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Serious Help Required Dealing With Robinson Way.


pcah9
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Right i will start by saying hello to you all in here as this is my virgin post.

A brief of the problem:-In approx 1994 Western trust/Paragon obtained a county court judgement against me for approx £3000,the repayments set by the court were £5-00 per month.

I kept up repayments to them using an instalment booklet,when the book ran out of slips i wrote to them on several occassions requesting a new book but no reply.

Any way in dec 2006 i received a letter from Robinson way stating they had purchased the debt.

I received a payment slip and duly sent off the monthly fee,£5-00 as agreed in the county court.

I received two more payment slips which i filled in and sent with the due amount,£5-00 on the date due.

Then i had no more payment slips so i rang them on 3 occassions and wrote to them on 3 occassions requesting payment slips.

The call center operative said "it was in hand and i will receive them shortly as they are issued each month".

No slips arrived so i left it.

Then in april 2008 i received a phone call from robinson way asking why i had not made any payments ,so i told them why....no slips.

The obnoxious woman went on and on stating it was my perogative to pay and i had to keep on writing requesting slips,she was really obnoxious and in the end i lost my temper told her to do what she should do,send the slips and put the phone down.

Since receiving one slip per month i have paid on or before the due date,by postal order and sent it to them second class.

Today i received a letter from them stating :-

Although we have credited this payment to your account the balance above is still outstanding and requires immediate payment.

We have previously allowed you to pay by instalments but your failure to pay on time has resulted in that arrangement being withdrawn.

YOU MUST NOW EITHER

make full payment or call us to explain your circumstances,we may be able to agree a reasonable instalment plan or a favourable reduction of the amount you owe.

I called them and told them i had made payments on or before the due date , he(the call center operative) said payments were late,to which i responded that robinson way accepted postal orders ,your complaint is with royal mail not me as i have proof of posting,which i do have.

He then said i will be getting a letter from their solicitors and they will be calling on me to recover the debt.

I stated there was a county court order in respect of this debt and he said not to their knowledge,he requested proof of the court order,i said you get proof from Western Trust and or The Northampton county court.

I have sent them a letter stating that there is a court order and that as far as i am concerned the letter is harassment and if it continues i will contact the oft and the police.

My question is what do i do if i get more threatening letters from them,what do i do if i get the solicitors letter and what if the collectors turn up on my doorstep.What is the lawful way to deal with them,bearing in mind that they do not even know there was a county court order on this account.

Thank-you for any civilised replies.

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Guest forgottenone
Thank-you for any civilised replies.
Well, you will certainly get nothing but polite replies from here. More than you will, and as you have found, from the DCA you are dealing with.

 

OKay. Firstly, until someone else comes along with more advice, the most important rule is no phone contact.

 

Edited - gave wrong info.

 

As to what do next. All contact from now on in writing only. The next part others more expert than I will advise you upon. There are template letters on CAG dealing with doorstep visits.

Edited by forgottenone
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Guest forgottenone

Well, was unsure but now realize. Sorry for the misleading post. Unintentional.

 

Anyway here is the doorstep visit letter, amend to suit.

 

Dear xxxx

Account Ref xxxx

Please be advised that I will only communicate with you in writing. I have noted your repeated attempts to contact me by telephone over the past few weeks/months and these have been duly logged by time and date.

 

 

Furthermore, should it be your intention to arrange a “doorstep call”, please be advised that under OFT rules, you can only visit me at my home if you make an appointment and I have no wish to make an appointment with you.

There is only an implied license under English Common Law for people to be able to visit me on my property without express permission; the postman and people asking for directions etc (Armstrong v. Sheppard and Short Ltd [1959] 2 Q.B. per Lord Evershed M.R.).

 

 

Therefore take note that I revoke license under Common Law for you, or your representatives to visit me at my property and if you do so, then you will be liable to damages for a tort of trespass and action will be taken, including but not limited to, police attendance.

 

 

Yours faithfully,

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pcah9, just keep paying the £5 per month.

Ignore the DCA letters. Reply to any solicitor letters by politely advising that there is a CCJ and you are paying the amount specified in the court order.

It is extremely unlikely that any collector will turn up on your doorstep. If anyone does they have no rights at all so you can tell them to go away. If they don't then you can call the police. Such people can only call after making an appointment and I cannot see you agreeing to make one!

