Welcome Finance - missold PPI and part of loan

[Dipply75]

Hi all, am trying to pick up where I left off with my partners missold PPI on a welcome loan. Was starting to look into this when life went a bit haywire but it has annoyed me all along lol.

 

2 parts really - the first is that the PPI was definetely missold. Mr other half was told, point blank, he had to take the insurance or no loan. Company policy. The second thing is - he was told that they could not have 2 loans at the same address, so he would have to pay off the remainder of my loan also. (approx £1500 left i think). Thing is, I had applied as just me, my income only etc - a single application that he was not even mentioned on. HIS application was the same - single loan, based on his income etc only - but he had to pay off my loan as I lived in the same house as him? Different names etc (not married). So they have essentially made my o/s £1500 ish stretch over another 3 years at a million% interest. Can this be right???

 

She said it was company policy again - anyone have any light they can shed on this? To prove my point, in Oct 07 I phoned and asked for a loan and was accepted (I did not take it BTW!!!) - even though my partner still lives here and his loan is still ongoing - so whats the truth??

 

I intend to get my teeth right into this now, and all the other fights I have had to put on hold so any input eagerly accepted.

 

am off to enjoy an absolutely stunning scottish sunset now, not even welcome can spoil that lol

[hellhasnofury]

Hi all, am trying to pick up where I left off with my partners missold PPI on a welcome loan. Was starting to look into this when life went a bit haywire but it has annoyed me all along lol.

 

2 parts really - the first is that the PPI was definetely missold. Mr other half was told, point blank, he had to take the insurance or no loan. Company policy. The second thing is - he was told that they could not have 2 loans at the same address, so he would have to pay off the remainder of my loan also. (approx £1500 left i think). Thing is, I had applied as just me, my income only etc - a single application that he was not even mentioned on. HIS application was the same - single loan, based on his income etc only - but he had to pay off my loan as I lived in the same house as him? Different names etc (not married). So they have essentially made my o/s £1500 ish stretch over another 3 years at a million% interest. Can this be right???

 

She said it was company policy again - anyone have any light they can shed on this? To prove my point, in Oct 07 I phoned and asked for a loan and was accepted (I did not take it BTW!!!) - even though my partner still lives here and his loan is still ongoing - so whats the truth??

 

I intend to get my teeth right into this now, and all the other fights I have had to put on hold so any input eagerly accepted.

 

am off to enjoy an absolutely stunning scottish sunset now, not even welcome can spoil that lol

 

Hello and Welcome,(no pun intended:lol:)

 

That is a very strange company policy to have, what if you/he were just lodgers:eek: not all people who live at the same address are together, so I can't see how they can do that, but then again we are talking about Welcome. If you read threads on them, you will understand their tactics.

 

Have you send a SAR for get all information relating to this loan, if the loan was taken out over the telephone, you need copies of the recordings:grin:

 

The SAR template you will find in the ppi sticky section. Get it send off and wait for the info to come.

 

If you need advice or help just ask:grin:

[itsmeandonlyme]

Hey Dip,

Is it any chance you can post the copy of your agreement here or email it to me?

 

Thank you

 

M

[fergal71]

hi its me would you mind if I pm you a copy of my agreement with welcome to see if you think if it is invalid and I can claim. it is over 6 years old. ????

[Dipply75]

Hey guys, thanks for the start offs, congratulations Itsme BTW! I read about your victory, nice one. All that work you (and others) did has just paved the way for all us - much appreciated lol

 

Will send SAR off asap and take it from there, will also get agreements scanned in if anyone can glance over them. Will have to do a bit of maths (scary :o) but I am sure they stung us with the early settlement calculations too, don't think any rebate was applied at all.

 

I do remember looking into the insurance part as my agreements listed underwritten by Norwich Union, who had no record of working with Welcome at all, but never got digging much further. For those who do have quick look over before signing, seeing a reputable company like Norwich listed would look so legit.

