M1PLG v Lloyds cc

[Enron]

I can't see a credit limit on the document which is one of the prescribed terms, also it is illegible.

 

Will get a CCA check for you.

[steven4064]

If it was totally legible it may be enforceable but only if the two page are back and front of the same document. S127(3) of the CCA 1974 says that to be enforceable there must be a document signed by the debtor and having the prescribed terms.

 

However, the documement also has to be 'easily legible' under regulation 2 of the Consumer Credit (Cancellation Notices and Copies of Documents) REgulations 1983. AS it stands, I would say that this is not the case and therefore the agreement is not enforceable.

 

Enron - the credit limit is the first item under hgeading 4 on page 2 (you have to have pretty good eyesight though )

[Tonka99]

Hi Steven

 

Thanks for looking , on the 1st page section 5 it says i have read

the conditions overleaf , now OH cant remember getting the card

think it must have been done at the bank as its not his writing ,

the signature is his although it does seem to be signed in an odd

place and over the typed writing the sig box is large enough to

sign in not over .

 

dont know, also I cant see anywhere what the penalty charges are

for late payments ect , it is as you say very difficult to read ,the top

left hand corner on page 1 seems to me as if it has got damp or something

well on page 2 its in the exact same place top left hand corner , if this was overleaf it should be on the other side.

 

Thanks again they are now taking money out of OH gold account so

need to make a move to sort this one out .

 

cheers T99

[steven4064]

...on the 1st page section 5 it says i have read

the conditions overleaf

I'm sure it had another side, but is what they have sent you it?

 

I would write and tell them that what they have sent you does not comply with s78(1) of the CCA 1974 by virtue of regulation 2 of the Consumer Credit (Cancellation Notices and Copies of Documents) Regulations 1983

2 Legibility of notices and copy documents and wording of prescribed Forms

 

(1) The lettering in every notice in a Form prescribed by these Regulations and in every copy of an executed agreement, security instrument or other document referred to in the Act and delivered or sent to a debtor, hirer or surety under any provision of the Act shall, apart from any signature, be easily legible and of a colour which is readily distinguishable from the .

. Tell them, that as they have therefore not complied with your s78(1) request within the statutory period, the account is in dispute and that any attempt on their part to enforce the account is unlawful by virtue of s78(6) of the Act.

 

They must therefore desist in requesting payment or taking payment;

they must not add any interest or charges and

they must not communicate any information concerning the account to any third party including, but not limited to, any CRAs.

[Tonka99]

Hi all

 

Has anyone heard of had any dealings with

 

ALLIED INTERNATIONAL CREDIT (UK) LTD

Anderston House

389 ArgyleStreet

Glasgow

 

WARNING! Case no xxxx

received a yellow card today : Our Client has informed

us that under their terms and conditions,full payment

must be made immediately on this account.

 

now i dont know which account they are talking about as

they havent put any AC No on the card

 

Should i write and request to know which account they would

like me to pay immediately :o, and also say that im still waiting

for my SAR on both accounts or should i just file it

 

Thanks for stopping by

 

Cheers T99

[transparentspoon]

Hi,

 

I'd be tempted to write back to Allied International Credit asking them for:

 

 

1. full details of the account in dispute
   
2. proof that they have the authority to collect the debt (deed of transfer?)
   
3. copy of the 'executed' credit agreement (and - don't forget - copies of any document(s) referred to therein)
   
4. full details of any charges that have been added to the account if/when the company took over authorisation to collect the debt
   

Send this letter by Special Delivery (approx. £4.60) and it'll get there the next day, with proper proof of posting (unlike Recorded Delivery)

 

Just taking a step back for a moment, treat this request as if it were fradulent. What's to stop a company from finding out that you're probably already in debt (for example, by buying a customer profile list from an online loan comparison site, or even by a lender passing your details on to them) and writing a snooty letter in the hope that you'll just pay it all off because it looks frightening.

 

I've just had something similar from RMA on behalf of MBNA (though it did have the c/c account number on it) but as soon I saw that they were asking for more than I knew was currently outstanding, I decided to challenge it.

 

On a last point, be careful of your wording. I'm no legal expert but I thought very carefully about the last section of my letter so that it wouldn't actually obligate me to do anything:

 

I add finally that I am in no position to consider acknowledging either the stated debt or your authorisation to collect said debt until all of the above requests have been met in full and received by myself within the statutory timeframes.

 

Yours faithfully,

 

I. R. Broke

 

If you read through that, you'll notice that even if they do meet my requests in full (unlikely) I've then put myself in the position of only "considering" to acknowledge the debt IE not at all.

 

Hope that helps - and good luck!

