M1PLG v Lloyds cc

[Tonka99]

new post (3) hope this works thanks elsinore omg missed that bit , im still learning my way round uploading see you in a min

M1

[elsinore]

Hi M1. Can you please edit the image of the agreement and delete the account number at the top right of the doc? It could identify you.

 

I'll draw attention to your thread from some CCA specialists.

 

Els

[Tonka99]

Hi again lets try this , thanks for your advice

 

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn99/sexeysarms/updatellcc.jpg

 

 

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn99/sexeysarms/lloyds2-1.jpg

 

what a performance soz to be so dumb!!

 

cheers M1

[elsinore]

Those links don't work, M1. Can you redo them?

 

Els

[Tonka99]

Hi Els

just to say they work on mine

will try to sort it for tonight of to the bank now !!!!!!!!

cheers for now M1

[slick132]

Doc'ts appear for me so I'll now ask for opinion on them.

[elsinore]

Yes, I can see them now, Slick.

 

Els

[pt2537]

well both links just say photo has been removed when i click on them

 

so i cant see the CCA to be sure

[elsinore]

I'll email them to you, Paul.

 

Els

[Tonka99]

hi all

 

many thanks for all your help will post up again for you

 

 

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn99/sexeysarms/take2lltsbcc.jpg

 

 

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn99/sexeysarms/doctc2llyds.jpg

 

hope it works it does for me but who knows

 

cheers M1

[slick132]

Asked for opinion again - hopefully links will work ok.

 

May have to wait till tomorrow now, unless Rory is prowling late

[Tonka99]

Hi Slick

you really are a star ,

i have put up new mbna loan thread which also needs a look ,

plus one for Mackays which Steven4064 has looked at it is strange hoping he can advise there .

many thanks again

 

cheers M1

 

ps can i pm you sometime so i can explain a few things ?

[Tonka99]

Hi Slick your up late again ,

any luck with the guys on the CCA ?

 

cheers M1

[slick132]

I'll nudge it again but please be patient - the debt bods have a huge workload and your doc'ts have added to it a fair bit !! LoL

 

PM by all means if you wish.

[Tonka99]

Thanks Slick

will shut up and go to bed now . busy weekend ahead really do think the support on this site is fantastic , no more docs to post up for a while , Mbna have not returned three requests only the loan one , sorry to be a pain, please thank all the guys for me .

 

cheers for now

M1

[banker_rhymes_with]

Hello M1!

 

I've had a quick look, as requested.

 

I think it's best to wait for someone more experienced to comment. But first glance seems to suggest it has not been executed by the Lender.

 

The first is an Application Form, so if that was all they sent, it doesn't look Enforceable.

 

However, there does appear to be some Prescribed Terms on the 2nd Page, but the two Pages do not seem to be linked. The First has a lot of References around the edges, whereas the 2nd is somewhat different...a plain Page with nothing much to link it to the first that I can see.

 

There do appear to be two sets of Fold Marks on both, or lines that could be Fold Marks, which may suggest both Pages were folded twice to fit into, say, an Envelope.

 

See if these line up on your Copies there.

 

These are just my first impressions. I'll have a closer look Tomorrow, in the cold light of day!

 

Cheers,

BRW

[pt2537]

Well, the prescribed terms are not in the signature document that is for certain.nor is the document headed as required by the Consumer Credit Agreement Regs 1983 schedule 1

 

 

now turning our attention to the T&Cs which the signature document claim are over leaf

 

 

looking at the credit limit, it says "Credit Limit see also 5" Now i must be missing something because there is no 5

 

so it seems that there is some missing information, personally i feel this is open to challenge as i do not feel it is compliant at all, they would need to prove that the T&Cs were attached to the rear of the application if they couldnt then i would say they were royally stuffed

[banker_rhymes_with]

Hello All!

 

Yep, pt2537 is spot on, although they mention a Section 5, there's no sign of a Section 5 on the back at all. Well spotted.

 

Also, the Fold Marks that I mentioned, these may not be important, as they could also be the ones added when they sent this to you, i.e. actual Physical Fold Marks in your own Copy that your own Scanner picked up.

 

However, if they look like they are not recent Physical Fold Marks added to your own Copy, but ones Printed onto your Copy by Lloyds when they Photocopied the Original Document(s) [note the potential plural], then examining them further may be worth coming back to later.

 

For example, if you need additional ammunition to bring into question if these two Pages were ever part of the same Document.

 

This is nit picking, but if they don't have the Original, and have simply merged two documents into one from two arguably unrelated Copies, then letting them know you know this at an early stage means they will know that little bluff is going to be called.

 

Cheers,

BRW

[Tonka99]

Hello all

 

Udate for this one

 

Have had a letter from Solicitors Sechiarl, Clark,& Mitchell

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn99/sexeysarms/solictiorsletterlloydscc.jpg

 

I have done nothing with this one as yet, still unclear as to what the next

move should be as the cca is considered to be a bit iffy.

 

Any advice guys ,

Im begining to get a bit nervous now so many on to one

 

many thanks to all who have looked

 

cheers

T99

[FANTASY CHARGES]

hang on those so called t & c are for people converting existing balances

 

it also says bank copy so if those t & c were on the back of an application gform there would be no need to say bank copy !!!!

 

it also says these are some of the legal conditions for our classic gold and platinum credit cards . the full conditions are set out in the section headed lloyds tsb classic gold and platinum card terms & Conditions

 

isn't it a coincidence that section 4 is exactly at the top of column 2 (cut and paste)

[Tonka99]

Hello FC

 

Thanks for looking , as BRW says more eyes the better , can you advise

as to the next step , I have so many on the go at the moment .