 

This has bugged me for so long now, I 'welcome' the fight (soz, cheesy but I love it )

 

Thanks guys, or gals!

[itsmeandonlyme]

Hey Dip,

 

Thank you so much...

 

Let me know when you receive a copy of your agreement..

 

 

 

M

[Dipply75]

Hey all, had a thought last night regarding the shady way this loan was sold. When my partner was told 'you cannot have 2 loans at the same address - company policy etc' and he had to pay off mine, did they break any of the privacy and/or data protection laws?

 

Our names are completely different, both single applications with no mention of a partner, any other income or anything, just the same address, yet they told him I had a loan with them (I hadn't told him about it previously), how much I borrowed, confirmed my FULL name and d.o.b. and how much was outstanding!

 

To me, this is my personal financial information that they just blabbed away to someone who (as hellhasnofury points out) could have just been a lodger, or even my landlord or someone. To be honest, doesn't matter if it was my mother, they still have no right to do that!

 

To then let him take action on the account as well - all completely without my knowledge or say so, can they possibly do this??

 

Can't believe I haven't thought of this until now - amazing what red wine done for the synapses :grin:

[hellhasnofury]

Hey all, had a thought last night regarding the shady way this loan was sold. When my partner was told 'you cannot have 2 loans at the same address - company policy etc' and he had to pay off mine, did they break any of the privacy and/or data protection laws?

 

Our names are completely different, both single applications with no mention of a partner, any other income or anything, just the same address, yet they told him I had a loan with them (I hadn't told him about it previously), how much I borrowed, confirmed my FULL name and d.o.b. and how much was outstanding!

 

To me, this is my personal financial information that they just blabbed away to someone who (as hellhasnofury points out) could have just been a lodger, or even my landlord or someone. To be honest, doesn't matter if it was my mother, they still have no right to do that!

 

To then let him take action on the account as well - all completely without my knowledge or say so, can they possibly do this??

 

Can't believe I haven't thought of this until now - amazing what red wine done for the synapses :grin:

 

Oh yes, this justs get better, they made him pay off your loan, would he pay off mine please:lol:

 

Write back to them and point out the serious error of their ways, threaten you will report them to the Information Commissioners Office, for a breach of the Data Protection Act, divulging your personal details to a third party. They have also violated your basic human rights in doing this.

 

Also mention unfair business practices, and you will be reporting them to trading standards, office of fair trading and the financial services authority. That may or may not make them pull their finger out and sit up and take a bit of notice.

And then definately report them:grin:

[Dipply75]

Just had a conversation with the Information Commissioners office and I have to say I am absolutely disgusted. Apparently, because the breach of the DPA act happened more than a year ago they would not normally look into the case! :o

 

I asked them to define 'first aware of the breach' as is that when I was aware my details were passed on, or when I was aware this was actually wrong/unlawful/whatever? Advisor said I knew in jan 06 when my partner took the loan out. BUT I DID NOT KNOW IT WAS WRONG!!! naively, yes, but they made it sound so legit (as they do). company policy etc. :mad:

 

So basically I am now being penalised because I was not aware of the ins and outs of the DPA at the time. That is disgusting. Welcome thrive on taking advantage of peoples LACK of knowledge and the ICO are now essentially backing them up by only giving folk a year to find out (or be told) there was a problem! After that....tough cookies. Either there was a breach or not. It is unfair to just assume that everyone has a working knowledge of all the laws involved in a financial transaction.

 

I am completely happy to see them in court if the ICO shrugs their shoulders of all responsobility. There, rant and rave over. sorry!

[hellhasnofury]

No problem, you rant and rave all you like, it can be quite theraputic:rolleyes: I do it all the time. Just channel all of that tension into catching them out one way or another:D

 

I would send a letter to the ICO and ask for an explanation regarding the conversation and advice they have given about a ??????year:???: and why they will not investigate this breach of the DPA, of welcome discussing your personal details with a third party.

