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    • The private submersible industry was shaken after the implosion of the OceanGate Titan sub last year.View the full article
    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
    • Thanks for all the suggestions so far I will amend original WS and send again for review.  While looking at my post at very beginning when I submitted photos of signs around the car park I noticed that it says 5 hours maximum stay while the signage sent by solicitor shows 4 hours maximum stay but mine is related to electric bay abuse not sure if this can be of any use in WS.
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CCA MoorCroft/Argos Card


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Today is the day when I CCA Moorcroft, I have printed off the standard letter and not signed it by hand. Will go to the PO later to get the £1 order and send by RD 1st Class. Will see what the buggers come back with!!

 

I owe Argos Card about £600 and was passed to MoorCrap about a year ago and I have been paying £5.10 a month via my DMP with CCCS.

 

They phoned me at work yesterday and again this morning demanding money saying that they have not been receiving payment.

 

I told them 2 things.

 

1) CCCS has been making the payments to them for 1 year now by Direct Debit.

2) Remove my work phone number from their system.

 

 

Let the fun begin :grin::grin:

It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye :D

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Thanks for the link.

 

I'm quite confident that Moorcrap wont have anything that can stick, judging by posts on this forum.

 

So will see if Argos eventually come back to me.

It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye :D

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Checked the Royal Mail Tracker and says that the letter was signed for this morning. Will await for the image to be uploaded and then take a copy of that.

 

The clock is now ticking on MoorCroft :-D

It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye :D

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Moorcroft received my letter on the 25th March and today I received a reply from them dated 26th March. Below is the contents of the letter:

 

Dear Manc

 

RE:Argos Card (Ref:xxxxxxxxx)

 

I refer to your recent correspondence. We are continuing to seek to obtain a copy of the Consumer Credit Agreement that you have requested. Our systems provide for reviews to be sent to our client on a regular basis and this we are continuing do. I will contact you again just as soon as the agreement has been made available to ourselves and confirm at this stage the account has been placed on hold and that we will not seek to enforce the debt until such time as the agreement is obtained.

 

In the meantime however we believe that it may be of assistance to all parties if we also take this opportunity to ensure that any potential areas of dispute are addressed prior to any possible court action or further investigation. Please could you give an indication of the information you will be providing, when giving evidence to the court or providing information to the relevant statutory authorities in relation to the alleged subject matter of the account.

 

Please could you provide this information by return. We believe that this is a simple request that will assist in ensuring that all possible areas of dispute are identified as quickly as possible and potential costs and delays kept to a minimum level.

 

I thank you for you assistance and patience in this regard.

 

Yours Sincerely

 

Mrs K Dyde

Operational Support Supervisor

 

 

Well, I wont be responding to this letter and they have until April 9th to come up with the CCA and then a further 30 days before I contact TS.

 

I have highlighted the part I enjoyed the best, as they have agreed in writing that they cannot enforce the debt until they have provided the agreement, which we all know they probably can't!!!!

It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye :D

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I had the exact same letter about 3 months ago.

Still no sign of an agreement from either Moorcroft or Argos.

 

Even if they do manage to produce something, it's likely to

be an unenforceable application form.

These are video links to show how I deal with Debt Collectors.

 

Fly fishing for C.A.R.S

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=zPtzK8FqE6k&feature=related

 

Frederickson International don't accept my card type

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=eiZBULlWW6Q&feature=related

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  • 1 month later...

If I have my calculations correct then the 12+30 Days will be up tomorrow or the day after and no CCA in sight.!!!

 

What is my next move??

It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye :D

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  • 2 weeks later...

Received a letter from Moorcroft this morning.

 

We write further to your recent letter. At this stage we are currently unable to provide a copy of the agreement as we have been in contact with our client (Argos Card) who have confirmed that to obtain a copy of the agreement under Section 78 of the CCA you must put your request in writing to the following address:-

 

Customer Support

Home Retail Group F.S.

Royal Avenue

Widness

WA88 1AL

 

We are therefore returning the payment submitted in that connection so you can send your request to our client

 

 

Should I now CCA Argos or just leave it?

It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye :D

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Received a letter from Moorcroft this morning.

 

 

 

 

Should I now CCA Argos or just leave it?

 

The above is a pile of **** :eek:

 

Personally, I would write sternly to moorcrap that seeing as it's them hounding you, it's their duty to pass your CCA request and that you are counting the legal requirement days from your first request. Enclose in the letter the returned payment, send recorded and also mention that you'll report them to Trading Standards.

