Tenancy Deposit Protection Confusion

[ammark]

Hello,

I am a tenanct living in my flat for more than a year now and had to sign a new one year contract with the "Estate Agent" looking after my property. The tenancy type is Assure ShortHold Tenancy and the amount of deposit with them is £1350 which is equivalent to 1.5 months of rent. According to the new legislation, from 6th of April 2007 all tenancy deposits taken by landlords/agents have to be protected, however, the Estate Agent that is responsible for my property is failing to do that despite repeated emails to them. They have replied back very rudely and have the email record of the correspondance.

It has been more than 2 months now that my deposit is not protected. Now another dilemma is that the company doesn't seem to be reigstered with Companies HOuse. If you search for the company name, its information comes up as:

(WebCHeck - Select and Access Company Information)

-------------------------------------------------------

CHARLESTATE LIMITED

78 RICHMOND ROAD

KINGSTON UPON THAMES

SURREY KT2 5EL

Company No. 04549474

Status: Active - Proposal to Strike off

Date of Incorporation: 01/10/2002

Country of Origin: United Kingdom

Company Type: Private Limited Company

Nature of Business (SIC(03)):

7031 - Real estate agencies

-------------------------------------------------------

 

However this office is deserted and I don't think any mail is collected from here either. Their actual address (from where they conduct business is)

-------------------------------------------------------

Charlestate International

Endeavour House, 2, Cambridge Rd, Kingston Upon Thames, Surrey KT1 3JU

Tel: 020 8549 7774

-------------------------------------------------------

But this address is not registered nor is this name:"Charlestate International".

 

* What are my options with them?

 

* What are my legal options?

 

* If I go to the county court, I need to file the claim against whom and what is the process for Tenancy Deposit Protection claims in a county court. Please explain in detail.?

 

* I checked with Housing Advice Helpline, and they told me that my landlord is responsible for the deposit (and not the estate agent) though they were not sure, however, all my dealings are with the Estate Agent and the contract clearly says that my Estate Agent (Charlestate) holds the deposit. I came to know about the owner of the property (or landlord) just because his owns a business next to my residence, otherwise all my dealings are with the Estate Agent. So this whole affair becomes more confusing.

 

Any help would be greatly appreciated. Please ask me questions for any further clarifications.

 

Best Regards.

[Guest Alison82]

If you signed the agreement before 6th April 07 the th TDS does not cover you here.

 

Do you have the name of your landlord not the agency, if so you can find his/her address through the land registry

[demon_x_slash]

The OP said that the tenancy was renewed after April 6th, so they should be covered by the TDS - it applies to renewals as well as new tenancies. The landlord is ultimately responsible for the deposit being entered - the estate agents are just middlemen. You should write to the LL informing them that you're aware that the deposit hasn't been protected, that it is a legal obligation for them to do so, and you expect to recieve paperwork showing that it has been entered within (say) three weeks.

As you are a current tenant, under the Housing Act, legally the agents must provide you with an address for your landlord upon request.

[MrShed]

Was that question ever answered definitively demon? And if so, where does it state it? Not doubting you, just want the link for future reference!!

[demon_x_slash]

It applied to my renewal - wait, let me dig out our paperwork...

 

 

Our letter says:

 

"Dear d_x_s,

 

"Further to your instructions we enclose contracts to renew your current tenancy...Please note that there are three places to sign because of the new tenancy deposit regulations...Please find enclosed your certificate showing that your deposit is held in accordance with new rules that came into force on 6 April 07...(please pay our exorbitant fee for photocopying your old agreement and getting you to sign it...)

 

"Letting Agent."

 

That's where I must have got the idea from - let me look it up from somewhere official though

[demon_x_slash]

Ah, something here:

 

What happens if the tenant has a tenancy agreement that was taken out before 6 April 2007 but he continues occupying the property after the end of that tenancy?

 

If the tenant decides to remain in his existing rented property beyond the initial fixed term of six months, how the deposit is treated will depend on how the tenancy is continued:

• For a statutory periodic tenancy - i.e. the tenancy continues with no new agreement - TDP will not apply, as no new AST will have been created.
  
• For a replacement/renewal tenancy - This is a new AST and so TDP will apply. The deposit previously paid under the earlier tenancy is repayable to the tenant at the end of that tenancy, so it should be returned to the tenant. Alternatively, if the landlord wishes to continue to hold it as security in respect of the new tenancy it must be protected under scheme.