 

Neil

Edited July 29, 2008 by transparentspoon
Clarification

[Tonka99]

Hello all

 

Update

 

Have sent letter along the lines that Transparentspoon had kindly

helped me with thanks:)

Had reply

the Ref no on the letter does not agree with the one we have for

the loan

I note from your letter you are requesting a copy of the original

agreement.

We are happy to request this for you (thats big of them)however

there is a fee payable .

no mention of the deed of transfer is there a fee for this

Thanks for looking in

T99

[Tonka99]

Hello

 

Have sent Allied International Credit Ltd CCA and SAR requests

will wait to see if any thing comes back .

 

Seems that all Banks are only sending back info for one account

even if all account numbers have been added to SAR tight

 

Thanks for looking in

T99

[transparentspoon]

Hi,

 

I think the deed of transfer should be returned from the SAR. But having said that, the results of my SAR from MBNA were rather pitiful (no record of any human-intervened or automatic decision making such as rate rises, no record of any correspondence, etc.) On the basis that they said something like "we did this for free because we're kind and lovely" and then returned my £10 postal order, they obviously seem to think that it's alright to fob you off with a partially-fulfilled request if they don't charge you for it. So that's yet another recorded delivery letter off to them shortly...

 

The deed of transfer is something that I specifically asked for because my c/c account was originally owned by BoS and then sold on to MBNA (though they've shown no evidence of this, so I have to presume that they're being fradulent).

 

Judging by the response we both seem to be getting, I think it's safe to assume that these organisations are

 

1) unorganised

2) stupid

 

By being so unorganised and stupid, this gives you much more leverage from a legal perspective. After all, unsecured borrowing works on the principle of "high risk, high reward" - if they're stupid enough to lend money with no security, then they're also stupid enough not to be able to deal with things when they don't get their money back (that's what I'm hoping at least!)

 

Best of luck anyway,

 

Neil

[Tonka99]

Hello Transparentspoon

 

Have received a letter back from AIC

"

I can confirm that AIC have provided details of all Data held

against the above case number to Lloys TSB , who as the

Data Controller, will provide you with this information within

the prescribed time frame, together with any additional information

which they may hold.

As AIC are not the Data Controller we will not be charging you the

£10.00 fee, we are therefore arranging to refund this amount under

seperate cover .

AIC also acknowledge that you requested a copy of your Agreement,

which we will be sending under seperate cover."

 

Well its keeping them busy if nothing else , I know that the PPI was

missold and that should be enough to pay off the arrears so we can

hopefully get back on line with it .

 

 

Thanks for your support

 

Cheers T99

[Tonka99]

Hello all

 

Its my first time over in this part of the site .

 

The story so far

My OH took a loan out in 06 for a large amount of

money at the time he was 64 six months later he

turned 65 , the PPI then stopped and we just carried

on paying the loan , last year 08 we ran into cashflow

problems with our Business up until then he had a very

good credit rating and was given the money no problems

now I had never heard of CAG more the pity,the loan was

given to him to help us get thro the winter as we had just

sold our other Business and hadnt found another it was

taken out in branch and the lady that sold it to him said

if you take the PPI you stand a better chance of getting

the money she did not ask him if he had any medical conditions

which he had and would not have passed a doctors medical

Now she must of seen how old he was on the paperwork

and the fact that he is selfemployed .

 

He now has a Court case on going at the AQ stage which

is over in the Legals .

I have sent SD a CPR 18 to SCM who have not replyed so

dont have any statements or what happened after the PPI

was stopped

 

Help is needed with which way to go from here having not

gone down the reclaiming PPI route.

 

Any help and advice greatly received

 

Very many thanks for looking

 

Tonks:)

[dx100uk]

perfect case for a reclaim.

 

have a look in the stickies at the top of the forum [click the blue ppi forum name].

 

goodluck.

 

dx

[Tonka99]

Hi

Could someone have a look and advise on the above

as I need to get the AQ off tomorrow and dont know if to

include it or go for a seperate claim

 

Many thanks for looking

 

Tonks

[banker_rhymes_with]

Hello Tonks!

 

As I say, don't bust a gut on the AQs, as they are not a make or break issue.

 

If you take them in on Monday, nobody will bat an eyelid.

 

Always better to get them right than rush them...have you seen the AQs from the enemy yet? Sometimes it's useful to see what they've got first before you drop your own AQ trousers!

 

You can then use the AQ to add Draft Directions to, say, ask the Court to make the opposition produce the Agreement or Default Notice and proof of postage of the Default Notice.

 

To stress, getting the AQs in on time is not a race you must win...it's a race you just need to finish in sufficient time to get the best advantage you can.

