannot insist on any further payments until the CCA is produced)

I then notice that I have another letter delivered from NW sending back my £10 chq stating the following:

 

For teh data protection act to apply info which is not stored electronically needs to be held in a certain structured format which is easily accessable. An example of this would be if info was filed in alpha order referring to the name of the customer and then the file itself was broken down into different topics. Info held in such a strcutred format is known as a Relevant Filing System.

 

Part of your Subject Accedss Request, the CCA would not generally be held by the bank in a relevant filing system and as such would fall out with the scope of the Act. This would mean that you would not be entitled to it uner the Data Protection Act. PLease find enclosed your cheque. (In my opinion this is a load of tosh to fob you off If they do not have the CCA you can put the loan into dispute until they produce it!!)

Please see this info and the associated link

For legal issues relating to Data Protection check this link...Lots of very useful info in understandable terms.

Data Protection | OUT-LAW.COM

 

it includes the following and much much more

Negotiating with the Data Subject (This should be important to Banks)

 

At this stage, it is advisable to negotiate with the data subject. The location information the data subject will have already given will give a clue as to what it is the data subject really wants to have information about. The benefit of the Data Protection Act 1998 is that it allows data controllers to negotiate with data subjects to get the data subject to specify the exact information he or she wishes to receive.

 

The data controller is entitled to ask for a fee of £10 and two further pieces of information. Firstly, the data controller must satisfy himself that the person making the request is, in fact, the data subject. The use of a subject access request form is advised, since the greatest breach of a data controller's security is for the data controller to satisfy a subject access request made by a person impersonating the data subject. The use of the form goes towards proving that the data controller has adequate identification and verification procedures in place. Secondly, the data controller is entitled to ask the data subject for further information to enable the data controller to locate the information which that person seeks.

 

When the last of these three pieces of information has been obtained, the forty day period starts to run. It is advisable to put procedures in place to ensure that the receipt of the request and the further information is correctly dated so that an organisation knows how long it has to satisfy the subject access request.

 

However, if the data subject is adamant that he or she wishes to receive a copy of everything the data controller holds on him or her, then there is very little the data controller can do about this, and a completely exhaustive search of the computerised and manually held data in the organisation will be required. (nice to know what you see in the Act is what you get)

All of the above from this link in stickies..links...

also check out my own link...alanalana PPI claim against RBS (looking for some help) please

Posts 27 and 47 may help you:wink:

 

HELP! What does all this mean and what should I do now.

 

I would suggest you write one more letter asking for all the information and tell them if it is not forthcoming you will make a complaint to the Information Commissioners Office about their failure to comply with the relevant legal Statutes within the Consumer credit Act 1974

Is this good news re taking it to the FOS????

 

You can go to FOS or Court if you do FOS first and the complaint is not upheld which will be months ahead due to large (very large) backlog then you have the Court option. If youd do Court first and lose the FOS will most probably not take up your complaint. You have to make the call that suits you:-?

 

good luck:)

 

aa

  • Haha 1

I have no legal training and the advice I offer is a matter of support. Before you commit to any Legal action you are advised to contact a qualified legal practitioner.

------------------------------------------------

Bank charge successes:

Halifax - Full settlement incl interest.

HSBC - Settlement, goodwill no admission of liability about 75% of claim.

RBS - Settlement, goodwill no admission of liability about 70% of claim.

2 ongoing claims for bank charges with HSBC with more to come. (Supreme Court ruling could have upset these claims) They did :mad:

PPI Successes

PPI 4 settlements on 9 loans. FOS involvement on 7 added on the 8 % Statutory interest another 30% to both.

2 claims settled in full with LV without FOS involvement.

2 claims settled in full with HSBC without FOS involvement

 

PPI Claims ongoing with:

Cap one Now with the FOS

Barclays. Paid up today 24/04/10 cheque received for over £4,500 and in the bank.

LTSB still have to decide on this as their SAR production was abysmal. Papers data mixed up documents missing etc

 

1 Complaint not upheld by FOS they said it was ICO issue. Complaint upheld by ICO. See this..

Post 290 from

***RBS PPI Claim Long fight but, WON***

 

Please do not PM me for advice as it may be sometime before I can respond.

