Dhopki25 VS Barclays

[dhopki25]

Hi all,

Have been a customer of barclays since I started uni back in september 2001 and have a graduate additions current account.

I have just begun action against Barclays bank for charges against my current account over the past 3 years.

Sent the initial letter on the 3rd of July and received a rather standard latter back off a guy in customer relations saying they would get back to me no later than the 31st of July and enclosed their complaints guidelines leaflet too.

I am still only going to give them the 14 days stipulated in my letter and then proceed to the next stage - send a letter before action. The other people who have been successful in this forum have given me real inspiration to take action against Barclays. Will keep everyone posted with my claim and any advice would be very handy.

 

Kind Regards

Dan

[callumsgran]

Hi Dan and welcome, good luck to you!!!

[blueskies]

Did you send a Data Protection Act Subject Access Request? If you didn't it would be wise to do so, this will give you details of manual interventions. If the don't send them they would be foolish to use them in court (if it ever gets there).

 

 

How much are you claiming?

 

Good luck

 

Steve

[dhopki25]

Forgive my ignorance but what is a Data Protection Act Subject Access Request? As you may have gathered, no I didn't send one. I am attempting to claim £910 plus interest.

Dan

[Rooster-UK]

Hi Dan, welcome to the forums.

 

All the letters you need, including the Data Protection Act SARS letter can be found in the Bank Templates library.

Click on the link.....

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/

 

These letters are well tried and tested.

Also, have a good read of the FAQs.

 

Good luck.

[MARTIN3030]

Dan you must make sure you keep to tried tested procedures.

Although they have not been known to defend manual intervention you presumably have not asked them about it ?

Also did you send a charges schedule (a list of what you are claiming ) with your preliminary letter ?

 

Following the correct procedure/steps is not just about you understanding the whole process its also to prevent the banks from thinking they are dealing with someone who is sidetracking and therefore unsure of the process.

 

Its also a question of allowing for reasonable time for dialogue.

The dpa request letter makes clear that unlawful penalty charges if found will be pursued so the bank is aware of this from the outset.

 

There is no scope for mistakes as far as the banks are concerned they will welcome any as it helps them !!

 

Just a few words..but I think words that cnnot be highlighted enough.

 

[dhopki25]

I didn't need to submit a Data Protection Subject Access Request as I have all my original bank statements over the past 3 years.

Also, why would I need to use the 'Notice pursuant to s.10 of the Data Protection Act 1998'? I have never been served with a default notice because of debt consisting of penalty charges. Well not to my knowledge anyway!

Dan.

[dhopki25]

Oh, also, yes I sent a complete schedule of the charges incurred on my account over the past three years extracted from the spreadsheet supplied on this site. Didn't include the 8% interest figure but did include debit interest in the amount I am claiming.

Dan

[MARTIN3030]

Very good Dan all above board then.

 

 

Keep it rolling

 

 

[MARTIN3030]

I didn't need to submit a Data Protection Subject Access Request as I have all my original bank statements over the past 3 years.

Also, why would I need to use the 'Notice pursuant to s.10 of the Data Protection Act 1998'? I have never been served with a default notice because of debt consisting of penalty charges. Well not to my knowledge anyway!

Dan.

 

Who mentioned a S10 notice ?

 

 

[blueskies]

I think you looked at the wrong letter in the library. This is the one to request all statements and details of manual interventions.

 

DPA SAR

[dhopki25]

Guys,

I have a question regarding the optional information that can be included in the letter before action. Barclays 14 days are now up to respond to my initial letter. I am interested in submitting and I quote:

 

"a Consumer Credit Act 1974 complaint to the OFT upon the basis that you have failed to comply with the OFT's direction of 5 April 2006 and are therefore not a 'fit and proper person' to hold a consumer credit licence under the 1974 Act"

 

How do I go about making this complaint, I understand the OFT have a website, are there forms to complete on there?

 

Any info you can provide would be of great help!

Dan.

[MARTIN3030]

Dan this is not the stage to complain to the OFT.

You should look into this AFTER the lba 14 days have expired.