 

Have you spoken to the Financial Ombudsman regarding this matter

[Dipply75]

Hi guys

 

Sorry for the delay, I had to concentrate on whooping British Gas's butt, duly done! i didn't send my complaint as I decided to have a good look through everything and have now spent weeks trying to compose a complaint for ALL the issues I have discovered.

 

Have just seen Sparkelz thread and nearly peed myself laughing, there are so many similarities, not to mention number of problems. I will write a list soon but for starters:

 

The DPA breach already mentioned above

The missold PPI - above

Partners contract is monthly but he pays weekly. If he missed a weekly payment he ALWAYS paid within 2 days but they have charged him late payment fees etc!

His interest rate doesn't seem to check out

My 1st insurances had T&Cs on the schedule stating if I did not complete a schedule of cover form thing, I wasn't covered. does anyone fill in ANYTHING when getting a welcome loan or PPI?! paid and was never even covered.

Never got any rebates on PPI when settling loans early

My loan agreement states 24 payments of £141 p/m, muppet in office then phones me a week later to say oops, messed the figures up, its actually £156 p/m, that ok best friend? Niave me said ok. Very dodgy goings on there - will explain later

My credit file shows only £141 p/m being paid and last payment late - was not!

 

Theres more but for gods sake. Now BG have been butt kicked I want this to have my full attention. Will scan agreements 2moro if someone could have a look over and give me opinions/laughs?

 

Any help much appreciated, thanks!

[Fluffy Viper]

Hi Dipply75. I should probably start my own thread with this question but does your partners weekly payments equal his monthly one? I pay £50 p/w (I find this much easier and Welcome gave me the option of doing this after I found monthly payments difficult on a previous loan) but my monthly payment is £200 p/m so over a year I pay £2600 whereas if I paid monthly I would pay £2400. I have missed one weekly payment but I did not incur any charges as I was in front. This also means that I will pay the loan off 3 months early over the 4 year term so will I get a reduction in interest accordingly? If anyone else can comment on this please do (and if a moderator wants to put this in its own thread please do).

[Sparklez30]

Hi Dipply see you are having fun with Welcome too - I'm hoping my friends battle is almost over now! I couldn't believe just how much was wrong with her dealings with them - I most certainly would not recommend Welcome Finance to my friends!!

 

Hows your complaint coming along? If you rescheduled you might want to check their statements as they took an overpayment from my friend and would never have "found" their error had we not questioned it!

 

 

@ Fluffy I don't know the answer to your question but from my limited dealings with them I would say its unlikely?? A seperate thread might be wise to stop your question getting lost!

[Fluffy Viper]

Ok. Thanks Sparklez.

[Dipply75]

Hi Fluffy Viper, sorry, kids been ill (all at the same goddam time!) so ltd time on my pooter!

 

Ah, the weekly/monthly payments thing....well, in HONESTY you should pay the loan earlier therefore less interest - but I have no doubt that it wouldn't work this way with Welcome. My partners loan was over 36months @ £212.44 per month and they are taking £53.11 per week - so they HAVE just divided by 4, like you. I think they would continue taking payments until the 36 months was up - thats a big difference.

 

Not sure how to prove that intention though - maybe an early settlement statement would show this up?

 

too tired for straight thinking - or sums lol!

 

Let us know when you start a thread, will subscribe ; )

Edited June 6, 2008 by Dipply75
forgetting stuff

[Dipply75]

Hi Sparklez - still working on that VVV long letter - have decided to send all to the head office and just send a request for an early settlement statement and statement of account - see abpve - to the branch at the same time.

 

I could not believe how many similarities there were between your friends complaint and ours! Will keep you updated as I don't expect this to be easy - even if just for the comedic value!

 

Thanks ; )

[Fluffy Viper]

Thanks Dipply. I have started a thread with this question, its on "Other Institutions", headed "Welcome Finance-Weekly payments". I would put a link here but I haven't figured out how to do that yet.