 

Keep at them. Do not give way and do not accept all they tell you, they will delay and stall for as long as they can to prevent repaying you your mis-sold PPI.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

If your account goes into dispute while your claim is being investigated, you can request that a note is put on your Credit File via the CRAs to state this.

'Fortune favours the brave.'

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Any advice given is purely on the basis of my own views and opinions and offered in good faith.

Link to post
Share on other sites

thanks for the post. I'd rather not have anything that could have an adverse affect on my credit rating to be honest.

 

So the next step should be to write another letter. Are there any templates I could possibly use? I mean, the bit where they are saying the CCA does not come under the Data Protection Act as they dont have it in their "relevant filing system".???

 

I have had a look on the Outlaw website. to be honest I feel blinded by science as such. I'm getting confused!! (doesn't take much!)

 

Is there anyone that wouldnt mind helping me draft another letter pls???? I'm getting my knickers in a bit of a twist over this now. EEEEEEEK

 

Thank you sooooo much in advance

x

Link to post
Share on other sites

OK, at this stage I would ask you whether you have gleaned any information from reading the links contained within Alalana's post #31.

 

 

Send this letter to NatWest for CCA non-compliance DCA: Non-Compliance of CCA Request amend it to include your own details. Please include a statement saying that they have cashed the £1 cheque and as such are obliged to comply with your data request.

 

Enclose with it a second letter relating to the PPI (and this is purely my opinion, you are not obliged to send this in tis exact form; please read carefully and amend after careful consideration of your circumstances as you know them better than me):

 

 

 

Date

 

 

Ref: Account X

 

 

Section 7 – Data Protection Act 1998

 

 

Dear X

 

I write to inform you that I am not satisfied with the response you have provided to my initial complaint. I assert that I have been mis-sold Payment Protection Insurance (PPI) taken out on the above named loan account, by your organisation.

 

I am in receipt of the documents that you have supplied in response to my Data Protection Act information request dated (Insert Date). The disclosure of personal data is incomplete in that at least the following documents are missing.

 

(Adapt this next section to your situation)

1) You have failed to provide a complete list of transactions and charges. (Add details of missing period - or a transaction that you know about which is not included)

2) You have provided no notes, or documents relating to any legal action between you and myself.

3) You have provided no notes, or documents relating to instances of manual intervention.

 

This is not an exhaustive list by any means, it is just an example of some of the information I am missing.

 

Accordingly, I have to tell you that you have not yet complied with your obligations under the Data Protection Act 1998. You have a further (Insert number of days remaining) days to comply. Should you not respond to this letter positively and by providing the missing information which is legally binding upon you, then I will lodge a complaint for non-compliance of the Data Protection Act 1998 with the Information Commissioner.

 

I would like to remind you that as my loan was taken out on date, NatWest as a respected financial institution was regulated by the FSA who, four months previously had put in place a ruling governing the mis-selling of PPI to its customers. Your organisation is therefore, bound to provide a reasonable level of care to me as a customer. You have not done this and are therefore, in breach of FSA guidelines and the Banking Code.

 

I assert that your salesperson when conducting the loan application, lead me to believe that the loan would not be processed without the addition of PPI, and as such, I feel that I was pressurised into purchasing a product which did not suit my personal needs.

 

You state that the sale was made on a 'non advised basis'. You will be aware that the FSA provides guidelines to lenders for both Advised and Non Advised Sales of financial products which includes PPI. Whilst the salesperson is not obliged to make a recommendation to a customer, the FSA states that

"The customer must, however, still receive sufficient information on the product to enable them to make an informed decision as to whether it meets their own demands and needs." (FSA)

 

At no point did I receive any such information, either by letter, document or telephone call which followed the above guideline. The documents that you have provided copies of do not contain any of the information that I have outlined above and cannot, therefore, be deemed as meeting the standard of care which you should have provided.

 

I reposed absolute trust in your ability as a financial institution to provide a reasonable level of care and skill in ensuring that my best interests were met when taking out a loan with your organisation. This has not been the case and I am extremely shocked and disappointed.

