CL Finance Claimform - Old HSBC Managed Loan **WON CASE STRUCK OUT**

[Goldlady]

Mine is due by the 31st but as yet not enough paperwork to do a full defence either.

[master woody]

Ok Time for my defence I’ve had a go at making one my self from other posts. Any guidance would be much appreciated, I need to get my defence in by Thursday but planning on doing it on Wednesday, due to family commitments.

One of the things I’d like to ask is why have CL not used the Loan reference? They have used my bank account and sort code, is this OK? The referenced account has a 3.5K negative balance and HSBC has sold it to another DCA,

its Currently stayed (OFT) as I’m claiming 3.2K bank charges back! Is this relevant?

I’m currently paying £15X pounds a moth through payplan to this debt

Thanks for your support and help

 

 

IN THE XXXXXXXX COUNTY COURT CLAIM NUMBER XXXXXXXX

BETWEEN:

CL FINANCE LIMITED

Claimant

And

Woody

Defendant

 

DEFENCE

 

 

1. On 7 January 2008 CL FINANCE LIMITED commenced proceedings against the defendant for £XXXX plus interest, a debt allegedly incurred under a credit agreement between the defendant and HSBC Bank PLC 2. The Claimant states the debt was assigned them by a deed of assignment dated 28 September 2007.

3. The defendant does not admit or deny the debt, but puts the claimant to strict proof thereof.

4. The defendant has not received a valid notice of assignment for the alleged debt from the original creditor and therefore put the claimant to strict proof that privity of contract exists between the claimant and Defendant.

6. The claimant’s solicitors were requested by letter dated 17 January 2008 to produce the following various documents under Part 18.1 of the Civil Procedure Rules viz., a copy of the executed credit agreement, a true copy of the alleged assignment and any default notice from the original creditor together with some form of proof of postage that this notice was sent to the correct address and was served with the proper notice before this claim was submitted.

7. To date, the claimant’s solicitors have not acknowledged the request, nor responded in any way nor supplied the requested documentation.

8. The defendant has not received a copy of any default notice from the claimant, and asks that the claimant provides the court with a true copy of such a notice, and with some form of proof of postage that this notice was sent to the correct address and was served with the proper notice before this claim was submitted.

AND the defendant

9. seeks an order that the claimant’s action is struck out or otherwise is dismissed on the grounds that any claim cannot be enforced following the claimant’s default in failing to supply a true copy of the executed credit agreement as required by S78 (1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

10. In the alternative, the defendant respectfully asks the court to order the disclosure of the credit agreement, notice of default in the form required by the Consumer Credit Act 1974, and notice of assignment in the form required by the Law of Property Act 1925. The defendant also requests that the court order the claimant to disclose a list of all charges made to the account and a list of the costs associated with each charge for the last 6 years in order for them to prove that the debt amounts to the amount claimed.

11. The defendant also respectfully asks the permission of the court to amend this defence when the above documents are provided by the claimant.

[master woody]

PS

 

Not a word from CL Finance, as of yet

[master woody]

bump

[linz2011]

Just wishing you luck been to court with these clowns and due to go again on 18th Feb you will be fine

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collectors-debt-collection/121414-court-date-12th-december.html

[master woody]

Starting to worry now, only one day left and rereading my defence I have very little knowledge, even if this is the right stage to summit my full defence?

Definitely starting to lose the plot a bit

Do you have a set amount of charters on money claim web site , I remember this from my bank claim days…will my defence fit?

Any help or pointer to threads most welcome

[Curlyben]

Woody, looks good for the moment.

You have put the ball firmly in CL's hands and they either comply or risk having the claim struck out.

After all without the agreement they are relying on there is NO case to answer.

[Goldlady]

Woody I think your defence is fine. I have sent a letter to the court saying I can't submit a defence as they haven't sent me the information I requested, but wish I had done something like your defence instead. I think you should go with it.

[master woody]

sweet, feeling better

 

basical this is all down CL's end game of a charging order, well they can F*R*O

 

i'm willing to pay in fact a want to pay but not on cls terms...

 

thanks all

[renegotiation]

Good luck Woody.

[master woody]

I’ve had a reply from CL saying we don’t have to give you any information the information in the claim should be enough to file a defence.

All they have sent is the paper work from HSBC regarding the sale of the debt to them (with the incorrect account number).

No Statements

No copy of the Consumer credit agreement

No list of changes ect

No complaints procedure

No deeds of assignments

I’d like to send the court a complaints letter. Saying CL are try to frustrate my defence. ( I remember seeing a template for this, anyone got it to hand?)

Any thoughts…

[master woody]

anyone?

[Goldlady]

Woody I couldn't find anything when I needed to tell the court that they had not supplied the information for me to supply a full defence. In the end I just sent a brief note to the court telling them so. You could do the same and enclose a copy of the letter they sent saying they are not obliged to give you any information.

 

Incidentally I do think that your charges claim is highly relevant if you have not brought that into the proceedings yet. Hopefully someone will come along and point you in the direction of the letter - I know I have seen it somewhere too:confused:

[storm]

Hi

 

Just to give you some support, I also am dealing with this lot for a second time

 

Last year their claim was succesfully struck out, when they didn't submit any documents and didn't turn up in court

 

I am now dealing with another claim of their's for my wife and have recieved the same response as you so far, saying they are not obliged to supply documents under CPR rules

 

I have done the defence accordingly

[master woody]

 

 

 

I have done the defence accordingly

 

Do you mean, the same defence as mine? I think i have a very strong case as they have used the incorrect account number ie they have used my current account not the loan account number.