From the Governmental website, and

 

Suzannah Hellicar, Rushmoor Borough Council's Housing Options Team Manager said; "This is great news and will directly benefit thousands of tenants who face problems getting their deposit returned. So from now, if you are renewing your tenancy or starting a new one, ask your landlord or agent which Tenancy Deposit Protection scheme they are part of. However your deposit will only be protected if your landlord has signed up to Tenancy Deposit Protection, which they are required to do."

 

from Rushmoor Borough Council's website, and from Shelter's website:

 

What if I paid a deposit before 6 April 2007?

 

If you paid a tenancy deposit before 6 April 2007, then you will not be protected by the scheme unless your landlord or agent renews your tenancy on or after 6 April 2007, and gives you a new agreement.

[MrShed]

Thatll do for me, thanks demon!!

[Joa]

Does nobody read "stickies" anymore?

A deposit paid before that date is only protected by the Act if the tenancy is formally renewed on or after that date, by the signing of a new tenancy agreement, not if the tenancy merely continues by default.

This information has been prepared on basis of advice provided by Shelter ans I have made sure that none of it comes from the top of someone's head and all is properly checked out.

 

BTW- That was not a rant but I feel one coming anyway, entitled "stickies- READ THEM BEFORE YOU POST, public dearesssssssst"

[ammark]

If you signed the agreement before 6th April 07 the th TDS does not cover you here.

 

Do you have the name of your landlord not the agency, if so you can find his/her address through the land registry

 

 

My contract was signed in August 2007 and therefore should come under the TDS rule. The agency who is holding the deposit as well as looks over the day to day dealings is holding the deposit and is clearly mentioned on the contract. The agency says that landlord need not be bothered about anything and I should come to them for every matter, as the landlord pays them for that purpose. Therefore who is responsible here?

 

Secondly, if I have to issue a notice, whom to issue such notice that I am going to the court if they don't comply?

[demon_x_slash]

If you are going to issue court proceedings, do so against the landlord as I said above. The contract that you entered into is between you and the landlord, not between you and the agents - you've got to think of the landlord as the MD and the agents as his paperwork-monkeys. S/he is ultimately responsible for your deposit, and it is to hir that you should direct complaints now, as the agents seem to be determined to be obstructive.

What do you mean precisely by 'rude'? This is also a problem that you need to take up with the landlord, as the agents are acting as hir representatives.

[demon_x_slash]

Sorry Joa, sweetie - I've only browsed, nay, grazed the stickies, and of course you're to be congratulated for your excellent work

 

Most of my info - hells, most of my life - comes off the top of my head. I'm thinking of having a kettle whistle installed

[Joa]

I just imagined you with a steam whistle....I must say I smiled to myself, thank you, cause it is a grim day today and NatWest whacked a charge for being £3 short of a DD which should not have gone out today anyway. So your whistle has helped me

 

As for the stickies- as you know Ed re-wrote most of them because I felt my languge skills were crap and they needed to be done pronto. But the info contained should be perfectly OK; checked and double checked. If anybody spots anything wrong, please let me or a Mod know asap as giving out incorrect advice is like a worse crime in advisers' handbook!

[demon_x_slash]

More than glad to be of service, my dear - and murder Sh*twest with the DD Guarantee! If it went out on the wrong date, they've got no business charging you even by their standards

[Joa]

Apologies to the OP for this highjack- but will DD guarantee provide for wrong date too or only for wrong amount?

[Ed999]

Ammmark, read this thread: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/tenants/117280-tenancy-deposit-scheme.html

 

If your deposit is not protected, then now is the time for you to sue the landlord for the deposit plus the statutory penalty, as explained in that thread.

 

The person to sue is the landlord, not the letting agent, as explained in that thread.

 

 

 

Advice & opinions on this forum are offered informally, without any assumption of liability. Use your own judgment. Seek advice of a qualified and insured professional if you have any doubts.

[demon_x_slash]

Joa - they must notify you ten days beforehand if they're going to change the payment date, otherwise they're in breach of the DD Guarantee and you can ask for it back. If the payment hadn't gone out on the wrong day, you wouldn't have been charged, and the bank should remove it without the hassle of threatening court

 

Apologies for hijack ammark - let us know how you get on.