 

I would further suggest that the Principles of Business which are legally binding on Alliance and Leicester under the Financial Services and Markets Act 2000 and which are contained in the FSA Handbook, have not been followed. Therefore you are in breach of regulations.

 

You have 14 days in which to provide the information I am requesting together with the return of PPI payments made on the account totalling £x with interest of £X.

 

I look forward to your postitive response.

 

 

Yours sincerely

 

 

 

 

Karen, as you've aleady had a refund, I anticipate they'll enter into a debate about the amount woing at some stage. It would be as well for you to have calculated how much the PPI was and the interest on top.

 

:)

Edited by Paintball
Additional info :-)

'Fortune favours the brave.'

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Any advice given is purely on the basis of my own views and opinions and offered in good faith.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hang on sweet ... I'm going to tweak it as it wasn't as sharp a letter as I would have liked:) (tired after work an' all that jazz!!)

 

 

 

UPDATED LETTER

Edited by Paintball

'Fortune favours the brave.'

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Any advice given is purely on the basis of my own views and opinions and offered in good faith.

Link to post
Share on other sites

OK :) Don't forget that there are two letters to send, and that you should send them first class signed for post keeping copies for your records.

'Fortune favours the brave.'

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Any advice given is purely on the basis of my own views and opinions and offered in good faith.

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...

Hi all, I'm back and Natwest still havent produced the goods....

I sent them the following letter (with the help of Paintball and the rest of you!!) on 23rd Sept and they had until 28th Sept to produce the CCA. This letter was received on 24th Sept 08

Dear Sir/Madam,

Thank you for your letter of 11 September 2008 , the contents of which have been noted.

You have failed to respond to my legal request to supply me a true copy of the original Consumer Credit Agreement for the above account.

On the 12 August 2008 I wrote to you requesting a copy of the credit agreement and other information under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (Sections 77-79).

On 13 August 2008 a member of your staff signed for delivery of my written request and I have an electronic proof of delivery showing their signature and the date.

To date you have failed to comply with these requests in any way, whether by confirmation of receipt of the request or by supplying the requested documents.

These documents I requested should be readily available as proof of your legal right to collect this account under the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

In my letter of the 12 August 2008 I made a formal request for a copy of the signed, executed credit agreement for the above account under section 77(1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. A statement of this account was sent to me detailing all debits and credits to the account as well as other items requested in the Subject Access Request. But I was informed that you do not have a copy of my Consumer Credit Agreement. This is noted on the enclosed letter from Danielle Sharp and also on my bank notes (also enclosed); it says this can not be found!? Yet the £1 cheque I sent (chq number 1062) has been cashed.

Furthermore, you are aware that the Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for a request for a true copy of a credit agreement to be carried out before you enter into a default situation. The 12 working days expired on 29th August.

If that request is not satisfied after a further 30 calendar days your client commits a summary criminal offence.

This 30 day limit will expire on 28th September 2008, 5 days time.

As you are no doubt aware section 77(6) states:

If the creditor fails to comply with Subsection (1)

(a) He is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement.

And

(b) If the default continues for one month he commits an offence.

Therefore this account will become unenforceable at law if the Consumer Credit Agreement is not provided in 5 days time – 28th September 2008

So far, you have failed to comply with a lawful request for a true, signed copy of the said agreement and other relevant documents mentioned in it.

Furthermore you should be aware that a creditor is not permitted to take ANY Action against an account whilst it remains in dispute.

The lack of a credit agreement is a very clear dispute and as such the following applies.

  • You may not demand any payment on the account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.
  • You may not add further interest or any charges to the account.
  • You may not pass the account to a third party.
  • You may not register any information in respect of the account with any credit reference agency.
  • You may not issue a default notice related to the account.

I reserve the right to report your actions to any such regulatory authorities as I see fit. You have 14 days from receiving this letter to contact me with your intentions to resolve this matter which is now a formal complaint.

I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter.

I look forward to hearing from you in writing.

So, what would you advise to be the next step??