[Sparklez30]

I see Dipply already found your other thread but just in case anyone else is interested the link is

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/other-institutions/146888-welcome-finance-weekly-payments.html

 

I can't wait to hear how your claim goes Dipply - the letter I posted up was one of many we sent and I believe the longest was 7 pages long lol. SOmetimes I get a bit carried away when I'm complaining

[Dipply75]

Hi all. Well after much deliberation methinks I'll be going the whole hog on this one, insurance especially. Turns out Welcome are a member of the finance and leasing assoc and their code of practice makes interesting reading, especially for a welcome victim....

 

As far as I am concerned I paid for a policy that I was never covered for - going by their T&C's - and have serious doubts it even existed. Norwich Union are listed as the insurer so I will be complaining to them about Welcomes behaviour and advice - It states clearly that Welcome were authorised to sell the insurance on Norwich's behalf (my old agreement).

 

Any Welcome customers are welcome (sorry, so cheesey lol) to read this code of practice and play 'did they or didn't they' for their loans/PPI etc. Different codes depending on the year you signed

 

FLA :: Consumer finance :: Consumer Codes of Practice

 

Really really will get stuff scanned in etc - sorry.

[fergal71]

I have been stung by welcome with insurances not claimed to be PPI but claiming to be warranty and breakdown cover for car.... has anybody had this... IT is PPI in a different coat... I may ask who provides this insurance... as I am sure it is not welcome... it probably never existed...

[Dipply75]

Hi Fergal

 

The Finance Leasing assoc codes of practice state that when Welcome sell you insurance, they will tell you who the insurer is (lol).

 

To me (and in my T&C's) you should be able to demand who the insurer is - as they are responsible for shoddy selling/advice of their brokers, so you need to know who to complain to! they would also be a joint data controller. I will be complaining to Norwich Union for one of mine, the other is a mystery also.

 

You could try a complaint to the FLA, maybe they can get the info from Welcome for you? (Guessing, have not dealt with them yet myself)

 

Did you get any policy stuff from them at all? I take it you had no choice in your 'warranty' etc as usual and they were useless anyhoo?

 

My policy was a bit of useless paper telling me basically - I had a policy, but the T&C's were very interesting reading.

[Dipply75]

Well, they've gone a step too far now. Apparently the manager at the branch that was responsible for all this has now left - discovered this when the new manager called my partners WORK and THEN his mobile to advise they accidentally canx his direct debit in MARCH! So there is now a large amount outstanding - although we couldn't send a single letter or call once in 3 months - what would he like to do about it :o

 

OH says, well nothing just now until I am sure the bank hasn't paid you anything - while I have you on the phone there is a little matter of late payment charges - I pay weekly on a monthly contract so I cannot be late for 1 weekly payment. Manager states, we will look at those and will refund any due - but about this money.....Friday? You will phone me friday? 12pm on friday? We need to discuss this on Friday (this goes on for a while).

 

He states he CANNOT put the account in dispute as he needs a date it is in dispute until . As my OH psychic powers were off he obviously couldn't, so the friday thing started again. The emotional blackmail starts then - my bosses are on my back, I have to tell them, not my fault, they need answers or I will be in trouble etc (is this against the new CPUT regs by any chance?)

 

I am just waiting on the 'if you are behind we can re-finance the loan' thing. I have told him NOT TO SPEAK to them again but I know him - he may not be able to help himself - so he has agreed to record the call. Question - does he HAVE to state he may be recording or not???

 

OH gets peeved and says I want a copy of your complaints procedure, a statement of account and and early settlement statement. THEN he will compare with bank statements, determine what he owes and what charges are to be refunded and take it from there. Once we agree THEN the dispute will be over.

 

Manager makes a point of saying (and I quote) - you do know that if I have to come to your house I will charge you £25 a visit. OH tells him he has no permission to visit and this will not be tolerated - manager LAUGHS at him and says he can if he wants:mad:..........WELL mr manager - if you visit, you'll get ME. Not the once niave me - the older, wiser, ready to wipe the floor with you ME. Am going to print off a copy of the relevant laws and codes and keep them handy in case they do visit, I can give them these and tell them to toddle off and train themselves.:grin:

 

Sending today - CCA request, letter stating a/c in dispute and why, contact only in writing, harassment letter and full S.A.R.

