My debt... more from the dreaded HFO Services *** Discontinued ***

[leedsangel]

Re: CCA request from HFO - I sent a letter requesting a true copy of the Barclaycard CCA in March 2007 and guess what? They still haven't bothered to send me a copy.

I changed my phone number, which means that the numpties at HFO can't harass me all hours of the day.

[vjohn82]

have a read through this....

 

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/245294-vjohn82-hfo-services-limited-5.html

 

 

Now there's an idea ;-)

[Innsmouth]

It's been over a month since my last post. I last replied to HFO stating "as stated in my previous letter dated October 23rd 2008 (please find copy attached), that this account is in default and the matter is still in dispute." and basically reiterating the points made in my previous letter.

 

Last week I received 2 new letters, both from Turnbull Rutherford Solicitors. The first letter contained the same bad scan of my pre-approved application form as sent to me back in Oct 2008 (and seen in this post here).

 

The second letter reads as follows:

 

"We act for HFO Capital Limited ("HFO") who has been assigned your debt by Barclaycard ("the Original Lender"). For the avoidance of doubt, this letter consitutes further notice of assignment.

 

This letter is sent in an attempt to avoid the need to issue legal proceedings against you. It requires your immediate attention. If you do not respond within 14 days of the date of this letter, legal action will be taken against you without further warning. Your liability for costs may increase.

 

Our Client's Claim

 

The debt which HFO is claiming from you in payable as evidenced by the attached notice of assignment and default notice.

 

This letter constitutes formal demand for payment of HFO's claim and is made in accordance with Annex A Practice Direction - Protocols PRO 1.10 of the Civil Procedural Rules. Your attention is drawn to paragraph 4 of the Practice Direction concerning the Court's powers to impose sanctions for failure to comply with the Practice Direction.

 

Failure to respond

 

If we do not receive a satisfactory response to this letter within 14 days of the date of this letter, we may issue proceedings against you without further warning. Such proceedings will include additional claims for legal costs and interest. If it transpires that due to your failure to respond to this letter, HFO lost the opportunity to secure a settlement of their claim without recourse to Court action, HFO may ask the Court to order you to pay additional costs (on an indemnity basis) and interest (at a rate of up to 8% above Bank of England Base Rate). HFO reserves the right to continue to charge the contractual rate of interest after judement."

It then asks me to reply in writing and make payment for the amount due.

 

Also enclosed is a letter on HFO headed paper saying DEFAULT NOTICE SERVED UNDER s.87(1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 in big red text on the top and basically saying that HFO Capital is the legal owner of the debt, and outlining the various ways in which I can pay.

 

In addition, there is a copy of a Notice of Assignment letter supposedly from Barclaycard.

 

This has clearly been faked -- it is not dated, has no reference number, and has no name or signature attached to it. It says "This letter is to inform you that, with effect from 6 Nov 2007, we have assigned your account to HFO Capital Limited", which would suggest that the letter had been sent before Nov 2007 HOWEVER the address at the top of my letter is my CURRENT address, and not where I lived in 2007. As well as this the Barclaycard logo at the top of the letter is the one which they changed to in 2008, and it's also pixelated as if it's simply been taken from a Google Image Search and dropped into the letter in MS Word or something... Basically, it's a laughably obvious fake.

 

Strangely, also enclosed with the above 3 items is a poorly copied OFT information sheet suggesting I can get free help and advice from and giving the details of CAB, Financail Ombudsman Service, as well as National Debtline and other services.

 

(OK, if you've stuck with my post this far: Thank You! I'm aware it's getting long...)

 

Basically, are they legally in a position to issue a Default Notice "while the matter is still in dispute" (as stated in my previous letters to them)? How should I respond to this? I am slightly concerned that they may be gearing up to take court action against me and, though I am sure they do not have a legal leg to stand on, this would simply be a huge inconvenience for me.

 

I read vjohn82's thread and while it's wonderful to see a WIN result, it actually looked like an unbelievable amount of time and effort and I wouldn't really wish that ordeal on anyone!

 

I have already reported HFO's behaviour to Trading Standards but in previous posts I have also been advised to contact the police -- I would like to ask which police force should I direct my issue to, and also what exactly do I say?

 

Thanks as always for your help and guidance CAG!

[broken arrow]

I read vjohn82's thread and while it's wonderful to see a WIN result, it actually looked like an unbelievable amount of time and effort and I wouldn't really wish that ordeal on anyone!

 

You reap what you sow.

[broken arrow]

WTF is further assignment, more bull**** from a very poor company, stand up to these people, do some research, find the truth and they give in and discontinue....

 

You reap what you sow.

[coledog]

Hi Innsmouth

 

Did you send a SAR to Barclaycard yet? May be a good idea particularly if the NOA they have is different. Broken Arrow put a good letter on another thread which I can find for you.

 

I am not legal but the letters just look like another 'threat' to get some money and should be reported to the appropriate authorities. If they have legally binding docs why not put them in front of a judge?

 

Have you sent a complaint to Google? There is another thread asking people to do this.

[coledog]

Does anyone know what 'Annex A Practice Direction - Protocols PRO 1.10 of the Civil Procedural Rules' is - maybe you could start another thread asking this question, perhaps on 'Legal Issues'?

