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need advice re enhanced crb checks


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hi all i have been working in a pre school for three months now and they have given me the form to fill in for an enhanced crb check. well thats fine i have no criminal convictions but my eldest daughter managed to escaped out of our garden when she was two and i had to call the police , they found her within minutes but i had a letter from my local county council saying the police had passed my details on to them and that they would be keeping the incident on record (although i rang up and said why would you do that is was just a big accident that was one of those things and they said it is standard procedure and that it cant be removed) well now i am worried as will it show up and if so in what format as i would rather they disclosed exactly what happened other than just putting bumph about my family being on the councils records, i cant remember which department the letter came from as it was a long time ago now! any advice would be greatly appreciated!

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Hi there, if you are concerned about what information will be disclosed on the crb check you can ring the Criminal Records Bureau information line on

0870 90 90 811 or visit their website at Criminal Records Bureau - Home Page. They will be able to answer any questions you have about your particular situation.

 

Kind Regards

 

Ell-enn

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hi i have been on the website but it is no help at all will try ringing them i have also emailed the council to ask for there opinion, i cant understand why the would want to keep something so trivial on record as its not like im a bleedin paedophile or anything is it!"! infact i remembering being fuming when the letter arrived as i felt like i was being treated like a criminal she got out of the garden by standing on her bike and climbing over the fence !

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CRB check is just that - a criminal records bureau check. if you do not have criminal convictions, it will nto matter what the council have on file.

 

Unfortunately, this works both ways for those people who are known to put children at risk and yet have not been convicted of an offence.

 

I would rest easy about it - the council had a duty to keep a record so taht they could build up a picture in case your child was ever deemed to be neglected or at risk.

 

By the way, i have a two year old and know exactly what they can be like, and so will anyone else who's ever had a two year old, so it isn't a big deal - just a safety net for the child in case any instances of supposed neglect happened.

All help is merely my opinion only - please seek legal advice if you need to as I am only qualified in SEN law.

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Tiglet is correct - as far as I am aware, unless you have been convicted of a crime or received a formal police caution, then your check will come back OK. A friend of mine applied for a job with the prison service and was worried that a conviction for not having road tax would show up, the crb check came back fine, so I'm sure you have nothing to worry about. If you want to put your mind at rest completely, give them a ring and enquire.

 

Kind Regards

 

Ell-enn

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I don't wish to alarm the OP but it is an enhanced check that she will be undertaking.

 

One doesn't necessarily have to have a criminal record for information to be included in it.

 

For instance, arrests & fingerprinting are often kept on police file even if you never get charged, let alone convicted.

 

And it appears it was actually the police who contacted the council originally with the OP's details to put on record. One could assume that the police also decided to keep this record too.

 

Also, in Ellenn's example, it could be that a conviction for no car tax is just not a barrier to working in the prison service.

 

However, a record on file with a council social services, and most probably with the police, about one's own child may be a problem when applying to work with other children. (These have been tightened further since Ian Huntely)

 

I'd get advice on how to fill in the form as there is a section which asks you to declare anything that may be of interest to the particular job you are applying for.

 

It's a tough one. Should you declare something that needn't have been declared or should you have just in case it shows up?

 

As this scenario itself can also be recorded on the check for future reference!

 

Good luck but speak to someone before completing it.

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Just to put Weird Al's information into context, although it is true that information is disclosed where it is considered relevant, it is not automatic, nor is it a given that such information would be a bar to employment. I know of two cases which would support this.

 

1. Somebody who left their two children in a car whilst they went into a shop. Came out to find the Police radioing details of the vehicle in, and although no action was taken, the matter was reported to Child Protection. That individual has since had an enhanced CRB and gained employment with vulnerable adults.

2. Almost an identical case to the OP, where a five year old wandered off and was brought home by the Police having been found almost a mile away. Same child also fell out of a window after climbing onto the window ledge. Reported to Social Services. Mother has had an enhanced CRB to work in a Primary School.

 

Those are cases involving the Police (and since Soham), but I remember my sister managed to drop my neice over the banisters whilst carrying her downstairs, which resulted in a follow up from Social Services after hospital treattment. She is now a Deputy head of a Primary school :eek:

 

One hears horror stories, but assuming that judgement is exercised, if the matter was recorded then I firmly believe that it would not be considered a barrier to employment.

Any advice given is done so on the assumption that recipients will also take professional advice where appropriate.

 

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I'd agree with Sidewinder on this.

 

However, information of this nature by the police has shown to be of a very grey area though.

 

I firmly believe this to be a database of an individual that, as the public, we never know what is actually contained and have no access to.