Had a choice get some charges ppi ect back or go B/R:eek: have made

my choice , these banks just put you further and deeper in the s**t

so now I feel its payback time , on saying that i really need and am getting lots of help, but am NOT very confident or know how to proceed

further so any advice is very welcome

many thanks for your time

regards T99

[banker_rhymes_with]

Hello T99!

 

It's a tough call, but that Agreement looks dubious for all the reasons mentioned so far. The main ones being that the 2nd Page does not seem to relate to the first. Apart from anything else, the 2nd Page looks amazingly badly set out from an Artwork/Type-Setting point of view...looks thrown together.

 

To take you to Court and Enforce this, they are going to need to produce the Original. That will have to be a single sheet with two-sides, one Signed by you, and the other containing all the Prescribed Terms on the back of it.

 

That, to me, is the big question. Have they really got such a Document?

 

The thing I would do now while thinking about the next move (or lack of it, your next move could be to let them take the next move) is to trawl through any Statements that you do have, and see if there are any Penalty Charges that you can Dispute and Claim back. IOW, start planning to Dispute any Figures they are claiming from you, and make it clear that if they take you to Court, they must also be prepared to explain the Validity of those Charges.

 

Likewise PPI. Do you have the PPI Terms and Conditions, and if so, what is the wording for Self-Employed Cover...if any?

 

If no Statements and no PPI Terms, then it could be wise to pay £10 and send them a Subject Access Request. But, as time is getting tight, to stop them messing around and dragging the S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) out, I would ask them specifically for anything you may need in the S.A.R - (Subject Access Request). Say you want all Statements and you want the PPI Terms.

 

The reason for this, is if you can Dispute the alleged Debt figures, you may be able to Dispute the Default if it was based on a Total that was itself made up of Penalty Charges and potentially mis-Sold PPI.

 

After that, I'm running low on the experience needed to help, so hopefully PT2537 and others will come in next to advise on what to do.

 

It may be that you should do nothing directly, and just wait for them to take the next action. Build your Defence, and see what they do.

 

Even if they issue Court Papers, that could be just a strategy to try and make you Pay. If they do not have the Original Copy of a two-sided Agreement, and you make it clear that it must be Produced, they may either not turn up, or pull out ahead of Court.

 

Or their next move could be to Sell the alleged Debt to a Debt Collecting Agency (DCA). That could tell you something!

 

If a DCA does appear, then hit them with a Letter that says you do not acknowledge any Debt to their Company, the alleged Debt is in Dispute and should not therefore have been Sold to them, please produce details of the alleged Agreement they are relying upon to Enforce the alleged Debt, please produce details of the Assignment from the Original Creditor to them and, while you are at it, throw in a Telephone Harassment Warning with the No Visits Paragraph for good measure.

 

It may be worth sending any DCA that does appear £1 and a CCA Request all of their own. They would have 12 Working Days to produce that.

 

Finally, if that Agreement really is suspect, then you could argue that it's not Enforceable so they no longer have your Authority to process your Data. You can then consider going back to try and get the Default removed, plus get any nasty notes left on your Credit File removed as well.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Cheers,

BRW

[Tonka99]

;-)Hello BRW

 

As usual you are keeping an eye on me it gives me hope ;-);-)

What you say is probably the best way to go ,SAR tomorrow outline

what is needed .We bank with these s*** and have sent a cca of

for oh had statements back already they have taken from oh bank

account every time we were late with a payment but only after

we paid so lots of double payments and since we have been here

around 15mths we have not had any statements at all. then demands

for payment so we paid up and guess what they took £220.00 out of his

account the same day again . well thats another story for another day.

Im getting a lot worried at the moment seems like my luck is running

out and im not doing anything do realise that it is a stalling game

just wish I knew all this years ago , unfortunatly as you know when

you have a business you are too busy working and miss lots of the

important things .

well lets hope for better things soon

 

thanks again T99

[banker_rhymes_with]

Hello T99!

 

Just keep your chin up, and keep all of these issues in order.

 

Use Files, a Sheet of A3 on a Wall, what ever it takes, keep each one organised, and you will gradually plot your best way through all of this.

 

The Threads on CAG could well also be a sensible place to keep your main thoughts Listed out and ordered into the applicable Thread.

 

If you have a Spreadsheet Application on your Computer, they can be great to use as a Diary. You can colour in the Cells to keep track, and set it out with Days of the Week, Month etc, and change colours if things go well, average or bad, and then concentate on the one that is giving you the most grief.

 

One thing I will say, don't be tempted to borrow via Mortgage to pay off Credit Cards. Never used Secured Debt to Pay-Off Unsecured Debt.

 

All you will do is move the Debt from someone who can't easily take your Home, to someone that can!

 

Best plan at the moment is to do as you have done, and keep them all lined up via the CAG Threads, and keep things ordered.

 

People here will help you to organise your thoughts as things come up. No matter how bad it looks, we'll all do our best to spot solutions to try and turn it around until it looks better.

 

The Loan issue is still looking good, I still think the Signature Dates and Cancellation issues could prove a significant issue in your favour. It's quite possible that the Agreement is not Enforceable if I'm right. So far, the consensus is that I'm not wrong, and could be right.

 

Don't let these b***ards grind you down.

 

Cheers,

BRW

[Tonka99]

Hello BRW

 

hope your ok

 

I have been busy getting SAR,s off today spent a fortune at the

PO.

 

The phone has been ringing from our friends at Chester Towers think

I spoke to soon they have been too quite for too long , now i fear

i may need to borrow your gun.

Have got the staff to log the calls now , nothing in the post today

 

cheers T99