 

Cheers,

BRW

[Tonka99]

Hello BRW

 

Thanks for that , I have called the local court and they say

the other side have not sent theirs in yet and that they should

send one to me 8)

Hope to go tomorrow and sort out the fee thing

 

Cheers for now

 

Tonks

[Tonka99]

Hi Guys

 

Need some advice re PPI , I have a court case going on

over in the LEGALS , im about to do a N244 for more information

to be disclosed so I can Counterclaim for mis-sold PPI on a Loan

what do I need to include .

 

Any advice really appreciated

 

Thanks for Looking

 

Tonks:)

[alanalana]

Legal forum is the best place for advice on this issue.

 

Legal Issues

 

Sorry I cannot be of more help on the legal issues.

 

aa

[Tonka99]

Hi

Im back again , this time for a credit card taken out in 2004

have got to the defence stage which has to be in by the weekend.

 

There are lots of late payment charges and overlimet charges,

plus PPI which was missold , I would like to know if I can put in

a part 20 counter claim which will reduce the debt considerably

 

If so how do I go about doing that

 

Any advice much appreciated

 

Tonks

[Tonka99]

Morning all

 

Anyone able to offer assistance

 

Tonks

[AndyOrch]

Not looking that way Tonka assistance appears to be thin on the ground lately, how are you btw I trust you are well?

 

Post up your defence when drafted and tot up your charges/PPI ready for your PT20 CC,

I will endeavor to take a look.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[Tonka99]

Hi Andy

 

I am ok thanks , have done the charges and PPI so just need to do the defence

many thanks for your advice due date 21st May

I think because that is a Sat

I have until Monday would that be correct ? I have an extenstion of 21 days from

my CPR15.5

Claim was Issued 1st Feb done the CPR31.14 and 31.15 ect

do really need someone to look at the documents sent

 

I hope you are well and fighting fit

 

Very best Regards

 

Tonks:-)

[AndyOrch]

Hi Andy

 

I am ok thanks , have done the charges and PPI so just need to do the defence

many thanks for your advice due date 21st May

I think because that is a Sat

I have until Monday would that be correct ? No Needs to be submitted Fri 20th I have an extension of 21 days from

my CPR15.5

Claim was Issued 1st Feb ???? 28 plus 21 (39 days) Check your dates Tonks and with the Court done the CPR31.14 and 31.15 ect

do really need someone to look at the documents sent

 

I hope you are well and fighting fit

 

Very best Regards

 

Tonks:-)

 

Whats the details of their claim(POC)?

History?

Dispute?

Arrears?

Andy

[Tonka99]

Andy

 

I have a letter confirming 21st May as due date from Solicitors so 20th is latest ok

 

POC: credit card taken out in 2004 In breach of the agreement the defendant failed to

make payments , claimants sent default notice then formal demand to defendant

Claimants therefore claim the balance due under the agreement £****.**

 

 

History : I had an payment plan in place with them since 2009 token payments BUT

unfortunatly Over the christmas busy time for us here I forgot all about them so missed

three payments then bang claim issued so here we are !

 

Dispute : The credit agreement that has been sent is not headed in the right way it is

a application form with seperate terms and conditions on a seperate sheet with lots

of bits missing , now I know that lots of things have changed recently so would be good

to have someone look it over

 

 

Arrears :by that do you mean charges ect not sure what u mean on the default notice ?

 

In their poc they do not mention the token agreed payments

 

PPI : I will be going for compand interest to redress the balance

 

Charges : again compand interest

 

Add them both together and it wipes out 2/3rds of the claimed debt

 

 

 

Hope this is of some use to you

 

Many thanks

 

Tonks:-)

[AndyOrch]

Ok Tonka

 

 

II your happy with the defence date and sure its correct (109 days seems a long time)

I assume they have responded to your CPR request (Agreement/DN/AN) you need to post up

less any identifiables.

 

How was the credit applied for ? (flyer/post /branch or online)

 

Do you have the original DN?

 

BY arrears i am wondering if they tally with the DN amount?

 

What is the rough value of the claim SCT or FT?

 

Your defence will be based on the non compliance of your sec 78 request ?

 

Regards

 

Andy

[Tonka99]

Andy

There was a big deley with getting the docs back to me from the solicitors which

caused the extra time lapse it was agreeded that I had extra time in which to file my

defence re CPR 15.5 the court have been informed .

 

Credit applied from flyer via post

 

Yes

 

Arrears ie DN because of charges and missold PPI the amount will be incorrect

 

Fast Track/ Ten grand ish

 

Possibly when it has been looked over will post up tonite as im working

 

 

Regards

Tonks:-)