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god what should i do then lol i have filled it in and my sister is my supervisor and has assured me its nothing to worry about, i emailed the council and they have said i have to apply to them for details they hold on me which is useless as i already know this but obviously the police forwarded the info so do they possibly still have it i can apply for subject access etc but that could take upto 40 working days and cant hold of that long giving them my crb form can i !!

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Personally I would just send the form in and try to be confident. The problem is that the CRB and Police will never disclose the precise nature of what they include or don't include, as this might provide somebody with ill-intent sufficient information to avoid detection. The mystery is sufficient to dissuade many predatory individuals from even thinking about trying to get a job with children for fear of failing the CRB.

 

I firmly believe that you have nothing to be unduly worried about. Think about the SAR if and only if there is a need to at a later date.

Any advice given is done so on the assumption that recipients will also take professional advice where appropriate.

 

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hi all just spoke to crb and they said the only search on me not children in my family and never search any forms of council or local authority firms etc i told them about police being involved and he said not to worry and there is no need to mention it on my applications xx

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i am just being a panic merchant lol just my job and college is going really well and i am the ultimate pessimist!! thanks all for your great help xx

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Hi, that's great news - I was confident you wouldn't have a problem but I'm glad you phoned them and put your mind at rest.

 

Good luck for the future with your job & college course.

 

Kind Regards

 

Ell-enn

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My advice is based on my opinion and experience only. It is not to be taken as legal advice - if you are unsure you should seek professional help.

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aahh thanks youer all so nice!! just had a couple of terrible years and its all going well for a change!! i was on a programme called help me love my baby in december dont know if any of you watched it? i had terrible post natal depression and had a years worth of therapy in london with my daughter xxx

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  • 2 months later...

Hi Todd58, Yes unfortunatley it does. I have a record for various minor offences that then resulted in a short spell inside as a 'Short Sharp Shock' treatment. It worked! Since then I have been in only one bit of trouble which was a drink drive (No I'm not proud of that) and that was 9 years ago. It is 20 years ago when I was last in trouble of any sort other than that. I recently had a CRB check done for a job as a chef in a care home and it came up with everything I had done since I was 18 including a 'Urinating on a Public Highway' on my 18th birthday! I didn't get that job but a few weeks later I was having a drink with a local in my local pub who told me the story about myself! He did not know it was me he was talking about because he did not know my second name but he retailed my convictions. His wife is a friend of the owner of the care home I applied to. I TOTALLY AGREE we need some sort of CRB check but this is crazy. I have no convictions which relate to violence, drugs, children or 'vanenrable people' How can people as myself and especially young people get past their past. It comes back to bite them. If we want young people to stop re offending we need to give them a chance. All of my convictions are 'Spent'. I am now a 40 something guy, homeowner, hardworking person married to a doctor. If anything I would be the sort of person you could point at and say 'look kid, you can turn your life around. It's not too late' I enjoy my life now and am glad I have done something with it but for goodness sake, give me a chance! and all the others out there who really do want to give it a go.

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Not all Formal Police Cautions will show up on Enhanced disclosures, it depends when they were given.

Many Police Forces destroyed records of cautions after a set amount of time including the entry on the PNC.

Although that has now changed i believe.

 

Certainly my 2 cautions i received as a teenager do not appear on my enhanced disclosure.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I agree with padfoot I have an enhanced crb and worried about a certain event when I was arrested but never charged but the crb came back clean, personally I wouldnt worry bout it

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I believe the original idea for the crb was to protect children since then theyve gone mad and you need them in lots of places that have contact with public, its bureacracy gone mad, they aint worth the paper they are written on, plus, people with spent convictions that do not involve children, violence, etc should not have their previousl spent convictions divulged, its about time the law was changed to take this into account

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  • 1 month later...

My 13 year old daughter went through a wild faze and because I grounded her she left the house at 2am in the morning and told her friends mum that I hit her. The police came around to talk about it and realised that my daughter is out of control and I never hit her. I was devastated that she said that. Since then my daughter has now turned into a lovely caring girl because I pulled her away from her gang mates. They did not prosicute me, they left it alone. Would this be on the crb check. thanks

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My 13 year old daughter went through a wild faze and because I grounded her she left the house at 2am in the morning and told her friends mum that I hit her. The police came around to talk about it and realised that my daughter is out of control and I never hit her. I was devastated that she said that. Since then my daughter has now turned into a lovely caring girl because I pulled her away from her gang mates. They did not prosicute me, they left it alone. Would this be on the crb check. thanks

 

It would possibly be on an enhanced CRB check.

 

An enhanced check will list 'other Police intelligence' as well as convictions.cautions, etc.

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plus, people with spent convictions that do not involve children, violence, etc should not have their previousl spent convictions divulged, its about time the law was changed to take this into account

 

 

Just who do you think it is divulged to?

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