 

Also demand to know if OH credit file been marked with late payments etc.

 

I have hormones today - buggers are getting it:mad: :mad::mad:

[Dipply75]

OMG - post has just arrived with a squint copy of their complaints procedure - that was damn quick for them lol

[Dipply75]

Drafted this up - will include the big long list of complaints with it - any thoughts would be appreciated!

 

Please be advised that I will only communicate with you in writing, therefore any calls made to me or my workplace will be classed as harassment and treated as such.

 

Should it be your intention to arrange any “doorstep calls” or “home visits” please be advised that under OFT rules, you can only visit me at my home if you make an appointment and I have no wish to make an appointment with you.

 

As per OFT guidelines Section 2.12 f: “visiting or threatening to visit a debtor without prior agreement when the debt is deadlocked or disputed”

 

There is only an implied license under English Common Law for people to be able to visit me on my property without express permission; the postman and people asking for directions etc (Armstrong v. Sheppard and Short Ltd [1959] 2 Q.B. per Lord Evershed M.R.). Therefore take note that I revoke license under Common Law for you, or your representatives to visit me at my property and if you do so, then you will be liable to damages for a tort of trespass and action will be taken, including but not limited to, police attendance.

 

I am disputing the total value of this debt with Welcome Finance due to charges applied to my account with no contractual provision to do so, and for the reasons details in my complaint – enclosed. As such, therefore, I consider this account to be in dispute and no further action shall be taken until this matter is resolved.

 

I look forward to your written confirmation that this account is formally in dispute. I have received your complaints procedure, which I intend to follow, therefore you assertion that you cannot place and account in dispute unless I commit to a date the dispute will end is unfair, impossible to predict and misleading.

 

Failure to correspond in writing only, hold this account in dispute or continue to chase for payment, however, will see the matter referred to Trading Standards, The OFT and any other authorities as I see fit and without further notice:

 

As per OFT guidelines Section 2.8k "not ceasing collection activity whilst investigating a reasonably queried or disputed debt."

I am extremely concerned at the motive behind contacting my workplace before attempting to make any contact with me personally regarding Welcome Finances mistake with the Direct Debit and the resulting outstanding balance. Had a single letter been sent or phone call been made to me directly I would have answered promptly, as you will see from your records, I have always done. Therefore the only reason I can assume from your actions was to publicly embarrass me for no apparent reason. As my position at work requires a large amount of trust and various security requirements, you have risked my employment and caused embarrassing questions to be asked by my employer by implying I have debts I am hiding from (creditor having to resort to contacting employer raises this implication alone).

 

As per OFT guidelines Section 2.6 i: “disclosing or threatening to disclose debt details to third parties unless legally entitled to do so

As per OFT guidelines Section 2.6 j: “acting in a way likely to be publicly embarrassing to the debtor either deliberately or through lack of care”

 

Therefore, I will be registering a serious complaint with the OFT, Trading Standards and the Information Commissioner regarding this. Please confirm your reasons for this action and what was discussed when you contacted my workplace, which I will confirm with my employer.

 

In summary:

Please note that all communication must now be in writing.

I am placing this account formally in dispute (see enclosed complaint) – please confirm this has been actioned and that no attempts at collection will be made until this is resolved.

I do not give you permission to visit my home, or to contact my workplace again.

Please clarify why contact was made to my workplace when no attempt was made to contact me personally for 3 months.

Please clarify what was discussed during this phone call.

 

As I wish to expedite matters, should you have any queries or require further information please include this in your response and I will reply promptly.

 

 

Yours sincerely

[Dipply75]

If I can post the credit agreement signed, could someone have look over it please?

 

I will then put on the statement they supplied - to me its v different from the agreement