1st Credit (finance) limited - RBOS CreditCard/Style Store Card

[Youngandsilly]

Hello all, first time post, but need some urgent help.

 

When I was younger I signed up for an HMV Style card, which was a store card. I eventually ran up a balance on it, and with my student life, juggling going out and studying, I forgot about the debt - this was 3 years ago.

 

I've not heard anything from Style about it, until I got a letter through the post from RBOS stating that my debt for my RBOS Credit Card has been assigned to 1st Credit Finance limited since the 2nd of august 2006 - As I say this is the first thing I've heard of them for about 3 years.

 

So I rang 1st Credit up and was told by a lady (Karen) that this was my Style Card account and that the balance was £646 and that because the account was being transferred to "Legal" then the only way I could pay it was by paying off the full amount - at this point I was rather confused, as I've not had any correspondance with anyone about this for 3 years, so I told her that, at which point she explained that 1st Credit has sent me 3 letters. again I told her I hadn't received any correspondance from 1st Credit at all (infact the original letter was from RBOS!)- Now I can't afford that at the moment, as I have a child on the way, which I explained to Karen, but told her I could pay £50 a month to clear the debt.

 

Karen explained to me that because it was going to Legal, that installments are impossible but if I can't pay the full amount they'll accept £500 to clear it.

 

Again I told her I couldn't afford to pay this - She asked me if anyone else had a credit card/debt card that would be able to pay it for me - I said no - She said that unless the account was paid off within 48 hour then Legal would start court proceddings - I explained that there was no way I could pay within 48 hours - She stated that she could hold the account for me for 7 days to see if I could, and I quote "come up with the money".

 

So it's been left at that so far -

 

My question is, can 1st Credit refuse to accept a payment plan, when I have quite clearly told them that I can't afford a lump payment. Or is there anything else that I can do that will hold them off a little longer so I can find £500??

 

Really hope you can help

[Writerchris]

Hi and welcome to the forum

 

First thing is don't worry!! The people who post here have plenty of excellent advice and experience when it comes to dealing with DCA's (Debt Collection Agencies).

 

I mysefl have done battle with the evil 1st credit so know them well. They are bullys who use scare tactics.... The first thing to do is NEVER talk to them on the phone - it's pointless, they lie and scheme and harrass. don't phone them and instruct them not to phone you. for the sake of your records, everything must be put in writing.

They will try and make you pay up in full, ignore them. They will eventually accept a payment plan that you can afford, as they have no choice as long as you do things properly.

 

The best thing to do is send them a letter (registered mail) requesting the relevant CCA (consumer credit agreement) as without this, they can't legally persue you for the debt. There is a template letter on this site which you can print off and send to them. This stops them in their tracks with their demands and lets them know that you won't be pushed around.

 

If they do produce a CCA (and make sure it's the real deal) then you can pay them off in installments that suit your finances, if they don't they can go take a long running jump off the proverbial short pier!

 

Also never sign any letter you send to them, as the tinkers aren't beyond lifting sigs from documents and concocting "Agreements" with your signature copied onto them.

 

Again, don't worry and remember that you have a lot of legal protection from these muppets and that you can take control of the situation

[Youngandsilly]

Wow - thanks for the fast response -

 

Okay - I have found the CCA request template, however on the letter I have for 1st Credit they list a PO Box address

 

PO Box 278

Reigate

RH2 7WB

 

Can I still send a recorded delivery letter to this address, or is there another one for 1st Credit?

[Dipply75]

Hi Youngandsilly

 

Please don't worry and do not listen to any of the GUMF that Karen woman told you - as it is gumf!

 

Have a read around some of the other threads and you will see what I mean. There are template letters to deal with this, the first being the letter stating you do not acknowledge the debt and you want proof of it.

 

Will put one on for you in a mo - also do not speak to them on the phone again - in writing only - then you can prove what they are doing.

 

Please do not worry about her silly threat of instant legal action - they cannot do this.

 

Send the letter below, recorded delivery and do not sign it - even just print your name. include a postal order for £1 to cover the request for a copy of the agreement.

 

You want to make sure they have the agreement, can prove the debt and are allowed to collect on it before you pay a penny, especially with a baby on the way (awww )

 

Welcome to CAG, you'll get plenty of help here, we've all been there

[Dipply75]

Oops sorry, you were quicker than me Writerchris

 

If they have a PO address I send the recorded delivery to their registered or head office address. Send the harrassment letter also - makes it clear you will only communicate in writing. Try this one:

 

I DO NOT ACKNOWLEDGE ANY DEBT TO YOUR COMPANY

 

With reference to the above account, I request that you send me a true copy of this credit agreement before I will correspond further on this matter.

