Blemain Finance pre-2005, Rule of 78 and Charges

[Missy06]

I've checked the info sent to me by Blemain Finance and it appears I definately didn't pay for any PPI......bang goes my dream of a new car for Christmas!.....but have they calculated all these figures properly? Can anyone help? The calculations are on the following pages.

 

 

For page 1 click here and page 2 is here. The statement is here.

 

 

Can any of you 'Rule of 78' Guru's work out if they've calculated this correctly?

[Missy06]

From the info in the letter BF sent, I was charged:

 

1) Default Interest(for non / late payment) = 21.17

2) Legal & Documentation Fee = 585.00

3) Redemption Administration = 58.75

4) Collection Costs = 352.50

 

They say that the Legal and Documentation Fee is " ....non-interest bearing and covers all costs incurred during the underwriting process associated with the loan.." They say they "..defer payment of this amount until either early settlement or the end of the loan".

Steven4064 has kindly informed me that I can claim 1) and 4) so that's my homework for the weekend! Apparantly, I just need to follow the 'reclaiming charges route'. i.e. send them the spreadsheet, send Prelim in 14 days, LBA within another 14 days and then court if necessary.

 

Is there anyone else out there in my same situation?

[greedfighter]

Missy, the legal and documentation fee is £585.00 - I would ask them to break this down - Your legal disbursements are about £60.00 to register the charge on your property and £25.00 to carry out a bankruptcy search.These would be your only legal disbursements and are fixed price. The price is fixed by the land registry and bankruptcy registry.

There is a legal requirement to do this for any secured charge.

 

The surveyors fee is also no doubt inluded in this (about £180.00 at the very top end of the scale). Ask them for a copy of the surveyors invoice since these are not in house surveyors. Mortgage companies are not allowed to use in house surveyors.

 

So where has the rest of the fee charged come from.

 

Underwriting costs are the ordinary costs they would incur in underwriting the loan (they are business costs and as such should be normally calculated into the interest. This strikes me as effectively amounting to some type of brokers fee. I think you will find that there is no 'underwriting' costs quoted in your agreement as payable as there isnt on mine - legal and surveyors fees however are quoted as payable.

 

I expect you also used your own solicitor to complete the loan documentation - it is not normal practice for the mortgagor solicitors to do so . I certainly used my own and paid him seperately so there should be no legal costs incurred there.

 

I would check your documentation to see if the actual cost of £585.00 is specifically stated in the agreement - it is not in mine. if not then this could also be a sticky point for them - after all no term that doesnt specifically state the cost can hardly be fair otherwise they could simply charge whatever they like - couldnt they. I seem to remember reading somewhere that where any future costs are not specifically stated then they are potentially unenforceable or voidable since they have technically not been agreed at the start of the contract.

 

I'm sure someone else on the site can advise better on this.

[Missy06]

Greedfighter,

 

thanks for the posting.

 

The 585.00 is actually stated in part 7 of my agreement; part 6 was seperate and was for the broker fee of 500.00. This means that I agreed at the start of the contract that I'd pay this......doesn't it?

 

As had been suggested on this thread, I called the Consumer Direct (formally the Trading Standard Agency) and they said they can't go over any calculations for consumers, that I should the FOS should be the ones to do it. So I called the FOS, who said they wouldn't so it either! The adviser was very helpful though. He told me that since I settled the loan more than 3 years ago, it was outside their remit. Apparently, as of April 2007, the law changed and they'd now look into any complaints which involves disputes of settlements within the last 3 years with BF:).

 

I'm just finishing off my Prelim and will add that I'd like them to give me a breakdown of the 585.00 legal charge.

 

I'll keep you updated:).

[midge61]

Hi Missy

 

Rad the following taken from the TS website, it should help

Trading Standards Central - Trading Standards and Consumer Protection information for the UK

 

Apparently BF have a habit of adding the broker fees to the loan so that you are paying interest on them and this is not correct.

[midge61]

Thats interesting news about settlements within the last 3 years now being looked at.

 

I will have to look into this as one I have had back was settled in 2004 and the actual agreement is missing some prescribed terms. Also the settlement figure on the statement does not show how it was calculated or what was added.

[greedfighter]

Hi Missy,

 

You obviously got the same routine from FOS and TS as me - not much use really. I am a bit confused though - did you pay £585 fees and a seperate £500 brokers fee ? if so -

 

(a) is your agreement between you and Blemain Finance or is it between you and somebody else ?. This is relevant since if the agreement is between you and Blemain Finance then clearly no 'broker' has been used so why is there a 'brokers' fee ? Obviously if your loan is between you and BF but you used a third party to arrange/negotiate your loan with BF or if BF negotiated a loan between you and some other mortgage provider then a brokers fee can be applied.

 

Clearly if the agreement is between you and BF and you did not use a third party to negotiate the loan for you, and you have paid both £500 and £585.00 then why have you been charged twice - I thought their letter said the £585.00 included their underwriting costs - so where has the extra £500.00 brokers fee come from ?