[Innsmouth]

Thanks for the responses.

 

I have not sent a SAR to Barclaycard -- if someone could direct me to a template letter, that would be much appreciated. (I did a search for one but the templates I found seemed to be taylored to claiming back charges - not sure if it needs to be a different template?).

 

I will send Turnbull's the usual reply in the meantime, and continue to go through the process of complaining to the relevant people.

 

If anyone else has any further advice, please fire away!

[coledog]

SAR, send with Postal Order for £10, you don't need to fill out but write on back that it is for a SAR request. Registered Post, it is worth signing but putting crosses through signature. They have 40 (working) days to reply,

[your address]

 

 

BARCLAYCARD

Data Protection Team

Dept LRC

Northampton

NN4 7SG

 

 

[DATE]

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

 

ACCOUNT NUMBER: xxxxxxxxx (or multiple numbers if more than one account)

 

 

Please supply me with copies of all the data which you hold on me in relation to any matter and in any form and for any period of time.

Please note that I require disclosure of any personal data which you hold on me for the entire period of my dealings with you.

The Subject Access is not limited to my transaction history and it is not limited merely to 6 years of historical information.

Additionally, where there has been any event in my account history over this period which has required manual intervention by any member of your staff, or any other person, I require disclosure of any indication or notes which have either caused or resulted in that manual intervention, or other evidence of that manual intervention in relation to my banking business with you.

 

If you are unable to supply this data because there has been no such manual intervention, then please be so kind as to confirm this in your response.

 

I enclose the statutory maximum fee of £10. You have 40 days in which to comply.

 

If there is specific information which you require in order to satisfy yourself as to my identity, please let me know by return. However, please note that the above address is the one which you normally use to communicate my private business to me and which you have hitherto found to be acceptable.

 

 

 

Yours faithfully,

 

 

[signature ]

 

 

[name]

[broken arrow]

Does anyone know what 'Annex A Practice Direction - Protocols PRO 1.10 of the Civil Procedural Rules' is - maybe you could start another thread asking this question, perhaps on 'Legal Issues'?

 

4. Defendant’s full response

 

4.1

 

The defendant’s full written response should –

(1) accept the claim in whole or in part; or

 

(2) state that the claim is not accepted.

 

 

4.2

 

Unless the defendant accepts the whole of the claim, the response should –

(1) give reasons why the claim is not accepted, identifying which facts and which parts of the claim (if any) are accepted and which are disputed, and the basis of that dispute;

 

(2) state whether the defendant intends to make a counterclaim against the claimant (and, if so, provide information equivalent to a claimant’s letter before claim);

 

(3) state whether the defendant alleges that the claimant was wholly or partly to blame for the problem that led to the dispute and, if so, summarise the facts relied on;

 

(4) state whether the defendant agrees to the claimant’s proposals for ADR and if not, state why not and suggest an alternative form of ADR (or state why none is considered appropriate);

 

(5) list the essential documents on which the defendant intends to rely;

 

(6) enclose copies of documents requested by the claimant, or explain why they will not be provided; and

 

(7) identify and ask for copies of any further relevant documents, not in the defendant's possession and which the defendant wishes to see.

 

 

4.3

 

If the defendant (or insurer) does not provide a full response within the period stated in the claimant’s letter before claim (or any longer period stated in the defendant’s letter of acknowledgment), and a claim is subsequently started, then the court is likely to consider that the claimant has complied.

 

4.4

 

If the claimant starts proceedings before any longer period stated in the defendant’s letter of acknowledgment, the court will consider whether or not the longer period requested by the defendant was reasonable.

 

[Innsmouth]

Thanks both, very helpful.

[vjohn82]

I read vjohn82's thread and while it's wonderful to see a WIN result, it actually looked like an unbelievable amount of time and effort and I wouldn't really wish that ordeal on anyone!

 

It was worth it ;-)

[Innsmouth]

OK, thought I'd post a quick update.

 

I received another letter from jolly old Turnbulls containing another copy of my signed application form (as has been posted previously) along with an accusation that I am deliberately prolonging the matter.

 

I have responded pointing out (again) that what they have provided does not conform to sections 60(1) and 61(1) of the Consumer Credit Act and is therefore unenforceable under section 127(3) of the same act.

 

I also added:

 

Further, I dispute the allegation that I am deliberately trying to prolong this matter as I believe I have the right to request that you provide the required legal evidence to substantiate your claims, and the claims of your client.

 

It is clear that in continuing to make unlawful demands for payment your actions are an attempt to circumvent the legal requirements.

 

Note: They have still not provided me with an explanation as to why they are continuing to process my data after having previously issued them with a statutory notice under Section 10 of the Data Protection Act to cease processing any data in relation to the account, nor have they provided me with their officuial complaints proceedure.

 

I appear to be stuck in a loop of them trying to convince me that the copy of the agreement confirms to the appropriate sections of the CCA, and then me replying to politely point out that it doesn't.

 

Is there anything I can do to end this loop? Ideally, I would like to tell them that I will not respond to further correspondance as it is clear they are unable to provide the required document(s), as they have been given literally 2 years to do so!

