Business Account -chasing Me For Guarantee

[dhoom]

Couple of years back I gave a personal guarantee for a business overdraft, unfortunately the business flopped and we stopped trading over a year ago and could no longer service the overdraft.

 

Few months back the bank made a demand under the guarantee. I wrote back and said I do not acknowledge any debt unless they supply me the copy personal guarantee (I couldn't find mine) and a breakdown of how the amount they are claiming was made up.

 

They sent me the company's bank statements to show the balance outstanding. If anyone has had a Barclays business account, you will know the regime they operate if you account goes over the limit and they pay any cheques. It's a daylight robbery.

 

Now the statement they sent me was three time the agreed overdraft of which over a third was unlawful charges. So again I asked for a breakdown equating to the amount that they are claiming under my guarantee. They wouldn't supply this and instead have just refferred me to the company bank statement.

 

Last month had a letter from Optima saying pay up or else proceeding, I asked them to send me a breakdown of how the amount is made up of equating to the claim and again they just referred me to the company bank statements.

 

Let me make one thing clear I am not tryng to evade my obligations, I have made them a without prejudice offer as well, clearing this over the next nine months ( I would have to borrow from friends and relatives to do this) but Optima say that they want this NOW. The figures we are talking about is in multiples of 10k, I simply do not have this since the failure of business has meant huge losses. If this goes to courts and the Judge looks at my income and expenditure they would probably get like 1p a month if that.

 

The reason for me to ask them a breakdown of what they are claiming is that if it includes any unlawful charges then I could well claim these charges in time to come.

 

Any advice on how to tackle this would be appreciated.

[slick132]

Hi Dhoom and welcome to Barclays forum,

 

Do you have all the statements relating to this a/c so you can quantify the unlawful chgs included in the total debt.

 

Do you own your home and consider this to be at risk.

 

I will ask the site team for help and I or a team member will come back to you.

 

Slick

[dhoom]

Hi Dhoom,

 

Do you have all the statements relating to this a/c so you can quantify the unlawful chgs included in the total debt.

 

Do you own your home and consider this to be at risk.

 

I will ask the site team for help and I or a team member will come back to you.

 

Slick

 

They have given me all the statements. Yes I can quantify the charges.

 

I do own a home with substantial equity.

 

Because I am looking at going into partnership with someone, I can't afford to have a CCJ, and I am not trying to avoid any debt due.

[slick132]

Haven't forgotten you and will get back asap - please bear with us.

[slick132]

Hi Dhoom,

 

What is Optima claiming from you -

 

1) The amount at which the o/d was originally agreed and which you guaranteed.

 

2) The full amount of the o/d which you say is about 3 times what was originally agreed.

 

Please give an approx figure for the total o/d at present including unlawful chgs and interest.

[dhoom]

Hi Dhoom,

 

What is Optima claiming from you -

 

1) The amount at which the o/d was originally agreed and which you guaranteed.

 

2) The full amount of the o/d which you say is about 3 times what was originally agreed.

 

Please give an approx figure for the total o/d at present including unlawful chgs and interest.

 

approx. figures

 

current o/d 75K

 

Guarantee 35K

 

Charges around 22K

 

O/D Limit 25K

 

Optima Claiming 35K + interest

 

I have a letter from the bank when they made the inital demand the they are looking to me for 25K.

[slick132]

So are you happy to repay the full debt, less the unlawful chgs, BUT using your timescale.

 

Or are you just looking to repay what you guaranteed.

 

Or, if no Guarantee doc't turns up, perhaps agree a figure in full and final settlement.

 

Views please.

[dhoom]

The gurantee provided for an overall amount which was broken down as follows:

O/D 25K

other indemnities 10K

 

The company never used other indemnities, but the bank allowed for the O/D to go beyond the agreed amount.

 

My arguement is that I only want to pay them the agreed O/D i.e. 25K within my timescale.

[slick132]

Hi Dhoom,

 

Was the failed business a Ltd Co. or other.

 

What is the present status of the business and what do you think will become of it.

[dhoom]

Hi Dhoom,

 

Was the failed business a Ltd Co. or other.

 

What is the present status of the business and what do you think will become of it.

 

Ltd.

 

not trading at the moment.

[slick132]

Hi Dhoom,

 

Have you rec'd any further contact form Optima about recovery action.

 

It's strange that they've not come back with the Guarantee Doc't - I see you've asked for this specifically on one occasion at least.