 

This, from OFT guidlines, may also apply:

 

Deceptive and/or unfair methods

2.7 Dealings with debtors are not to be deceitful and/or unfair.

2.8 Examples of unfair practices are as follows:

a. sending demands for payment to an individual when it is uncertain that

they are the debtor in question, for example, threatening debt recovery

action to 'the occupier' or sending a payment demand to all people sharing

the same name/date of birth as a debtor in the hope that contact with the

correct debtor will be made.

b. disclosing debt details to an individual when it is uncertain that they are

the debtor in question, for example, disclosing details to 'the occupier' of

an address.

c. refusing to deal with appointed or authorised third parties, such

as Citizens Advice Bureaux, independent advice centres or money

advisers

d. contacting debtors directly and bypassing their appointed representatives

e. operating a policy, without reason, of refusing to negotiate with

debt management companies

f. passing on debtor details to debt management companies without the

debtors' informed prior consent

g. failing to refer on to the creditor reasonable offers to pay by instalments

h. not passing on payments received within a reasonable time resulting in

delays that adversely affect a debtor's financial position.

i. failing to investigate and/or provide details as appropriate, when a debt is

queried or disputed, possibly resulting in debtors being wrongly pursued

 

Full OFT guidlines available here:

 

http://www.oft.gov.uk/shared_oft/business_leaflets/consumer_credit/oft664.pdf

 

Good luck and best wishes.

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  • 3 weeks later...

These buggers tried to phone me at work today, I failed the security so they said that they would phone back.

 

I had forgotten about this one, so will be returning the £1 PO and a stern letter tonight.

It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye :D

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Send them this:

 

 

- HARASSMENT WARNING -

WARNING; PROTECTION FROM HARASSMENT ACT 1997;

WARNING; COMMUNICATIONS ACT 2003. s127.

 

Telephone Number: {Your Telephone Number}

Re: Harassment by telephone

 

Dear Sir/Madam.

 

I am writing in relation to telephone calls that I have received from your organisation, which I deem to be personally harassing. I have verbally requested that these calls stop, but I am still receiving call. I now require the telephone number listed above to be completely removed from your systems.

 

I am in the view that your continued telephone calls put you in breach of the Protection of Harassment Act 1997.

 

This is a private telephone line, operated on a contract with the intention of receiving and making personal phone calls, I have not authorised any other member of my family to receive calls from your organisation using this PRIVATE TELEPHONE LINE.

 

By using this telephone number without my permission you are interferring with my ability to use my own private property for the duration of any call.

 

It is my right to require that this telephone line, which is licenced solely to myself, is kept clear for my own personal calls.

 

It is consquently my view that you are commiting the tort of interference with contract insofar as for the duration of each call you make to me without my permission, you are interfering with my contractual right to receive and make personal calls on my private telephone line.

 

Continued interference with my contractual rights in this manner may result in legal action.

 

If you continue to harass me by telephone, you will also be in breach of the Communications Act (2003) s.127 and I will report you to the Office of Communications, Trading Standards and the Office of Fair Trading, meaning that you may be liable for a substantial fine.

 

Be advised that all telephone calls from your company will be recorded.

 

 

Yours faithfully,

 

It's stronger than the standard one. Amend to suit, send recorded, DO NOT SIGN, print your name and keep copies of everything, call logs, content etc.

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I'll add that into the envelope that I send out tonight. The number that they phone is my work one, and I am too busy to be dealing with these idiots.

 

Thanks for all of your help BB

It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye :D

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Both letters sent out tonight RD with name printed on letters, no signature.

 

Lets see what crap they come back with this time. :D

It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye :D

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  • 3 weeks later...

Send this to them, amend to suit via recorded delivery:

 

Account In Dispute

 

Ref:

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Thank you for your letter of xx/xx/xx, the contents of which have been noted.

 

You have failed to respond to my legal request to supply me a true copy of the original Consumer Credit Agreement for the above account.

 

On **DATE** I made a formal request for a true signed agreement for the alleged account under consumer credit Act 1974 s77/8. A copy of which is enclosed for your perusal and ease of reference.

You have failed to comply with my request, and as such the account entered default on **DATE**.

 

The document that you are obliged to send me is a true copy of the executed agreement that contained all of the prescribed terms, all other required terms and statutory notices and was signed by both your company and myself as defined in section 61(1) of CCA 74 and subsequent Statutory Instruments. If the executed agreement contained any reference to any other document, you are also obliged to send me a copy of that document.In addition a full statement of this account should have been sent to me detailing all debits and credits to the account.

 

Furthermore

 

 

You are aware that the Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for a request for a true copy of a credit agreement to be carried out before your client enters into a default situation.

 

If that request is not satisfied after a further 30 calendar days your client commits a summary criminal offence.

 

These limits have expired.

 

As you are no doubt aware section 77(6) states:

 

If the creditor fails to comply with Subsection (1)

 

(a) He is not entitled , while the default continues, to enforce the agreement.

