Virgin Media ADSL (Non-Cable) Broadband Throttling

[bandana]

ast week, my housemates and i used 5.9G (over an entire week) on our Virgin Media ADSL (non-cable) broadband connection. All of the downloads are legal, no p2p or other naughtiness.

 

This put us in the top 5% of users last week, and now our speed is capped to 512kbit/s between 4pm and midnight for the next week. That's 64kBytes/s. PATHETIC and pretty much makes the internet unusable for our 5-person network.

 

Since when does 5.9G equal "unlimited"? It clearly doesn't. 5.9G is not even excessive, by anyone's standards and especially for a 5 person house!

 

I'm preparing for a fight about this. I'm fed up of ISPs setting the rules. They've met their match this time.

 

Virgin claims that our downloads are unlimited, as even though our speed is reduced, technically we could still download as much as we want (it would just be at snails pace). This is just semantics.

 

Yes, their cleverly worded policies mean that they are not breaking their terms and conditions. BUT saying that the top 5% of users get put on a capped list is unfair. If we were with BT (or someone else) with a greater market share, the value that puts us in the top 5% could be nearer 30G or perhaps, even 100G.

 

There MUST be a way of arguing this. I know that there are plenty of ppl out there who are fed up with ISPs ruling the nest.

 

Legally, they cover themselves cleverly. But i don't think anyone has attempted to challenge the Fair Usage Policy. And i intend to. Who's with me? If so, join this facebook group

 

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=16034524092

Edited June 4, 2008 by bandana

[theintrepidfox]

ast week, my housemates and i used 5.9G (over an entire week) on our Virgin Media ADSL (non-cable) broadband connection. All of the downloads are legal, no p2p or other naughtiness.

 

This put us in the top 5% of users last week, and now our speed is capped to 512kbit/s between 4pm and midnight for the next week. That's 64kBytes/s. PATHETIC and pretty much makes the internet unusable for our 5-person network.

 

Since when does 5.9G equal "unlimited"? It clearly doesn't. 5.9G is not even excessive, by anyone's standards and especially for a 5 person house!

 

I'm preparing for a fight about this. I'm fed up of ISPs setting the rules. They've met their match this time.

 

Virgin claims that our downloads are unlimited, as even though our speed is reduced, technically we could still download as much as we want (it would just be at snails pace). This is just semantics.

 

Yes, their cleverly worded policies mean that they are not breaking their terms and conditions. BUT saying that the top 5% of users get put on a capped list is unfair. If we were with BT (or someone else) with a greater market share, the value that puts us in the top 5% could be nearer 30G or perhaps, even 100G.

 

There MUST be a way of arguing this. I know that there are plenty of ppl out there who are fed up with ISPs ruling the nest.

 

Legally, they cover themselves cleverly. But i don't think anyone has attempted to challenge the Fair Usage Policy. And i intend to. Who's with me? If so, join this facebook group

 

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=16034524092

 

Are you SURE they don't mean 5.9 TERRABYTE???

5.9 GB a week works out at 820MB a day, laughable!!!!

If that's true what you say, I'm SHOCKED and will support you all the way long. May you post the notification VM sent you on here?

[bandana]

Are you SURE they don't mean 5.9 TERRABYTE???

5.9 GB a week works out at 820MB a day, laughable!!!!

If that's true what you say, I'm SHOCKED and will support you all the way long. May you post the notification VM sent you on here?

 

At the mo everything's been confirmed by phone. But it's definitely 5.9G not T.

 

I'm trying to get them to email me confirmation, but you can't request emails over the phone. Their customer service is another issue all together....

[theintrepidfox]

At the mo everything's been confirmed by phone. But it's definitely 5.9G not T.

 

I'm trying to get them to email me confirmation, but you can't request emails over the phone. Their customer service is another issue all together....

 

The Terrabyte was a joke. The only situation in which I'd agree they throttling you.

 

Still, if you can post written confirmation on here and on your FB group would be great.

[bandana]

The Terrabyte was a joke. The only situation in which I'd agree they throttling you.

 

Still, if you can post written confirmation on here and on your FB group would be great.

 

Ah ok, d'oh. I've sent them an email, hopefully they'll respond.