[midge61]

Hi

Don't know if this helps.

When I took out my present loan I phoned BF directly but they have charged me £950 broker fee because they apparently put it through a broker that is part of them (can't think of the name offhand).It's phone a loan or something.

[Missy06]

Thanks for that.

 

I used a broker so I understand why they've charged the 500.00 for broker fees; I didn't pay the broker directly from my own pocket.

[Missy06]

Hi Missy

 

Rad the following taken from the TS website, it should help

Trading Standards Central - Trading Standards and Consumer Protection information for the UK

 

Apparently BF have a habit of adding the broker fees to the loan so that you are paying interest on them and this is not correct.

 

I called Consumer Direct and was told that although some local TS's calculate the figures for you, not all all of them do so. My local TS doesn't do the calcs so I asked if I could use a TS who could help calulate my figures and was told that it doesn't work that way! Apparently, you can only use your local TS.....fullstop!

[Missy06]

ps: if it's any help, you can reach Consumer Direct on 0845 040 506 or 020 8799 9200:)

[Missy06]

pps: I was told that since my local TS doesn't do calcs of figures, I have to get help from the local Citizen Advice Bureau....I'm not going to bother!

 

I sent my Prelim to BF yesterday. I also added which formular I used and from which website I got it.

 

I'm claiming the:

 

1) Overpayment of 1,752

 

2) Collection charge of 352.50 and

 

3) Contractual interest of 1,370

 

Let's see how it goes!

[greedfighter]

Best of luck Missy and Merry Xmas to everyone on the thread.

[midge61]

Hi all

 

Good luck Missy.

[Missy06]

HAPPY NEW YEAR TO YOU ALL!

 

Received a letter from a company called Monarch Recoveries. While I was still wondering who they were, I realised that their address was the same as BFs! They've given me the breakdown of the collection costs as follows:

 

Monarch Admin Fee - 176.25

Calls & Letters 19 @ 15.00 + VAT - 334.88

 

TOTAL = 511.13

 

They then say at the end of the letter that "we have reduced the charges to 352.50..."

 

ANY THOUGHTS?

[midge61]

hi missy

Monarch are BF's in house debt collectors.

 

I would say go for it and try to reclaim the lot as that should all come under penalty charges.

 

i must have loads of these but they don't show on my statement so they obviously add it all when you redeem.

 

They still haven't sent me all my info so must do a letter tonight.

 

Was this letter in response to your prelim?

[Missy06]

Hi Midge,

 

HAPPY NEW YEAR!

 

The letter was a 'part response' to my prelim. My prelim requested that:

 

1) They recalculate the figures

2) Give me a break down of the Collection Fees (which they've done)

3) Refund the amount I'd calculated as overpayment.

 

So basically 1) and 2) are still outstanding.

 

ps: my Wasted Cost Order will be a bit juicy since I'll be charging them 15.00 per letter (reciprocity:-)) I've sent out and will make sure I call them at least 2ce a week (starting tomorrow) for an update of my claim!:grin:

 

......I've been charging 2.00 per letter and haven't even charged for phone calls in my WCOs.....

[greedfighter]

Hi everybody,

 

My internet has been down for the last two weeks, fixed today though.

 

I agree with midge, if they have reduced the charges to me this means that they must have thought they were sticky to start with. I agree you should pursue further breakdown and ask them to justify- ask for the lot - £15 quid a phone call seems a bit excessive for two or three minutes work perhaps and unless any specific debt collection costs are stated in the agreement I think they are unrecoverable ( I seem to remember reading somewhere that such costs are normal business overheads that should generally be calculated into their overall lending criteria) especially if they are in house. I will try to find the relevant ruling over the next few days

[greedfighter]

Hi,

 

I am still looking but look at the OFT Debt Collection Guidance - Final Guidance on unfair business practices Jul 2003 (Updated Dec 2006) which is the current edition. All in all its good reading anyways and simple and straight forward (i.e not heavy) But Chapter 2 section 7 (Charging for Debt Collection) might help somehow while youre arguing it out. I will keep looking for the other bit.

 

Even if it doesnt immediately help the information is good info in relation to Debt Collection Company activities and they hate it when you start referring them to it - they get sort of all lost.

 

I cant do a link - Im a bit thick in that respect when it comes to computer stuff.

[midge61]

Hi Missy

 

Any update on this?

 

I have had to write to them again to remind them that they have not sent all the info. Still witing for their reply!

[Missy06]

Hi Missy

 

Any update on this?

 

I have had to write to them again to remind them that they have not sent all the info. Still witing for their reply!

 

I don't have an update yet. I was hoping to have put the claim in to court but I've been a bit busy last couple of weeks and I've also been following up other claims I have going.....

 

In the meantime, I must call them tomorrow to get an update and start recording all those 15.00 per phone call that are going into my wasted costs.