 

And

 

(b) If the default continues for one month he commits an offence.

 

Therefore this account has become unenforceable at law.

 

As you have Failed to comply with a lawful request for a true, signed copy of the said agreement and other relevant documents mentioned in it, Failed to send a full statement of the account and Failed to provide any of the documentation requested.

 

Consequentially any legal action you pursue will be averred as both UNLAWFUL and VEXATIOUS.

 

Furthermore I shall counterclaim that any such action constitutes unlawful harassment.

 

Please note you may also consider this letter as a statutory notice under section 10 of the Data Protection Act to cease processing any data in relation to this account with immediate effect.

 

This means you must remove all information regarding this account from your own internal records and from my records with any credit reference agencies.

 

Should you refuse to comply, you must within 21 days provide me with a detailed breakdown of your reasoning behind continuing to process my data.

 

It is not sufficient to simply state that you have a ‘legal right’; You must outline your reasoning in this matter and state upon which legislation this reasoning depends.

 

Should you not respond within 14 days I expect that this means you agree to remove all such data.

 

Furthermore you should be aware that a creditor is not permitted to take ANY

Action against an account whilst it remains in dispute.

 

The lack of a credit agreement is a very clear dispute and as such the following applies.

 

* You may not demand any payment on the account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.

* You may not add further interest or any charges to the account.

* You may not pass the account to a third party.

* You may not register any information in respect of the account with any credit reference agency.

* You may not issue a default notice related to the account.

 

 

I reserve the right to report your actions to any such regulatory authorities as I see fit.

You have 14 days from receiving this letter to contact me with your intentions to resolve this matter which is now a formal complaint.

 

I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter.

 

I look forward to hearing from you in writing.

 

Yours faithfully

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Thanks BB

 

This morning I found out that the Postal Order was banked/cashed on 13 June.

 

I will get the letter off to them tomorrow.

It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye :D

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  • 2 weeks later...

Today I got a letter from their Home Collections Dept (the bloke who sits behind the Pre-Court Division bloke, lol)

 

Saying they are coming to see me in a couple of days time. (Am not wasting money on Tea & Biscuits, cause I know they wont arrive!!!!)

 

Am going to send them a strongly worded complaint to get the ball rolling and remind them that they are committing an offence as they hve not complied with my CCA request, even though they have cashed the PO!!!!

 

What bunch if numpties!!!!

It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye :D

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I had a new one from Moorcroft today.

 

Posing as Midas Legal Services.

 

Usual threat-o-gram saying I must contact them to arrange a payment plan with them by the 11th July Or they "MAY" take legal action.

 

YAWN.... OOOh am I supposed to look scared now? Oh ok. :p

 

Will be writing back to say account in dispute, go away you irritating worms. Sent me a CCA that properly executed and maybe we can talk.

These are video links to show how I deal with Debt Collectors.

 

Fly fishing for C.A.R.S

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=zPtzK8FqE6k&feature=related

 

Frederickson International don't accept my card type

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=eiZBULlWW6Q&feature=related

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  • 3 weeks later...

On Saturday I got the following from Moorcrap.

 

Looks like they finally got off their arse and asked Argos for the CCA.

 

All they have sent is the application form that has no prescribed terms etc on it. They didnt send me any T&C's either, so have not fulfilled my request.

 

I will be writing to them to tell them this!!

 

argosa.jpg

 

 

argos-1.jpg

It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye :D

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Aww what a shame. After all that trouble Moorcroft went to.

 

All they could manage was a really poor scanned copy of an application form.

 

Take great delight in telling them this. I did. :D

 

I know from an Argos employee that the in store applications were faxed to head office for approval, if they were then approved, the originals in the store were destroyed every 6 weeks. So, not only do they not have any kind of enforceable agreement, but all they do have is a computer stored fax of an application form.

These are video links to show how I deal with Debt Collectors.

 

Fly fishing for C.A.R.S

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=zPtzK8FqE6k&feature=related

 

Frederickson International don't accept my card type

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=eiZBULlWW6Q&feature=related

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Aww what a shame. After all that trouble Moorcroft went to.

 

All they could manage was a really poor scanned copy of an application form.

 

Take great delight in telling them this. I did. :D

 

I know from an Argos employee that the in store applications were faxed to head office for approval, if they were then approved, the originals in the store were destroyed every 6 weeks. So, not only do they not have any kind of enforceable agreement, but all they do have is a computer stored fax of an application form.

 

Thanks for the insight into Argos FB.

 

Will gladly take the **** out of Moorcrap now :-D:-D:-D including starting the letter, Dear Moron!!!!

It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye :D

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