Possibility of DCA's commit offence when attempting to collect time barred debt

[Matt5791]

Possibility of DCA's Committing an offence when attempting to collect a time barred debt.

 

Recently a DCA (McKenzie Hall) have been trying to collect a time barred debt from a relative. I am not concerned about this and the matter will be resolved sooner or later.

 

The main thrust of this thread is to examine the possibility of whether an offence can be committed by a DCA (or the debt owner) when they try to collect a time barred debt. The recent situation has got me thinking about this and by background in law (I have an honours degree in Law) leads me to believe there is a possibility that, in certain circumstances, this could be the case.

 

I believe that it could be possible to construe the attempted collection or actual collection, of a time barred debt as an offence under S.15 of the Theft Act 1968.

 

This reads:

 

15. Obtaining property by deception

(1) A person who by any deception dishonestly obtains property belonging to another,

with the intention of permanently depriving the other of it, shall on conviction on indictment be liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding ten years.

(2) For purposes of this section a person is to be treated as obtaining property if he obtains ownership, possession or control of it, and ‘obtain’ includes obtaining for another or enabling another to obtain or to retain.

(3) Section 6 above shall apply for purposes of this section, with the necessary

adaptation of the reference to appropriating, as it applies for purposes of section 1.

(4) For purposes of this section ‘deception’ means any deception (whether deliberate

or reckless) by words or conduct as to fact or as to law, including a deception as to the present intentions of the person using the deception or any other person.

Money can count as property.

 

Thus I believe this could be the case where:

 

1. The DCA has, dishonestly, persuaded the "debtor" there really is a debt outstanding (or has attempted to do so).

2. The DCA either knows or is reckless to the fact that the debt could be time barred.

 

I don't know if anyone else has ever considered this or, indeed, if there is any case law on this.

 

I have a number of friends from my university days who are now practicing criminal Barristers and Solicitors and I'm going to check this out and will report back when I know more.

 

Matt

[pt2537]

Hi there

 

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news

 

but S15 of the Theft Act 1968 was repealed by the Fraud Act 2006 and that offence no longer exists, in essence

 

 

 

regards

paul

[Matt5791]

Embarrassing - shows how long ago my law degree was. Which why I always advocate professional advise if feasable.

 

I suspect however the Fraud Act provides for a similar offence.

 

Is there anyone who is aware of any case law, concerning either the 06 or 68 Acts?

[rory32]

English Law (The Limitations Act) refers to an action not being able to be brought after the expiry of 6 years from the date of which the cause of action accrued. This does not mean that to ask for and receive payment on a statute barred debt is illegal or indeed unlawfull. To deceive someone that the debt is still subject to legal action however would be another issue. The position in Scots Law is very differently worded to that of English Law. In English Law the Act is worded for the person that can bring an action, in Scots Law it is worded for the person where an obligation may exist.

[ODC]

Possibility of DCA's Committing an offence when attempting to collect a time barred debt.

 

 

Recently a DCA (McKenzie Hall) have been trying to collect a time barred debt from a relative. I am not concerned about this and the matter will be resolved sooner or later.

 

The main thrust of this thread is to examine the possibility of whether an offence can be committed by a DCA (or the debt owner) when they try to collect a time barred debt. The recent situation has got me thinking about this and by background in law (I have an honours degree in Law) leads me to believe there is a possibility that, in certain circumstances, this could be the case.

 

I believe that it could be possible to construe the attempted collection or actual collection, of a time barred debt as an offence under S.15 of the Theft Act 1968.

 

This reads:

 

15. Obtaining property by deception

 

(1) A person who by any deception dishonestly obtains property belonging to another,

with the intention of permanently depriving the other of it, shall on conviction on indictment be liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding ten years.

(2) For purposes of this section a person is to be treated as obtaining property if he obtains ownership, possession or control of it, and ‘obtain’ includes obtaining for another or enabling another to obtain or to retain.

(3) Section 6 above shall apply for purposes of this section, with the necessary

adaptation of the reference to appropriating, as it applies for purposes of section 1.

(4) For purposes of this section ‘deception’ means any deception (whether deliberate

or reckless) by words or conduct as to fact or as to law, including a deception as to the present intentions of the person using the deception or any other person.

Money can count as property.

 

Thus I believe this could be the case where:

 

1. The DCA has, dishonestly, persuaded the "debtor" there really is a debt outstanding (or has attempted to do so).

2. The DCA either knows or is reckless to the fact that the debt could be time barred.

 

I don't know if anyone else has ever considered this or, indeed, if there is any case law on this.

 

I have a number of friends from my university days who are now practicing criminal Barristers and Solicitors and I'm going to check this out and will report back when I know more.

 

Matt

Just because a debt is Statute Barred does not mean it does not exist. It cannot be enforced through the Courts but the owner of the debt can still ask the debtor for payment. Of course in doing so he must not lead the debtor to believe that he has the power to enforce the debt

[Drexl Spivey]

Robinson Way would try and threaten me with the courts , they did so even after being told it was statute barred and was evident that I was aware of the law on this matter. I will miss them really, they were so stupid . They were fun to make complaints against .