Help needed urgently about RBS/Newman DCA

[lisagav69]

Firstly please excuse the long post but am in need of some help pretty sharpish.

I have a debt with RBS that I was paying quite happily on the 15th of each month through Moorcroft. I phoned on 15th of Sept to pay only to be told that the account had been passed back to RBS. I phoned RBS who said they don't have the account either and I must wait approx 14 days to hear from another firm as they have changed the DCA I was with. She couldn't explain why it had happened either (the account had be closed with Moorcroft 3 days before payment was due). She said I can't make a payment to anyone as the account is in cyberspace somewhere so made her make a note that I had tried to pay. I waited & waited and on Saturday (Dec 1st) I had a letter from a company called Newman Debt Collection Agents who I've never heard of before threatening court proceedings if I don't pay the full amount (£3182). I phoned them first thing yesterday morning and the call was pretty confusing & here is where I need some help.

They told me they have been instructed by RBS to recover the full amount whithin 3 months or they will take me to court to get it. He told me to ask a family member to put it on a credit card for me or release equity in my home (both of these I know they cannot do) to get the amount. Then he said I could make a £50 payment yesterday which would put the account on hold but would need paying the full amount by Chrsitmas...yet the last sentance he said I had 3 months. I asked about a payment plan and he said the only option he can give me is to pay the full amount in 3 installments over the next 3 months. I offered to send a Financial Statment which was declined and the guy said I have til the end of Wednesday to come up with how I am going to get the £3k!

 

The main thing I'd like to know is can they (RBS or the DCA) demand the payment in full in such a short amount of time. RBS isn't the only debt I have & everyone else is helpful & understanding which I've found surprising!

If they can or cannot make this demand what should I do?

 

from a very puzzled & worried woman!

[42man]

Courtesy of Curlyben

 

First NEVER talk to these "people" on the phone as they will try and get you to agree to anything.

 

Before you even think about making any sort of acknowledgement or payment to a DCA you MUST ensure that they have the LEGAL right to collect the debt.

This is achieved by requesting a copy of the Signed, Executed Credit Agreement via a Consumer Credit Act (CCA) request.

There is a template letter to be found here: Creditors and DCAs - Letter Templates & Budget Planner

Letter N.

Is it important to start the letter:

I DO NOT ACKNOWLEDGE ANY DEBT TO YOUR COMPANY in Big Bold letters.

 

It is best to send this request via recorded/special delivery as there are some important deadlines to observe.

 

After 12 WORKING days the "debt" is in default and stays that way until the request is complied with.

If a FURTHER month passes then the DCA has committed a summary criminal offence and the matter should be referred to Trading Standards for action once the DCA continues to demand payment. Also DO NOT HAND SIGN THE LETTER

[42man]

Lisagav, please send off for the CCA, I find it incredible that this company have refused to accept what you can afford !!! - Is this for a loan or a credit card or an overdraft ?? can you let us know a little more ??

[monday blues]

Hi

 

Welcome to CAG, you will get all the help you need here.

 

Firstly never speak to them on the phone, Everything must be conducted in writing.

 

The best thing to do is send them a CCA, to make sure that they have the right to collect

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt/20758-creditors-dcas-letter-templates.html

 

Template N for a CCA request. Do not sign the CCA and enclose a £1.00 postal order.

[42man]

Also write at the bottom of the letter - PLEASE NOTE THAT ANY PHONE CALLS MADE TO ME WILL BE CLASSED AS HARRASSMENT AND TREATED AS SUCH - ALL CORRESPONDENCE IS TO BE MADE IN WRITING

[42man]

Bear in mind that this puts the account into dispute, RBS look like they are going to get heavy due to their losses with the 'credit crunch' !!! they may now take a harder line....you need to send the CCA request with a postal order for £1 (do not send a cheque as it has your signature on it - and it has been alleged that debt collection agencies cut and paste these !!)

[lisagav69]

Thanx for the quick responses!

the only thing that worries me with sending off for the CCA is that this guy has given me til tomorrow to get in touch or they will instruct RBS to start court action and requesting something by post won't be done by tomorrow?

 

The debt is for a credit card which had a limit of £3200 & the balance is currently £3182.60. They guy from Newman did say that they were willing to knock off 15% if I paid in full which of course if I did have £3k to spare I wouldn't be in this mess!

[42man]

Go to the post office now with the letter and send it by guaranteed post !!! While the debt is in dispute they CAN'T enforce it....especially as it has some excessive charges on it too ??

[42man]

Bear in mind they are a Debt Collection Agency and have NO legal powers, if they were going to pursue they will pass it on to a solicitors !!! your request is a bona-fide request....!!! They are telling you to ring them to tell you that christmas is cancelled, and to pressurise you to pay !!!

[lisagav69]

ok I'm all printed off and ready to go but just want to double check something!

 

If I send this request off and Newman send back everything that they are meant to in time, I'm guessing the debt goes back to RBS who can either send it to another DCA, solicitors or just demand the full balance themselves and get then get very stroppy indeed?

 

And what happens if they don't comply & don't send the original CCA?

 

I'm worried sending this off will just make matters worse for myself as I really don't have £3k.

 

Sorry to be a painbut I'm a complete novice at all this! Have 5 credit cards which 4 are being delt with reasonably through other DCA's.