 

This is my right under the legislation contained within section 77 (1) and section 78 (1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974, and I am entitled to receive a copy of my credit agreement on request.

 

Your obligation also extends to providing me with a statement of account. I enclose a £1 postal order, which represents payment of the statutory fee payable under the Consumer Credit Act. I understand that a copy of my credit agreement should be supplied within 12 working days from the date of this letter.

 

I understand that under the Consumer Credit Act, creditors are unable to enforce an agreement if they fail to comply with a request for a copy of the agreement under these sections of the Act.

 

Also, since you are a Debt Collection Agency, I would also ask that you supply a signed true copy of the executed deed of assignment for the above referenced agreement. This is an obligation, whether you are the original creditor or not, under section 189 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

 

Non-compliance with my request is a criminal offence under the above Act and will result in a report being submitted to the relevant statutory authorities.

 

In summary, I DO NOT ACKNOWLEDGE THIS DEBT AND THEREFORE REQUIRE YOU TO SUBSTANTIATE THIS BY PROVIDING THE FOLLOWING DOCUMENTATION BEFORE I CORRESPOND FURTHER :

 

1. True copy of original credit agreement

2. Statement of account

3. Copy of the executed deed of assignment from (Original Creditor) and (DCA)

4. A Fair Processing Notice.

 

As you are aware, a credit agreement that is not properly documented and signed by the customer is totally unenforceable under the CCA and therefore is a complete defence to any court claim that is issued.

 

Take note at this stage, that any legal action you may contemplate will be both vigorously defended and contested.

 

Further to the above, please ensure that any contact by yourselves is made in writing only to the above address. Telephone calls and personal visits will not be accepted and viewed as harassment.

I look forward to hearing from you within the statutory time limit.

Edited June 30, 2008 by Dipply75
am dumb

[ODC]

This is their address for the CCA request

 

The Omnibus Building

Lesbourne Road

Reigate

Surrey

RH2 7JP

 

 

I would also ask for their complaints procedure as they have committed a clear breach of OFT guidelines by even suggesting you borrow the money to pay them. You should also consider reporting them to the OFT and TS.

[Youngandsilly]

Sorry to be a pain - But I can't find the registered address or HQ address for them on Google, as on the letter from HBOS, it only contains the PO box address -

 

Can anyone provide with it please?

 

EDIT - sorry, quicker than me =p - thank you!

[Captain Spaulding]

I sent a letter to their PO BOX and 15days later, has not been delivered!

 

Whats the deal wit the PO BOX?

[Writerchris]

Lucky timing Dipply

 

I've always sent registered stuff to them at their PO box addy and they've always collected it and signed for it with the usual illegible squiggle, so it works, but I'd follow ODC's advise and send it to the address he provided ie

 

The Omnibus Building

Lesbourne Road

Reigate

Surrey

RH2 7JP

 

that'll shut 'em up for a good few weeks at least:cool:

[Youngandsilly]

Thanks for that - will update with further info as it comes =) Your help is most appreciated

[Youngandsilly]

Update -

 

Well I sent off the letter that Dipply advised today by registered mail, and have the reciept for the postal order and the mail.

 

However something interesting of note, that may come in handy later on in the process perhaps?

 

I was reading through some of the other threads about DCAs and people advising folk to keep the envelopes they send stuff in, so that got me thinking -

 

I went back to the original letter from RBOS, which has official RBOS letter head, black and white images, and signed by the RBOS collections manager, however when I looked at the envelope, the return address was... You've guessed it, 1st Credits PO box address in Reigate

 

Does this have any influence?

[babybear39]

Hi and welcome to CAG...

 

The ***** use the letterheads of their clients to scare you more

 

You're on the right course and in the right place for help with these numpties

[Dipply75]

haha, they are numpties indeed. Keep a hold of that letter. I have always wondered about that, when the DCA's send a letter with a bank's letterhead that they have obviously concocted themselves.

 

To me this is attempting to gain money by deceit - or are they allowed to create letters on the banks etc behalf's?

[Youngandsilly]

Righty - I've started filing everything today, and luckly, as I work for the Local Authority, and rang them on my work phone, all calls are automatically recorded! Joy.