 

Also, still on my to do list is to report them to all the relevant bodies -- I've been wanting to make sure I do this but I've been out of the country and have a lot of work on!

[coledog]

Did you send the SAR to Barclaycard? It is worth trying to find out who this was actually sold to and when.

[DonkeyB]

Bet it was sold to Roxburghe...

[broken arrow]

Interesting the NoA in post 7 states sold to HFO does not mention which one, but looking at the letter I presume they mean HFO Services as that is the only company mentioned, I have never seen an assignment between Barclaycard and HFO Services. Phonecall or SAR to Barclaycard might be the option.

[Innsmouth]

Yep, I meant to add that SAR to Barclaycard is also on my to do list.

[Innsmouth]

History:

 

HFO started bothering me by telephone in 2008 concerning a supposed Barclaycard debt.

I Issued CCA request but did not receive anything within 14 days (cheque returned by HFO).

3 months later I received a fuzzy, unreadable copy of a pre-approved application form from Turnbull Ruth. I respond to confirm this is NOT a true copy of my agreement and has no prescribed terms, and also issue them with a Section 10 DPA notice to cease processing my data. I receive no reply...

 

2 years later, 2010, I receive a threatening letter from HFO Services containing a colour Google Street View image of my street as well as a print of my credit information from Experian. I respond to make clear I do not acknowledge any debt and that they are making unlawful demands for payment.

 

A month or so later I receive a letter from Turnbull containing another unreadable copy of a pre-approved application form, and a faked Notice of Assignment Card from "Barclaycard" (wrong BC logo for date of letter; addressed to my current home, yet dated years before I actually lived there, etc.)

I respond with a letter reiterating my previous points, i.e. they have been unable to provide a copy of the agreement. I request an explanation as to why they continue to process my data, and also for their official complaints procedure. I received no reply...

 

(Edit: at some point during the above, I also reported HFO/Turnbull to TS, and also received one of the 'Silverpoint' cards through the door...)

 

Current:

 

30th Sept 2011 I receive Northampton CCBC Claim Form from HFO Capital. Sum is less than £5k.

On 6th October I receive a letter from Turnbull R. enclosing their Particulars of Claim and asking for me to acknowledge receipt.

 

I submit my Acknowledgement of Service on Oct 10th. Defence is due by November 2nd.

 

---

 

Firstly, I'm aware I have only a few days until my defence date and feel rather foolish for leaving this to the last minute... (unfortunately I've had a lot on my plate, not really an excuse I know).

 

I had initially planned to defend simply saying that they had been unable to provide legal evidence to substanciate their claims, but after reading: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?159445 I realise it is not as simple as that and I have to be very cautious as to what claims I make.

 

Should I respond with a CPR 31.14 Request? They have already provided me what *they* suggest are the correct documents, though I dispute that they are (as per history above) and the 'agreement' is unreadable. OR, is this precisely the reason why I should ask them again for these documents?

 

I have also not yet acknowledged receipt of their Particulars of Claims, how should I best do this?

 

I was previously encouraged to issue Barclaycard with a SAR, which I did not get around to doing (*sheepish*) - is it too late for me to do this now??

 

Any advice would be gratefully received and I'm aware I haven't left myself a lot of time. Please help!

 

 

[Innsmouth]

Just an update for those that subscribed to this - this has now gone to the Court stage, so I have started a new thread in the Legal Forums here: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?324673-HFO-Turnbull-Court-Action

 

If you are able to offer any advice on this new turn of events, it would be sincerely appreciated.

[broken arrow]

Its still worth doing the SAR as your hearing will be in more than 40 days, can you post up their POC on this thread, who is the claimant exactly and what address have they given.

[broken arrow]

Did you contact Barclaycard and find out to who and when the account was sold.

[sillygirl1]

You should stick to the original thread, just because it has 'gone legal' doesn't mean it is in the right place.

 

Acknowledge the particulars of claim online and that will give us time to organise a defence for you. They are in deep doodo so you also need to contact the following

 

Office of Fair Trading and ask to speak to Polly who is dealing with HFO

 

I will alert the others of the HFO fan club to your thread here.

[coledog]

Bl**dy hell where have you been!

[coledog]

Need to see the POC and anything they have sent. YES you need to send a CPR31 but what documents have they mentioned in the POC? Need to see that first as this determines the request.

 

Also get a complaint in to http://www.oft.gov.uk/contactus for the attention of Polly Ashford

 

Send SAR to Barclaycard but also ring them - due to lack of time and as this is now legal go to the Directors Office TEL: 0844 0903111. Tell them you need to know date of last payment and exactly which company this was sold to and when and you want this confirmed in writing.

 

We can certainly help you with a defence

[dadofholly]

When contacting the OFT make a play on the alleged notice of assignment - if they sent it dated to a time and address before you was even resident then this is Fraud - and a criminal offence.

 

Did HFO recentley send you a Default Notice prior to the court proceedings? if so can you scan it - If it is like others i have seen it will not be compliant - and after the Brandon appeal today the Court cannot enforce the debt on the back of a faulty DN.