[42man]

If they DO send back what they claim is your CCA, don't forget it has to have the CORRECT prescribed terms in it and has to be properly executed !! (when they do send what they claim is your agreement cross out all the personal details and scan it onto here for the experts to see if it is a properly executed agreement ...and yes they may pass it back to RBS...but let's take it a step at a time...IF they DON'T send back your CCA, then you MUST complain to the the OFT, Trading Standards etc...they can get stroppy, but you now know your rights !!!....

[Vampyra]

Sending this off will not make matters worse. You are taking control. As previously said NEVER speak to them over the phone. CCA the DCA and also SAR the RBS at the same time.

 

When you have done this, it is a waiting game - waiting for them to make mistakes!

 

If they do not come up with a properly executed CA they cannot claim the debt. It's not exactly wiped, but no-one can collect a debt they cannot prove is yours.If the RBS do not give you the complete sent of records under the SAR they are in breach too.

 

For a CA send off the letter and a one pound postal order with the reason you want the postal order used written on the back if it - keep the number it can be traced. Do not sign the letter just write your name. Some DCA's have been known to paste peoples signatures from letters onto things illegally.

 

Get the CCA letter sent off and come back and update the thread when you get some or any feedback. Ask any questions you need - most of us have been through this many times before.

[lisagav69]

CCA request ready to go and will get the SAR request drawn up later.

 

Will keep you informed of how this goes and I really do appriciate everyones help!

[lisagav69]

Another question: I sent the letter yesterday from both myself and my husband as he was a card holder too. Was that the right way to do it? Also, I take it they have to send a copy of the CCA with both our signatures on as we both had to sign when applying for the card?

[42man]

Yes that is correct Lisa....wait and see what turns up, if anything.....remember they have 12+2 working days to provide if they don't then they have defaulted if after another 30 calendar days they still haven't then they have committed an offence....if it comes through, scan it, cross off the personal details and we'll let the experts on here look at it....keep us informed...

[42man]

Keep ALL the documentation, post office receipts, copy of letter etc....

[Docman]

You may find that Newman & Co won't respond with a CCA. Instead, they are likely to return the papers to RBS, who will probably appoint another DCA. They use their own 'in-house' firm called Triton or another favourite is Allied International Credit (AIC), who are another bunch of reptiles (apologies to various species of snake).

Once you have sent the CCA request, sit back and wait until Newman’s respond. Ignore their telephone abuse. Christmas is still on the menu!

[Alphageek]

Hi, welcome to the CAG!

 

I had dealings with Newmans' Leeds office when I first joined this site.

 

I must say they went away pretty sharpish when I started to challenge what they were saying and then complained to the Information Commissioners Office about them.

 

The funny thing is, that the Information Commissioners Office kind of said Newmans were entitled to process my data (when do they ever say anything else?) but they gave up easily.

 

Don't let them bully you and you'll probably find RBS (and your other creditors) have been taking you for a ride for years and they'll end up owing you money.

 

Good luck.

[lisagav69]

firstl thank you everyone for your help so far! I'm getting quite excited about this actually as I've never done something like this before!

 

Right, the CCA request was sent special delivery on Monday so was g'teed before 1pm yesterday. Still no confirmation this morning so phoned Royal Mail just now how apologized & said they would refund the postage as it is out for delivery today. I said it was very important that it arrived yesterday as it was a deadline and she said all she can do is apologize.

 

what will Newman do now as they gave me til yesterday to make contact? I'm guessing they are just going to hand it back to RBS this morning and will just have to start the process all over again with another DCA?

[42man]

Hi Lisa....they now have 12+2 working days to provide the agreement if they don't provide this in that time scale they are in default of your request, if after another 30 calendar days they STILL haven't provided it they have committed an offence under the Consumer Credit Act....Just let us know how (and if) they respond....

[2Grumpy]

Don't worry about their deadlines - remember they said that you had 3 months. Actually, RBS probably gave them 3 months to collect the money.

 

NatWest (owned by RBS) are trying the same with my son, using AIC. Your lot sound differently bad.

 

They will provide their own version of what will happen over the phone and give deadlines to try to scare you. If they kepp on calling, don't answer their security questions and send off the telephone harassment letter (recorded delivery, letter not signed by you). Don't phone them either.

 

You mentioned that it was a joint account - it won't make any difference, but are you sure that it isn't in either your name or your OH's name, with an additional cardholder. That would make it just one of your's debts, and if that isn't you, it would make them all very naughty chasing you for money!

 

Grumpy

[lisagav69]

Recieved a letter from Newman in the post today dated the 6th which would of been the day they recieved my CCA request! It's pretty short so I'll just type it up instead of scanning it but I guess from reading it I just have to sit back and wait for the CCA from RBS? Do I still give them the 12+2 from the date Newman recieved the letter? Bit confused about dates now!

 

 

 

 

Dear Sir/Madam,

 

We write in response to your letter dated December 4th 2007, the contents of which have been duly noted.

 

We have requested our client sends you a copy of your signed credit agreement, which should be with you in the near future.

 

Please contact our office on xxxx xxx xxxx to discuss reypayment of the oustanding balance.

[lisagav69]

In response to Grumpy:

 

I am the main account holder and hubby was just an additional card holder but I'm 99% certain in remembering he had to sign an agreement too

[lisagav69]

Thinking about it, that means Newman have no legal right to demand money from me as they don't hold the CCA?

[42man]

Absolutely right Lisa, and yes they have 12+2 days from receipt of your letter - if they don't comply they are in default of your request, and if after another 30 calendar days they STILL haven't provided it they have committed an offence under the Consumer Credit Act...!!!