[bidstermeister]

If they secretly have a 20gb monthly barrier, then you're gonna hit that... I guess the only solution is get the other 95% using their internet more

 

Or write to them saying that you're varying the T+C's of your contract - In the event of a speed reduction, you'll be activating a price reduction on the following month's bill.

[MrShed]

Putting myself in the firing line, but never mind...

 

- If you dont like broadband throttling, dont sign up with a ISP that broadband throttles. You are aware of the terms and conditions(and if you are not, then you should), and so you know the risk of it being a "slow week" and you being in the top 5%.

- The T&Cs are not being "varied" - this is exactly as the T&Cs are.

- I would imagine, with respect, that you will be laughed out for challenging a contract you signed up for....I fail to see any possible legal challenge to the FUP

- Perhaps most importantly, why on earth did you sign up for DSL with Virgin? They have the worst reputation in the sector for customer service(and having dealt with them several times, rightly so!), and I cant imagine they offer the cheapest package....

 

This sounds unsympathetic - it isnt. But the notion of "challenging" the FUP is frankly laughable. Vote with your feet and change ISP.

[robin9342]

Mr Shed, I don't believe Virgin specify the amount of data you need to download to become one of their top 5%, so how is the OP supposed to know? Aren't they supposed to give a warning first?

 

My ISP tells me that they do restrict unlimited users, but only if their usage hits 45g per month, so 5.9g in a week seems perfectly reasonable to me!

[MrShed]

The OP is aware that the FUP is not a set size, but is the top 5%. Therefore, although they do not know explicitly, they know that there is the possibility that they will be throttled for fairly low usage. These are the terms they agreed to. IMO, you cannot agree to the terms, and then at a later date when the legitimate terms result in a situation you did not envisage, complain about the terms. They were all there in black and white.

[robin9342]

In that case, surely the terms can be considered unfair. The terms should give an indication of how much data you would have to download to become one of the top 5%. How are you supposed to keep within the terms if you don't know what the DL limit is?

 

Considering Virgin are probably losing customers hand over fist, it means that users will be allowed to download less and less before hitting that 5%

[MrShed]

Well then why sign up for it? Why willingly sign up for terms you know could cause future ambiguity?

 

I do not deny that the terms are stupid - they clearly are. But what I'm saying is that the consumer has to take at the very least an element of the blame for being so daft as to agree to them!

[theintrepidfox]

Things get lost along the long way between Virgin Media's glossy advertising and brochures and the bully that installs your line (I wouldn't be surprised if community service know includes having to contract for Virgin) and that person on the other side of the planet that can't pronounce your name when things completely cock up.

[MrShed]

I'm sorry if I'm being blonde...I fail to see your point.

 

To me this is VERY simple - if you dont like the terms, dont agree to them!!

[havinastella]

I can see the OP's point.

 

I have VM's 20MB connection, for which I pay a premium £35 a month, now given the fact I have a 20MB connection with a download of 2MB a sec and given I pay one of the highest fees in the Country for this, you'd expect my "UNLIMITED" download before I get capped to be huge!

 

Yep, its 4GB, 4 F***ing GB before I get throttled. I'm having my own battle with VM over the huge allowance for my 20MB connection.

 

I hear it's being upgraded again soon, can't wait. 20 seconds of downloads and then throttled again for the rest of the week!

[MrShed]

Again.....you knew the terms!

 

I'm sorry guys but honestly, some of the onus of this is on you to make sure you pick a package that is suitable. Also, I assume that you mean 4GB per WEEK or per DAY, not per month??

 

Be thankful - the max bband speed I can get in my area is 512kb, so your throttled speeds are still higher than my normal!!!

[robin9342]

I come back to my original point. How is one supposed to keep within an unspecified download limit? As far as I know, all ISPs have a "fair use" policy. Unfortunately, some are less generous than others.

 

I have "unlimited" broadband with BT. I have been told verbally by BT that as long as I don't exceed 45gb per month, I won't be throttled. However, this is NOT specified in the T&Cs.

 

It would appear that Virgin's "unlimited" threshold is 4gb, (20gb per month?) Again, NOT specified in their T&Cs

 

If these figures were actually published, then the OP and anyone else would be able to make a more informed choice when selecting a provider and they could monitor their usage to make sure they didn't go over the allowance.