Thanks :-)

Karen xx

Link to post
Share on other sites

I also sent this letter with the CCA letter as per the post above:

 

Again... no response

 

Dear Sir/Madam,

 

I am in receipt of the documents that you have supplied in response to my Data Protection Act information request dated 12 August 08. The disclosure of personal data is incomplete in that at least the following documents are missing.

 

1) Consumer Credit Agreement

 

Accordingly, I have to tell you that you have not yet complied with your obligations under the Data Protection Act 1998. You have a further 5 days to comply.

 

In addition, I would like to remind you that as my loan was taken out in May 2005 NatWest as a respected financial institution was regulated by the FSA who, four months previously had put in place a ruling governing the mis-selling of PPI to its customers.

 

I assert that your salesperson when conducting the loan application with me lead me to believe that the loan would not be processed without the addition of PPI, and as such, I feel that I was pressurised into purchasing a product which did not suit my personal needs.

 

You state that the sale was made on a 'non advised basis'. You will be aware that the FSA provides guidelines to lenders for both Advised and Non Advised Sales of financial products and PPI. Whilst the salesperson is not obliged to make a recommendation to a customer, the FSA states that "The customer must, however, still receive sufficient information on the product to enable them to make an informed decision as to whether it meets their own demands and needs."

 

During the sales process I was not made aware that alternative insurance products could be purchased elsewhere, nor the comparative costs of these against the cost of your own PPI product. This is information which your organisation would have had access to at the time of the sale, yet it was not made known to me. As such, I feel that I have been mis-sold PPI by your organisation in whom I had reposed faith as a respected lender and I am frankly shocked and dismayed at your assertions to the contrary.

You have a further 14 days in which to provide the information I am requesting together with the return of PPI payments made on the account totaling £2,784.26 plus interest of £222.74. This is the original amount of £5,408, minus the refunded amount in December 2006 of £2,623.74, plus interest at 8%.

 

I look forward to your positive response.

Any ideas what to do next??? Grateful for your assistance as usual xxxx

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Karen

 

Now it's time for you to decide what you really want from NatWest. You have requested information that you're entitled to receive from the lender within Section 78 of the CCA 1974 as it is a running credit account. NatWest have failed to provide you with this info ... despite numerous reasonable requests on your part. They are now in breach of their legal obligations to you.

 

You have received a refund but maintain that PPI was mis-sold to you.

 

Now you need to decide whether you want to pursue this as a mis-selling claim and go for all the money you have paid in PPI premiums together with the interest charged.

 

If you escalate this through the courts, you can send a request for any documents using the CPR Section 18 pre-action protocol.

 

Happy to help further, please just say ... :)

'Fortune favours the brave.'

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Any advice given is purely on the basis of my own views and opinions and offered in good faith.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Ah, just seen your last post.

 

Well, you've told them what you want, why you think they have mis-sold and what they have breached in doing so.

 

You've given them an additional 14 days, so wait and see then IMO, issue N1 in court to get them to pay up ... that's your call, of course :)

'Fortune favours the brave.'

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Any advice given is purely on the basis of my own views and opinions and offered in good faith.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for your reply. Should I now go to the FOS before the court option? They only gave me a partial refund when I cancelled the policy in 2006. I just want the amount that I had paid for the forst 18 months of the loan.

 

Their 14 days ran out Weds 8th October. (inc weekends)

 

I have no prob taking them to court, but its the fees that worry me.... i have no idea what to expect fee wise?

x

Link to post
Share on other sites

Karen here's the link to HMCS website, fees: http://www.hmcourts-service.gov.uk/courtfinder/forms/ex50.pdf

 

As your claim is just over 3K in total, the fee will be £108 which is not too bad. You will of course be adding this fee to your total money reclaim so you'll get it back when you win :)

 

As I said above, my view is to threaten them with court action as I feel they haven't a leg to stand on. Can't see them justifying their lack of cooperation and the mis-selling in front of a judge, can you? I think they'll reconsider their position and pay up if you were to put it plainly to them in an LBA.

 

Anyway, that is just my opinion, it's your call.

'Fortune favours the brave.'

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Any advice given is purely on the basis of my own views and opinions and offered in good faith.

Link to post
Share on other sites

 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    • No registered users viewing this page.

  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...