 

could you please tell me what happens next? Am I waiting for court papers or a court date or some directions from the court...

 

Storm are you still paying?

[master woody]

just found this thread http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/108467-basic-introduction-consumer-credit.html

 

Its answered my questions!!! top thread a must read for all in my boat!

 

CAG helps agian, defo going to give CAG a donation when i can afford it!

[master woody]

Good news, Just had a phone call from Cohen.

Their now receiving payments from my DMP and look like there backing down.

Conversation when like this:

HC “would You consent to us stopping action as you have defended”

Woody ” you’re the ones taking me to court if you wish to stop that’s up to you but I will as, I have also done continue to make payments.”

HC “so will you consent? “

Woody “consent to what?”

HC “To us stopping any further legal action”

Woody “Ye Ok you send me what you want me to sign and I’ll take a look”

HC “Ok Thanks Mr woody bye bye”

BTW she was a really nice

Has anyone got any comments……

[pt2537]

main thing is be careful what you sign, they do not need your consent to discontinue proceedings since they are bringing them they can discontinue at anytime

[ginnever]

I’ve had a reply from CL saying we don’t have to give you any information the information in the claim should be enough to file a defence.

 

All they have sent is the paper work from HSBC regarding the sale of the debt to them (with the incorrect account number).

 

No Statements

No copy of the Consumer credit agreement

No list of changes ect

No complaints procedure

No deeds of assignments

 

I’d like to send the court a complaints letter. Saying CL are try to frustrate my defence. ( I remember seeing a template for this, anyone got it to hand?)

 

Any thoughts…

 

I requested information under the CPR rules & today I have received a similar response from CL saying-

 

We have been in contact with our solicitors HC who have advised that we are not obligded to provide this information and would advise that the particulars of claim detailed om the cc form should be sufficent to allow you to respond accordingly.

 

Having said that we have been in contact with opur predecessors GE money & have been able to obtain certain information which is enclosed herewith.

 

They have sent a copy of the credit agreement CC act 1974 page 1 of 3

Which is signed by me, however no date against my signature,

A signature for GE money which you can't tell whose signed and again no date.

 

A copy of the deed of assignment 5 pages dated on the front the 16th May 2007 a scribbled signature on the back. This is the first time I have ever seen one of these...

Also a set of copy statements ranging from Mar 02 to May 07 however not complete as there are some statements missing...

 

How would you proceed from here as CL have not complied fully with my request under CPR?

[Goldlady]

Aha - missing statements - they have failed to provide a mere 26 months worth of statements for our account:o. Seems they had a computer cock up. I think you need to post up the alleged agreement for the experts to look at.

 

On our case I sent the court a letter saying GE had not complied with our CPR request as the aforementioned statements were missing. We have had an order from the court today saying that we have to do our best at submitting a defence in spite of the missing information.

[ginnever]

thanks goldlady

 

Sorry to burst in on someone else thread but if you look at my post cohen & my property it will give you some background to my case...

 

however I haven't paid anyone & didn't pay on the court order as I didn't believe that CL muppets have any claim to the debt... obviously I now know different ....although I am going to get slapped I am not taking the first slap easily..

[master woody]

I’ve got my letter from Cohen:

 

They want me to sign a document Called a “Consent order” the deal is I Keep paying them at XXXX a month. I'm not sure what this is ....co

 

 

In their letter they state:

 

“A Consent Order is an agreement WITHOUT a County court Judgment being made between the Claimant and Yourself, therefore, there will be no public information registered against you upon the county court judgment register in respect of this claim”

 

The consent Isn’t a court document. Looks like something knocked up in word. They want be to sign three copies of this:

 

In the court of XXXXXXX

Claim number

Between CL finance Claimant

And Woody Defendant

 

It states By consent:

 

• the parties having agreed terms of statement the schedule attached hereto, all further proceedings in this action by stayed save for the purpose of carrying into effect the terms in schedule hereto

• there be no order as to costs

 

• Liberty to apply

Schedule

 

The defendat do pay the claimant the sum of £XXXX.XX per month by instalments of £xxx.xx commencing one month from the date of this order

 

Signed: Claimment

 

Signed: Dedendent

 

Date: xx February 2008

 

 

 

Not sure what to do, do you think I should sign. I always had full intention of paying all my debts in full. And this looks like a return to the status quo

 

What are the implications of me signing this??? willing to fight on put would like some advice

[linz2011]

Personally I would not sign this - they have not got a leg to stand on - I would take it all the way - I have won three times with these and you can do the same - why commit to this when it is them that have not got the information required - if you refuse they have to provide the info for it to go to court and they cannot therefore it will be struck out and your monthly payment will be in your pocket not theirs

 

Good luck:)

[master woody]

I agree, put i want/need a zero balance i don't want this hanging around for years to come....

 

Thinking about sending a letter saying i will contine to pay if they do a

discontinues....

[Darren]

Dont sign it. It could be a trick, they may continue with court and try to use it as an admission of the alleged debt