Can I be held responsible...?

[adam1]

Can I be held responsible for an illegally downloaded computer game that occurred four weeks after I left my old address (abusive marriage) and moved half way across the country to live with friends? To add to this, the solicitors who are chasing me for payment of £900+ have accidentally sent me a letter on the same subject addressed to a complete stranger. Is this a breach of his privacy/the Data Protection Act?

 

They are threatening to take me to court: as my sole income is incapacity benefit/income support, can I be made to pay for something that I feel I'm not responsible for?

 

I would appreciate any advice you could give me.

[Spiceskull]

can I be made to pay for something that I feel I'm not responsible for?

You don't "feel" you are responsible? If you didn't even live there, then I don't see how feelings even enter the equation...

 

However, you need to work out who is responsible for the line/connection, and therefore who is responsible. If the line is in your name, then I think that technically you are responsible, even if you don't live there, although I am sure someone will correct me if I am wrong on this...

 

I would write to the solicitors, explain that you did not even live there at the time of the alleged offence, and that further correspondence on this matter will be deemed harrassment.

 

What I have to ask is where did the figure of £900 come from? Was this a fine for penalty for downloading the game?

[adam1]

The line was in my name, as soon as I found out about the download, I cancelled the account.

 

I wrote to the solicitors telling them that I no longer lived at that address and hadn't done for four weeks before the download. I even sent proof of my change of address.

 

The £900 was a fine for downloading the game, but now they want to take me to court and add the court costs on top of that. There is no way I can pay this sort of money as I am living on government benefits, due to ill health.

[Spiceskull]

I guess that they believe that as the line was in your name, then ultimately you are responsible...and TBH it would be hard to prove otherwise.

 

However, by proving you were no longer at the address at the time of the offence, you can prove that the offence was not committed by you...

 

Another question: where did this fine come from? Surely if it was from a court, then the fine would need to be applied/levied on the person who comitted the crime...that the solicitors are threatening to take you to court seems to imply that the fine is nothing more than a money grubbing [problem].

 

Perhaps you could shed a little more light on the situation, paying heed to the timelines and actions taken...

[gh2008]

This sounds very very fishy to me.

Sounds something of a setup.

 

Have you got more details of exactly what the £900 is for, IMHO they cannot fine you, that should be done by the regulating authorities - surely

 

If they are suing you for damages then how have these damages been quantified.

 

Was the game downloaded from their servers by any chance - how did the downloader find out about the game being available - surely not via an email - if that email is still around .....

 

Is there even proof that this game was downloaded at all?

 

The responsibility aspect is difficult, as your ISP can be held just as responsible as can the server hosting the game.

[adam1]

After reading through the letter, if I understand it correctly, the £900 is for compensation or possibly an out of court settlement. It's made up of compensation, my then ISP's admin costs (and legal costs). There is a long list of the things that they have done to incur the costs, in short:

Damages for loss of sales.

Obtaining evidence

Writing to the ISP for my details

Preparing witness statements.

Serving the application order for a disclosure order on the ISP

Attending court to apply for the order

Drawing up the order

Sending the order the the ISP

Ensuring the ISP complies with the order

Corresponding with me

It says "Our client is prepared to give you the opportunity to avoid legal action....", presumably by paying this sum.

 

I don't know how the downloader found out about the game, as I said, I wasn't there.

 

The solicitors say that they act for Reality Pump Sp.zoo, the owner of the rights to the game.

[Spiceskull]

I would write to the solicitors, repeating the fact that as you were not resident at that address, you did not commit the alleged offence.

 

I would then ask them why they have not contacted you before, with something like a warning letter from their client, something along these lines:

"Dear Customer, it has come to our attention that a game has been downloaded, and this is in breach of copyright/licence rules..."

It seems odd in the extreme that the first contact is a letter demanding payment of "expenses," and threatening legal action if this payment is not met...

[welshcakes]

Don't know if this is anything to do with your particular situation however I found this :

 

ISPreview - UK ISP's Served with Court Order to Reveal User Details

[Spiceskull]

Moving "out" from that post, it would appear that this is a common theme...was the letter from Davenport Lyons? If so, then you can view other people receiving similar letters here and here.

 

It seems they legally compel ISPs to provide account holder details, then mass mail the list in the hope that people will settle, rather than face the threats that they make...

 

My suggestion is still to write to them, and ask where they got your name from. Ask also whether they have proof of the allegations that they are making against YOU. It is clear that this game probably got downloaded, but they are accusing you of something for which they have no proof.

 

My guess is that they will give up trying to extract money from you by threats, and move onto the next person who may be more compliant to their demands...

 

At the end of the day, if they take you to court, the judge will review your situation and finances, and will award a minimal amount if any at all...

[adam1]

Thanks for that, it's something I'd not thought of. I have written to the solicitors repeating that I was not at the address at the time of the offence and stating that the people there were responsible for the offence.

 

As for them not contacting me earlier, it is possible that they wrote to my old address as the offence took place on the 26/07/2007. The first I heard of it was when my estranged wife sent me the letter asking for the money, that was dated 26/02/2008, I received it in March.

[Spiceskull]

Aaaarrggh! Is it the same solicitors? Let us know how you get on. Good luck.

[adam1]

Don't know if this is anything to do with your particular situation however I found this :

 

ISPreview - UK ISP's Served with Court Order to Reveal User Details

 

Yes, that's it, same game, same solicitors.

 

After looking at your link and following other links, I came across this, taken from The Register:

 

In most European countries, including the UK, copyright infringement is only a criminal offence when conducted on a commercial scale. Most individual file-sharing would be unlikely to count as a criminal offence.

 

Would this apply to my case? As I can only see the game being downloaded for personal use.

[gh2008]

Have a read

ISPreview - UK ISP's Served with Court Order to Reveal User Details

UK BitTorrent Users Under More Pressure From Lawyers | TorrentFreak

Reality Pump lyons - Google Search

Reality Pump Studios - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

P2P Forums • View topic - UK BitTorrent Users Under More Pressure From Lawyers

Hosting news from around the world

UK BitTorrent Users Under More Pressure From Lawyers | TorrentFreak

Anti-Piracy Company Illegally Spied on P2P Users | TorrentFreak

Anti-Piracy Company Breaches Privacy, Ordered to Shut Down | TorrentFreak

 

quite informative I think you'll find

[adam1]

Have a read

ISPreview - UK ISP's Served with Court Order to Reveal User Details

UK BitTorrent Users Under More Pressure From Lawyers | TorrentFreak

Reality Pump lyons - Google Search

Reality Pump Studios - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

P2P Forums • View topic - UK BitTorrent Users Under More Pressure From Lawyers

Hosting news from around the world

UK BitTorrent Users Under More Pressure From Lawyers | TorrentFreak

Anti-Piracy Company Illegally Spied on P2P Users | TorrentFreak

Anti-Piracy Company Breaches Privacy, Ordered to Shut Down | TorrentFreak

 

quite informative I think you'll find

 

I've had a read, and found it very informative, thanks.

 

I think my next letter to Davenport Lyons, if there is one, will be just to say, Stop harassing me, or else I'll be reporting you to the Solicitors Regulation Authority.

[Spiceskull]

I think my next letter to Davenport Lyons, if there is one, will be just to say, Stop harassing me, or else I'll be reporting you to the Solicitors Regulation Authority.

I don't think you will find anyone here disagreeing with that course of action...good luck.

[adam1]

Thank You Spiceskull and Thank You gh2008 for your help. If anything else happens referring to this case I'll let you know.

 

Thanks again to both of you.