[havinastella]

Virgin are having a laugh, it just gets worse

 

Traffic management - Help - Virgin Media

[MrShed]

I come back to my original point. How is one supposed to keep within an unspecified download limit? As far as I know, all ISPs have a "fair use" policy. Unfortunately, some are less generous than others.

 

I know, but you are missing my point. The OP KNEW when he signed up that it was an unspecified download limit(due to T&Cs), and still signed up. Then when the terms that he signed are used, he has a problem with it. To which I answer, if you are not happy with what you are signing, dont - dont cry "consumer abuse" when a term you knew was there is invoked.

[robin9342]

Yes, but the reason he has a problem with it is that the download limit is so low. To quote from Virgin's own help pages: "we sometimes moderate the speeds for the top 5% of customers who are downloading and/or uploading an unusually large amount." 5.9gb is not an unusually large amount of data.

[robin9342]

This is Virgin's throttling policy:

 

So, it appears to depend on which package the OP has (which has not been mentioned). However, according to the OP, he is being throttled for a week if he goes over the limit, but it is only supposed to be for 5 hours! Also, the OP is dropped to 512k, when it should be no lower than 1mb (depending on package)

[MrShed]

You get throttled for 5 hours PER DAY for ONE WEEK is my understanding.

 

With regards the 512kb, it is throttled to a THEORETICAL MAXIMUM of 1MB. Various other factors, outside of Virgins control, can affect the actual maximum DSL throughput.

[MrShed]

Yes, but the reason he has a problem with it is that the download limit is so low. To quote from Virgin's own help pages: "we sometimes moderate the speeds for the top 5% of customers who are downloading and/or uploading an unusually large amount." 5.9gb is not an unusually large amount of data.

 

Depends on your POV. There are many FUPs around that class in excess of 20GB per month as over the FUP. This user will be on course for around 25GB of data user for the month. Whilst I personally do not class this as excessive, it is certainly not the usage of a light user, and most importantly, all that matters is what Virgin class as excessive - which it does, as the top 5% of users!!

 

I have said it before, and am now saying it again. If you do not like it, change ISP.

[Bookworm]

I think there's some massive assumptions being made here about signing-on and choice...

 

I'm with VM, because I have been with Telewest since the day BT lost their monopoly, and I therefore have no BT line in the house. I also have the top BB package.

 

VM have NEVER told me about the throttling, have NEVER sent me new T&Cs, and it is only thanks to this forum that I found out what was happening to my speed in the evenings, and this after someone at VM had given me the -then- 09 number to call to find out about the "technical" issue, even though they must have had a fair idea as to why this was happening and I wasn't prepared to do that.

 

In fact, looking at the table given higher up, it looks as if they have changed it again and they haven't notified me of those either.

 

VM have unilaterally introduced some serious restrictions to the service and I personally believe that the way they present their unlimited service is going to land them in trouble sooner or later.

 

They may have the worst customer services, but they do (did) have one of the best packages with highest speeds and no d/l limits, although I suspect the excessive throttling may well be on its way to take away that superiority.

 

As for changing, why should we? We signed up for something and agreed to pay a certain amount for that something, we simply expect VM to stick to what they have agreed to provide and not introduce changes on the sly, I don't think that it is that unreasonable.

[MrShed]

I agree with everything you have said Bookworm - I was not aware of Virgins lack of communication/T&Cs, and so a lot of my points fall down, I agree.

 

With regards saying why would you sign up to Virgin, my point was purely about the DSL service, NOT the cable - I agree that Virgin is quite clearly the best internet service overall if you can get cable, despite the poor CS.

 

The only thing I would say is that do you expect VM to stand still? They are entitled to change their terms over time(albeit with notice of said changes, which they apparently are not doing), especially in something as rapidly changing as the broadband market.

[Bookworm]

I don't know about "standing still" as such, but having said, I'd expect movement to be forward, not backwards. VM are advertising themselves as the fastest and unlimited, and used to be the fastest and unlimited, but now, they are neither, and with the advance of technology, it seems anything but right.