 

I've also started a chronology of events as well, details everything i've done, and what they've said to me, just to keep me right with dates etc.

 

Once again, thanks for the advice, it's most appreciated.

[babybear39]

To me this is attempting to gain money by deceit - or are they allowed to create letters on the banks etc behalf's?

 

I've been wondering that for a while

 

Maybe someone should start a thread on it...

[ODC]

Update -

 

Well I sent off the letter that Dipply advised today by registered mail, and have the reciept for the postal order and the mail.

 

However something interesting of note, that may come in handy later on in the process perhaps?

 

I was reading through some of the other threads about DCAs and people advising folk to keep the envelopes they send stuff in, so that got me thinking -

 

I went back to the original letter from RBOS, which has official RBOS letter head, black and white images, and signed by the RBOS collections manager, however when I looked at the envelope, the return address was... You've guessed it, 1st Credits PO box address in Reigate

 

Does this have any influence?

I always keep the envelopes the DCAs send because they cannot forge or backdate a Post Office sorting office imprint. They can adjust the date on a franking machine or a letter though.

 

As for First Credit.

 

One of four things could have happened. The nice people in Reigate could have been creative with photoshop (allegedly) and made up their own version of the RBOS logo and assignment letter OR

 

RBOS sent the letter to First Credit and they being the gererous souls that they are used one of their envelopes and paid for the postage to save RBOS some money OR

 

1st Credit actually own RBOS and they use the same envelopes OR

 

RBOS are actually based at the Omnibus Building in Reigate.

 

 

CLUE : Three of these options are highly unlikely:lol:

[babybear39]

I always keep the envelopes the DCAs send because they cannot forge or backdate a Post Office sorting office imprint. They can adjust the date on a franking machine or a letter though.

 

As for First Credit.

 

One of four things could have happened. The nice people in Reigate could have been creative with photoshop (allegedly) and made up their own version of the RBOS logo and assignment letter OR

 

RBOS sent the letter to First Credit and they being the gererous souls that they are used one of their envelopes and paid for the postage to save RBOS some money OR

 

1st Credit actually own RBOS and they use the same envelopes OR

 

RBOS are actually based at the Omnibus Building in Reigate.

 

 

CLUE : Three of these options are highly unlikely:lol:

 

And it doesn't take a genius to work out which one

[Youngandsilly]

I''ve just had a further thought -

 

On the letter from "RBOS" it tells me that the debt has been assigned to 1st Credit Finance and gives a date etc (no amounts though)

 

Could this be conveyed as a notice of assignment, and as such, due to it's dubious origins, is there any way I can confirm this came from RBOS or not? (as AFAIK the notice of assignment has to come from RBOS?)

[Captain Spaulding]

I had exactly the same, the letters from 1st Credit and RBOS were exactly the same EVERYTHING apart from the company name/logo

 

Is this legal or a form of entrapment?

[babybear39]

Time for a thread on this I think...

[Dipply75]

I seem to have become very cynical, just assuming they are up to no good lol, but i think you are righ babybear, what have those naughty dcas been up to?

 

Hey Youngandsilly, now you have found CAG you will be able to deal with 1st credit no bother, and this site keeps you so entertained during those sleepless nights....trust me on that!

[Youngandsilly]

Righty Oh -

 

Came home and found the following letter on my doorstep -

 

Dear Sir/Madam

Client Natwest (Stylecard)

Relating to Account Number xxxxxxxxxx

Balance Outstanding £661.42

Our Ref xxxxxxxxxxxxx

 

Request For Copy Agreement

 

We refer to your recent communication requesting a copy of the relevant agreement

 

The document you have requested is retained by our client. We will therefore advise them of your request and arrange for the document to be sent to you as soon as possible.

 

Should your request also inclue the below documents, please be advised of the following

 

Dead of Assignment - We would refer you to blah blah blah

 

Copy statements - there is a charge of £10.00 for this information

On receipt blah blah blah

 

Admin Department

 

Looks like a standard response - do I need to reply to anything?

 

One further point of note - I noticed that the Client is Natwest, however on my original letter, it apparently came from Royal Bank of Scotland - Have they buggered up in someway??

[ODC]

As you have said this is standard BS from Worst Credit. Wait and see what if anything they come up with.

[babybear39]

Under your CCA request they HAVE to provide a statement of account FOC. The numpties seem to be getting confused with SAR

[babybear39]

...And who knows what their admin. and other departments get upto, they certainly don't