 

There are quite a few stronger letters in the threads here which you could use.

 

The OFT is snowed under at the moment and your complaints would probably be dealt with a lot quicker by your local Trading standards office.

They will of course pursue any breaches in connection with the 1974 C.C.A

 

 

[dhopki25]

Good news,

I have had a response from Barclays re: my initial letter claiming all bank charges. It states:

"May I say how sorry I am to learn that you feel the bank charges you have incurred are unfair, in your correspondence you have referred to elements which you feel support your claim. Barclays is aware of the information you have drawn to our attention. I must inform you, however, that we disagree with your view."

The letter then goes on to explain the terms and conditions of having a current account with Barclays etc. Then:

"Dispite my comments above in relation to your views, on this occasion, and without any admissions as to the basis of your complaint, I am willing to offer the sum of £450 towards the total amount you are seeking."

Well, they are too late cause I sent the Letter Before Action Recorded delivery yesterday as they have already had more then the 14 days stipulated in the original letter. I'm going for the whole amount I am seeking and won't accept any less.

Advice? Should I now await a response from the second letter I sent yesterday? I have a direct number for the gentlemen (Laurence White) dealing with my complaint. Should I contact him or wait for a response?

Dan.

[MARTIN3030]

You could call them,but you would have no proof.

 

Best to get a letter out and say Thank you for your letter offering 450 you cannot accept as it is considerably short of the ///// you are claiming.

You are prepared to accept this as a part settlement but will be going on to claim the other///// as indicated in my letter before action sent on/////

However there will be no extension to the 14 day period for a response to this.

 

This will show you have entered dialogue following their letter.

 

And also makes clear that although you will consider it as part settlement its not good reason for using as a staller.

[dhopki25]

Is there a letter within the archives I can send for this or shall I just send a short one saying what you have stated in the above post, just want to be sure i'm doing things by the book.

Dan.

[dhopki25]

Also, when I send the letter to notify them of mom-acceptance of the £450, should I now address the person whos name is on the letter directly? There is a different address too:

 

Freepost RLTA-CSUE-TCHC

Head Office Customer Relations

London

E14 5HP

 

I had been using the address of their office based in Leicester, should I now send to the above? If I am accepting the £450 as part settlement should I complete the form enclosed stating "I accept the sum of £450 in full and final settlement of my complaint with Barclays"? I would guess not given that I am only accepting it as part settlement and the statement on the form is contrary to that.

Dan.

[MARTIN3030]

Also, when I send the letter to notify them of mom-acceptance of the £450, should I now address the person whos name is on the letter directly? There is a different address too:

 

Freepost RLTA-CSUE-TCHC

Head Office Customer Relations

London

E14 5HP

 

I had been using the address of their office based in Leicester, should I now send to the above? If I am accepting the £450 as part settlement should I complete the form enclosed stating "I accept the sum of £450 in full and final settlement of my complaint with Barclays"? I would guess not given that I am only accepting it as part settlement and the statement on the form is contrary to that.

Dan.

 

 

Yes I would send to the address of the offer quoting your allocated case no.

No need to sign anything.

Theres no need either for a temp letter although the choice is yours if you feel you want to send it.

As you have already sent the lba they are aware now of your intentions so a short letter of refusal will be fine.

[MARTIN3030]

Forgot to add.......The offer is almost certainly likely to be withdrawn now.

 

They may choose to offer a higher amount.

Either way they will write to you saying they are sorry you are still not happy bla bla bla but this is their final decision.

[Money4Nothing]

Hi dhopki25,

I had EXACTLY the same letter on 19th July, apart from the amount was different.

I made up a letter from some I found on here, and added some of my own bits.

I basically said that I wasn't prepared to accept their offer as a final settlement, I told them my point of view regarding their charges, and the terms and conditions. And gave them 14 days to pay up before I start legal action.

I can post it in here if you want to use it...you can change it as you see fit.

Good luck

 

M4N

[dhopki25]

Right, whats the next step? That is, what do I do next if they don't reply within 14 days of receiving yesterdays letter before action I sent?