 

Should anyone start court action against you it would be for not keeping to your payment schedule. Provided you are making payments (even if by postal order) it is unlikely any court would change anything. However I'm not a legal person so if/when that happens we can address it separately.

This is why it is important to keep the regular payments up.

I really do appreciate all those 'thank you' emails - I'm glad I've been able to help. Apologies if I haven't acknowledged all of them.

You can also ding my gong if you prefer. :)

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If you've had a CCJ against you Northampton County Court will have a record of it, contact them and ask for the claim no and find out what the status is - if it is beyond six years then the CCJ would need to be re-inforced by another action if anyone wanted to claim from you. Also you need to get a full statement from Western Trust/Paragon/Robinson Way to find out what (if anything) is owed on this debt.

 

NOBODY other than the court can increase your payments. If they are asking to do that you can go back to the court and ask for a re-hearing. The case may very well be 'discontinued' due to the lack of co-operation from the creditors in enabling you to pay this debt.

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Many thanks so far for the replies,i don`t dispute that there is a debt,i don`t dispute the amount.

It is an obvious fact that RW bought this debt from WT for a minute sum but did not realise that a ccj had been taken out by WS.

Although this ccj was issued in approx 1994 may have been 1992 i consider it to be still lawful as it was issued by a court and as the repayment schedule is £5-00 per month i consider that to be the lawful sum i pay to RW.

Am i correct in thinking this or because RW bought the debt which is now there`s they can go against the ccj and enforce what they like.

You must remember as far as RW are concerned they have no knowledge of a ccj ever been issued on this debt.

If i continue to get what i consider to be threatening letters from RW as i pointed out in my original post what would you do?lawfully i may add.

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You really must NOT pay them ANYTHING. If they want to enforce this judgement (which HAS now expired - even if you take into account 12 years from judgement day) they HAVE to take you back to court.

 

As I pointed out, you need to contact Northampton County Court as a priority on Monday and they will be able to help. Strictly speaking they cannot advise you but they may have a debt advisor based at the court who can.

 

DO NOT PAY ROBINSON WAY OR ANYONE ELSE ANOTHER PENNY ON THIS DEBT - IT IS NOW NOT LEGALLY ENFORCABLE UNLESS THEY RETURN TO COURT. IN THAT EVENT YOU CAN CHALLENGE IT.

 

THE DEBT WILL NOT BE ON YOUR CREDIT REFERENCE FILES AFTER ALL THIS TIME - IF IT IS REPORT THE RELEVANT PARTIES TO THE COURT.

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If they don't have a record of the CCJ, that's their problem. What was the debt originally, credit card, loan etc?

Please note: I give advice, in good faith, based on my reading and experience. Please satisfy yourself, that any advice given is accurate in content before acting upon it.

A to Z index

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/site-questions-suggestions/53182-cant-find-what-youre.html

 

...........................................................................

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Right so i ring northampton on monday and get the case number e.t.c. as iv`e obviously thrown out all the relevant documents after all this time,usually i keep hold of everything but not after all these years.

What then?

Advise RW of the ccj ?or is it there perogative to find that out that there is a ccj on this account.

In terms of the law has this ccj ANY standing whatsoever?

Lawfully should i advise RW im stopping payments and they need to reapply to a court to get their payments?

edit:-just seen your post,it was a loan like many people had in the 80`s/90`s.

One last question....i can`t find any relevant phone number for northampton county court on the web can any-one help me out?

Edited by pcah9
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Don't tell them there is a CCJ, although I believe this would be unenforceable after such a long time. (I doubt Northampton would still have a record anyway). Send them this letter. The chances that they could provide an agreement from 1994 are about the same as me holidaying on the moon next year.

 

If they can't produce an agreement, they can't enforce the debt.

Please note: I give advice, in good faith, based on my reading and experience. Please satisfy yourself, that any advice given is accurate in content before acting upon it.

A to Z index

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/site-questions-suggestions/53182-cant-find-what-youre.html

 

...........................................................................

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You also have to remember that RW will have bought this account for absolute peanuts anyway.... so although you say you don't dispute the debt or the amount in your above posts, your original creditor probably added a whack of unlawful charges before deciding to flog it anyway, rather than collect your £5 for years to come...