[ammark]

If you are going to issue court proceedings, do so against the landlord as I said above. The contract that you entered into is between you and the landlord, not between you and the agents - you've got to think of the landlord as the MD and the agents as his paperwork-monkeys. S/he is ultimately responsible for your deposit, and it is to hir that you should direct complaints now, as the agents seem to be determined to be obstructive.

What do you mean precisely by 'rude'? This is also a problem that you need to take up with the landlord, as the agents are acting as hir representatives.

 

Hello, I just want to be very certain about this aspect therefore I would like to write the main page of the contract :

 

Date: 28.07.07

 

Lanlord: [landlord's name] (note: doesn't contain his address)

 

Landlord' Agent:

Charlestate Estate Agents

2 Cambridge Road

Kingston Upon Thames

KT1 3JU

 

Tenant: [my name]

 

Property: [property details]

 

Deposity: A deposit of £1350 is held by Charlestate

 

...........................................................

...........................................................

 

So, here you see that the address of the "landlord's agent" is included and also it is written that the agent would keep the deposit. However, the contract is signed between me and the landlord.

 

Therefore, as you stated, is the landlord responsible for the deposit? And if I need to send the landlord a registered mail, I don't have his address. How can I find that? (although I have his business address, but I don't have his acutal or home address).

 

Thirdly, what is the "roadmap" of entering a county court case for "tenancy deposits"?

[demon_x_slash]

You are entitled under the Housing Act to have an address for your landlord, and yes, you do need to serve against the landlord for the deposit. It would be best to serve at the landlord's address, and make every effort to do so, but if you really can't find hir address, you can serve papers on hir using the agents' address as the only one provided to you on your contract.

[ammark]

You are entitled under the Housing Act to have an address for your landlord, and yes, you do need to serve against the landlord for the deposit. It would be best to serve at the landlord's address, and make every effort to do so, but if you really can't find hir address, you can serve papers on hir using the agents' address as the only one provided to you on your contract.

 

Thanks a lot. I would have few more so please bear with me:

 

1- Under Housing Act, who is responsible for letting me the know the address of the landlord. Is there a website which shows the addresses to the landlords of properties?

 

2- If I take the matter to the court, what is the procedure for this claim. I have told the agency and my landlord about protecting my deposit, but haven't sent them a formal notification by registered mail? Do I need to send them a formal notificiation by registered mail threatning court action or can I go directly to the court and file a case?

 

3- Could you please elaborate or show a roadmap for cases involving Tenancy desposit protection.

 

Thanks

Ammar

[Ed999]

May I urge you to re-read this thread: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/landlords-tenants/117572-unfair-deposit-deductions.html

 

It explains many of the things that appear to be troubling you, including how to find an address for the landlord.

 

 

Advice & opinions on this forum are offered informally, without any assumption of liability. Use your own judgment. Seek advice of a qualified and insured professional if you have any doubts.

[Guest Alison82]

Ed999

 

This is very unhelpful. The majority of your posts yesterday afternoon said exactly the same thing (please do not just copy and paste your answers).

 

People KNOW where the stickies are and I'm sure they have read them prior to starting their thread!! I understand that you have spent a lot of time and effort putting those stickies together (it hasn't gone unnoticed) and us members are appreciative of them. But if you don't have anything constructive to post to a specific question then why bother posting anything?!

 

You are just bringing old threads to the surface when they have already been answered and pushing the new threads back!!!

[Grid66]

Just wanted to add that reading through the housing act again, it states it is the person/s who receives and holds the deposit that is responsible for registering it with an approved TDS.

Surely this is the person/s against whom the claim must be made? So if teh deposit is taken by the agent, it should be claimed from the agent.

 

Also to the original poster, I used the N1 form but subsequently it appears that it may be the other one ...N308?

Nevertheless, see my thread http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/tenants/120764-obtaining-court-order-tenancy.html. I will try and update it for the benefit of all.

[demon_x_slash]

The agent holds the deposit on behalf of the landlord; the tenant contracts with the landlord; it is the landlord's ultimate responsibility.

[Planner]

The agent holds the deposit on behalf of the landlord; the tenant contracts with the landlord; it is the landlord's ultimate responsibility.

 

But we arent talking about deposit return, we are talking non-compliance with TDS. I would agree with Grids interpretaion, that it could be the Landlord or the Agent, dependant on what it says in the contract, who holds the deposit etc.