Dan

[dhopki25]

Hi dhopki25,

I had EXACTLY the same letter on 19th July, apart from the amount was different.

I made up a letter from some I found on here, and added some of my own bits.

I basically said that I wasn't prepared to accept their offer as a final settlement, I told them my point of view regarding their charges, and the terms and conditions. And gave them 14 days to pay up before I start legal action.

I can post it in here if you want to use it...you can change it as you see fit.

Good luck

 

M4N

Yes please, if you wouldn't mind posting it on here that would be a great help.

Dan.

[Money4Nothing]

Mr Laurence White

Head Office Customer Relations

Barclays Bank PLC

1 Churchill Place

LONDON

E14 5HP

Your Reference: xxxxxxxxx

24th July 2006

 

LETTER BEFORE ACTION

 

ACCOUNT NUMBER: xxxxxxxxx

 

Dear Mr White,

 

Thank you for your letter dated 19th July 2006, in which you offered a sum of £XXX, however I am not willing to accept this amount as a final settlement.

You seem to think that because your charges are stated in your terms and conditions that they are lawful and fair. I have never thought that your charges have been fair – they punish the not so well off and the people who don’t have enough money in their account at the end of the month. The fact that banks are actually making a profit from this practice is frankly shocking.

I am of the view that your charges represent a penalty and are therefore irrecoverable at common law. In the Scottish case of Castaneda and Others v. Clydebank Engineering and Shipbuilding Co., Ltd. (1904) 12 SLT 498 the House of Lords held that a contractual party can only recover damages for actual or liquidated losses incurred from a breach of contract. This is also the position in English law: Dunlop Pneumatic Tyre Co Ltd v New Garage and Motor Co Ltd [1915] AC 79. Your charges do not reflect any actual or real loss; instead they appear to represent a lucrative profit-making scheme.

 

On a separate note, your charges appear to represent an unfair term of contract which is contrary to the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 (SI. 1999/2083). My account falls within the ambit of Regulation 5 of the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 as I am a consumer. Your charges constitute an unfair penalty under reference to paragraph 1(e) of schedule 2 of the said regulations:

Indicative and non-exhaustive list of terms which may be regarded as unfair - 1. Terms which have the object of effect of - (e) requiring any consumer who fails his obligation to pay a disproportionately high sum in compensation.

 

On 26 July 2005 the OFT stated that 'a charge is likely to be disproportionately high if it is more than a court would be likely to award if the lender sued the cardholder for breach of contract'. Because your charges include a lucrative profit margin, in addition to actual loss, they are irrecoverable as an unfair term in contract.

 

The fact that these charges were applied has meant that even after additional funds were credited to the account which would normally have been sufficient, on some occasions the balance has remained overdrawn or otherwise insufficient. As a result, additional transactions have been processed when inadequate funds were available in my account, and additional charges applied. I believe the term vicious circle applies to this situation, and as such, it could constitute a clear breach of the Banking Code.

 

Regardless of the wording of the automated letters sent to me, these charges constitute a penalty charge, as the amounts bear no relation to the actual damages incurred by you. I have been advised to remind you that such penalty charges are legally unenforceable, even if a clause exists in the Terms and Conditions that authorises such a charge.

 

The charges have also worsened my already fragile financial status. I am on a fixed and limited income, and I am struggling to pay off debts. I hope that you will take note of my situation and provide a favourable resolution.

 

I now ask for the full amount of £XXXX, to be credited to my account within the next 14 days. If this does not occur within 14 days of the date of this letter, I will be forced to start legal proceedings, which is likely to increase the costs you incur to settle this dispute. I will enclose a copy of the schedule of charges.

 

 

Yours sincerely,

 

 

 

 

 

 

[MARTIN3030]

Right, whats the next step? That is, what do I do next if they don't reply within 14 days of receiving yesterdays letter before action I sent?

Dan

 

 

You proceed to court stage.

By this time they will have had your letter had chance to reply/digest the contents.

[dhopki25]

On the moneyclaim website how should I word the particulars of the claim? Are there any examples from people who got to this stage?