 

Enough to make you angry yet ? ;)

 

Ring the court.... then CCA the b*ggers. RW will have to prove the existence of a CCJ if they say there is one, but as they don't seem to know there is one, don't do their job for them....

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I am stating there is a ccj not RW.

RW didn`t even know one existed.

Are you in agreement with this course of action:-

Send a CCA to them on monday and in the letter request ALL details of the ccj on this account aswell.

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Guest forgottenone
I am stating there is a ccj not RW.

RW didn`t even know one existed.

 

That's their problem not yours. But demonstrates how slipshod these people are in keeping up to date records. Ergo, it is now not your responsibility to point this out. They have obviously failed to keep even the most basic level of records. Fundamentally, you will learn through CAG in time that DCA's do not follow any kind of sequential, not even basic logic. Follow the advice here from others.

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The CCA is typed and it is being sent on monday,just to put my mind at ease a couple of quick questions:-

1.How long should i expect to wait for a reply to my request?

2.What if they can`t supply the information?

3.Should i make any payments to them whilst i await a reply to my request?

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The CCA is typed and it is being sent on monday,just to put my mind at ease a couple of quick questions:-

1.How long should i expect to wait for a reply to my request? Until the day you die!

2.What if they can`t supply the information? Do nothing at all!

3.Should i make any payments to them whilst i await a reply to my request?Absolutely not!

 

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Please note: I give advice, in good faith, based on my reading and experience. Please satisfy yourself, that any advice given is accurate in content before acting upon it.

A to Z index

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/site-questions-suggestions/53182-cant-find-what-youre.html

 

...........................................................................

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The guidelines are :

 

1. They have 12 working days from receipt of your request to comply with it, after which time you can legally withhold all further payments on the account until they do.

 

2. If they can't supply the information, then crack open the bubbly. :D

3. In theory, you should maintain payments until the 12 days are up... but I'll leave this up to you.

 

:)

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Right MANY thanks to you all so far,the next payment is not due until 16 august and im sending the CCA on mon 28 july, so they get it on 29 july plus 12 working days equals the 13 august,if i have not had any response by then no payment.

Are you sure i can legally withhold payments if they do not reply?

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So how does it work with an old ccj still in existance , does that mean they cannot take you to court over the same debt again ? What if they lost the paperwork, like RW have here , does that mean that not only can they not take you to court again with a new claim, but can't even reinstate the old one ( lost details). Are you in a position of invulnerabilty when a situation like this occurs ?

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Hi

 

I have personal dealings with RW and not good one either! Now RW has access to see if you have a CCJ against you and to be honest should be the first thing the look at before they contact you, so I dont believe for one second that they dont know.

In regards to payment slips for some reason it takes a while to hit the system so it is always best to make payment a week before due date. If RW had any thought they would rearrange the due day to a week later then you said to allow for this (it is what I do to make sure people do not unitentially do into arrears). Postal orders may also take a little bit of time.

 

None the less you have paid the agreed amount and on time, so I would just write a letter stating that you are unable to pay the full balance and will continue making £5 payments as court agreed. If they do not respond to your requests for more slips after you had made such a request then they are at fault not you.

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RW don't seem to have a clue about a CCJ... so let's see what happens Notsoevil....

 

If there's no record of the CCJ with the court... and RW don't have any details themselves (which appears to be the case), then they're pretty much stuffed....

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  • 2 weeks later...

I received this today from robinson way in response to a complaint i made to them concerning threatening letters to me ,no reply as yet about the cca though.

Dear sir,

We refer to the above account and the recent issues you raised.

Our working practices are monitored regularly for quality purposes and we can only apologise if,on this occasion, the high standards we set were not met.

We have re-set your payments to £5-00 per month due by 22 of each month.

Thank you for bringing this matter to our attention;your comments will be invaluable in helping us to improve the service we provide.In the meantime if you require any further assistance,please do not hesitate to contact us.

yours sincerely

Chris Bates

Correspondence Manager

Then i open a another letter from mr robinson way and it states"we may increase your payment amount so that your account is paid as quickly as possible"

They obviously do not know there is a ccj on this account do they?

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