 

It must only be a matter of time before Optima makes a Court Claim for the money they seek. I think you should therefore send Optima an SAR requesting sight of the Guarantee Doc't and all other doc'ts relating to the account, and the amount, which you Guaranteed.

 

Before you do this, I want to seek advise from the site team and we'll come back to you.

[dhoom]

thanks for your response.

 

Optima have sent me the guarantee.

 

But what they will not sent me is an itemised breakdown of how the amount they are claiming is made up of. The company had used its OD facilities, but I have specifically asked them to give me details of the transcations they are claiming from me. I am not prepared to just accept that since the companys bank statement show XXX amount you are liable for the guaranteed amount. Again I am not disputing that I did guarantee an amount, but I want to know how that amount is made up.

[tomterm8]

Can you post up the guarantee MINUS your personal details, please?

[dhoom]

they wrote to me a week ago and told me they will agree to my payment proposal if i agree o give them a charge over my house and they will also want the extent to the guarantee and not just the amount relating to the O/D. Told them need to take advice on this, but when I came home yesterday there was a claim form from them. They refuse to give me a breakdown of the amounts included in their claim.

 

Will post the particulars of claim and the guarantee when I get the scanner sorted.

[slick132]

Hi Dhoom,

 

As they've now issued a claim against you , I suggest you post the documents for us to see as a matter of urgency.

 

We need to see the Guarantee doc't, the Court Claim doc't and the banks POC for the claim (if they are seperate).

[dhoom]

someone please tell me how to attached a pdf with this post

[slick132]

Hi Dhoom,

 

Check out the guide here - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/welcome-consumer-forums/107001-how-do-i-dummies.html

 

Or post on Photobucket and post a link to the doc't here on your thread.

[dhoom]

POC

 

The Claimant claims money judgement against Defendant pursuant to a limited guarantee of xxxxx.xx dated provided by Defendant for a ltd co.

 

The Claimant claims money judgement against Defendant in respect of their liability of a/c no.22222222 sort code 123456 formally account no.123456787 code 123456, for which a formal demand was issued in 2007 for the sum of £xxxxx.xx + interest £xxxx.xx.

 

The Claimant also claims interest on laibility until judgement or sooner at % £x.xx daily

 

AND THE CLAIMANT CLAIMS

 

The said sum £xxxxx.xx

 

Interest pursuant to guarantee £xxxxx.xx

 

Further Interest at rate from start of proceedings herein to judgement or sooner at daily rate of £x.xx

 

Costs.

[dhoom]

Guarantee

 

http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w267/abbccc_2007/optima.jpg

 

http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w267/abbccc_2007/optima2.jpg

 

http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w267/abbccc_2007/optima3.jpg

 

http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w267/abbccc_2007/optima4.jpg

 

http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w267/abbccc_2007/optima5.jpg

 

http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w267/abbccc_2007/optima6.jpg

 

http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w267/abbccc_2007/optima7.jpg

 

http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w267/abbccc_2007/optima8.jpg

[slick132]

Hi Dhoom,

 

In the first image, what amount, if any, appears at the foot of the doc't as "the specified amount".

 

In the last image, were all sections signed, witnessed, etc as necessary.

[dhoom]

Hi Dhoom,

 

In the first image, what amount, if any, appears at the foot of the doc't as "the specified amount". £35k

 

In the last image, were all sections signed, witnessed, etc as necessary.

 

the copy they supplied me was signed by me and witnessed, but their section was neither signed nor witnessed

 

...................................

[slick132]

Thanks Dhoom,

 

This has been flagged up and the Site Team will take a look. We'll get back to you asap but please be patient.

 

Now you've rec'd the Court claim brom Optima for the alleged debt, you MUST acknowledge the Claim within 14 days of Service - the form will specify when.

 

In the absence of any calculations as to how they arrive at the amount claimed, I think you should Defend the whole of the Claim.

 

You should get clear guidance on this in good time but it is YOUR responsibility to meet the Acknowledgement deadline.

[dhoom]

 

You should get clear guidance on this in good time but it is YOUR responsibility to meet the Acknowledgement deadline.

 

Thanks, I will acknowledge to give further time for defence.

[slick132]

Can you please confirm the actual figures that appear on the Claim against you so we have a better idea of the interest and charges the bank are claiming in addition to the £35K.

[dhoom]

amount claimed 35k actual + 4500 int +court fees + 100(solicitors cost)= 40k

 

Please note for obvious reasons I am not putting the exact amount and rounding off to the nearest.