RED SD old Cap1 debt **SET ASIDE**

[Boro]

I have this morning had a statutory demand come through from red debt collectors who bought an old (disputed) debt from capital one, the amount is a little under £1100 and has not been paid at all in 5 years as i dispute it and it cannot be far off the 6 year statute barred stage (i have not acknowledged it in this time), (i have recently had my experian credit report and its no longer on there), im not a home owner (living with parents) but do have a small work unit rented in my name where i own some tools and equipment however not everything is mine (larger bits where bought by someone else) and have virtually nothing of value not even owning my own car, am i right in thinking that this is a commonly used to scare people into paying up and that the first thing i should do is get a csa request in to them? what do i have to do to have this demand set aside?

[Curlyben]

First NEVER talk to these "people" on the phone as they will try and get you to agree to anything.

 

Before you even think about making any sort of acknowledgement or payment to a DCA you MUST ensure that they have the LEGAL right to collect the debt.

This is achieved by requesting a copy of the Signed, Executed Credit Agreement via a Consumer Credit Act (CCA) request.

There is a template letter to be found here: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt/20758-creditors-dcas-letter-templates.html

Letter N.

Is it important to start the letter:

I DO NOT ACKNOWLEDGE ANY DEBT TO YOUR COMPANY in Big Bold letters.

 

It is best to send this request via recorded/special delivery as there are some important deadlines to observe.

 

After 12 WORKING days the "debt" is in default and stays that way until the request is complied with.

If a FURTHER month passes then the DCA has committed a summary criminal offence and the matter should be referred to Trading Standards for action once the DCA continues to demand payment.

 

I hope this clarifies some things.

 

 

Also have a read through this: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collectors-debt-collection/112326-debt-collection-agencies-statutory.html

[Boro]

Good thing i keep all letters received, not sure how relevant all this is but here goes lowell portfolio bought the account from capital one in december last year, and i have correspondence from both sides to say as such, over the course of the year letters have come through from lowell portfolio, lowell financial, hamptons legal and then red, all of which i understand are the same company correct?, in march 2007 i had a letter headed "notice of intention to issue a county court claim" yet nothing came of that, they made comment earlier in the year of sending round door step collectors but again nothing came of that, november 2007 they made an offer where if i pay 50% by such and such date the rest would be written off (actually deadline for that is not yet up) at least i assume thats what it is its about as clear as mud, it reads "I am in a position today to offer you an early settlement figure with a discount of £xxx, leaving a new outstanding balance of £xxx." (does say the amounts on the letter but i feel it best not to make this post too obvious incase they do fish here), seeing as this deadline has yet to pass i find it hard to take their statutory demand seriously, it doesnt even say the court on it just "your local county court, or combined court" then goes on to say for confirmation of court or if i believe i have grounds for it to be set aside to call 0113 30860xx, Thanks curlyben i will prepare a cca request today and post it up prior to sending, how long do they have to supply me with the agreement before it becomes unenforceable? is it also worth doing a SARS to try and find out when the account was last paid? ie whether its within or outside the 6 years

[ODC]

Clownells aka Red aka Hamptons iLegal seem to be following in steps of CONnaught in issuing these SDs like confetti in the hope that they will scare people into telephoning them so as they can st the greedy ill bred ill educated call centre muppets on them.

 

NEVER SPEAK TO THEM ON THE PHONE

 

Keep everything in writing and then you have a paper trail to beat them with, As for you CAP One account. This is probably one of a bunch the Clownells bought that are practically statute barred and certainly unenforcable due to being an an application form without the prescribed terms

[ODC]

BORO They have 12 working days to produce a VALID CCA. Your request for a CCA also includes a request for a full statement which they must supply. Please check the dates of the last payment on the Statement as it probably was not made by you.

[Boro]

Dont worry i dont plan to call them or speak to them on the phone, tbh if they did follow through and made me bankrupt it wouldnt be the end of the world as it would relieve me of my debts and i have nothing of value realy, it would leave them out of pocket certainly

[Boro]

Yes i have heard about that trick of them making payments trying to keep the debt open so to speak, i will see if i can find statements for cap one but i may have got rid of them seeing as they are so old, i am absolutely positive thought that i havent made payment in 5 years

[ODC]

At the end of the day its up to them to prove YOU actually made the payment not up to you to prove you didnt. In my case I can prove irrefutably that I did not make the payment. So yet another Clownells Pork Pie shot down. How much roughly is your SD for.

[Boro]

A little under £1100

[ODC]

FFS The level for Bankruptcy is £ 750. It sounds like yet another Clownells bluff. If they made you Bankrupt for such a piddling amount they are liable to get buttons as all your other creditors would have to be paid as well and as you say you have nothing then Clownells share of nothing would be nothing. What utter twats

[Boro]

What should i do about the sd whilst waiting to hear back on my cca request? as i understand i have only 18 days to have the sd set aside last thing i need is all this extra stress on top of everything else!

 

Quick edit, im fairly certain that a large proportion of this amount is made up of illegal charges, therefore surely with that bringing the amount under the bankruptcy threshold they cannot go ahead with it? yet i wont know exactly what charges have been set in place until hearing back on the cca request! :S

[Boro]

Ok how is this for the cca request:

 

(My address)

November 30, 2007

 

Lowell Portfolio I LTD,

Enterprise House,

1 Apex View,

Leeds,

LS11 9BH

 

Dear Sir/Madam I DO NOT ACKNOWLEDGE ANY DEBT TO YOUR COMPANY

 

Re:− Reference Number xxxxxxxx (left blank for the purpose of the forum)

 

With reference to the above agreement, we would be grateful if you would send us a copy of this credit agreement.

 

We understand that under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (Sections 77−79), we are entitled to receive a copy of our credit agreement on request. We enclose a payment of £1.00 which represents the fee payable under the Consumer Credit Act.

 

We understand a copy of our credit agreement should be supplied within 12 working days.

 

We understand that under the Consumer Credit Act creditors are unable to enforce an agreement if they fail to comply with a request for a copy of the agreement under these sections of the Act.

 

We look forward to hearing from you.

 

Yours faithfully

 

(signature)

 

(my name)

 

 

Is the bit about not acknowledging the debt in the correct place? is there anything else i need add to that, please feel free to edit it as you see fit as im hopeless with these sort of letters

 

[tooth_fairy]

Yes it is but I always put 'I DO NOT ACKNOWLEDGE ANY DEBT TO YOU OR YOUR CLIENTS' as I was advised by a CAG member when I first found the group, but by all means, keep it as it is as it is not an essential addition to your letter.

 

Remember to send recorded delivery too!

[Boro]

Yes will go recorded delivery and i have just remembered not to sign it , remembering how simple it would then be for them to copy my signature

[Boro]

Thinking about it would i be better keeping with "I DO NOT ACKNOWLEDGE ANY DEBT TO YOUR COMPANY" rather than using "I DO NOT ACKNOWLEDGE ANY DEBT TO YOU OR YOUR CLIENTS" seeing as they have bought the disputed debt from cap one and as such own it or would having clients in there be fine either way

[tooth_fairy]

Yes, I was advised because my letter from Lowells had 'Our clients.....' but seeing as your stat demand probably doesn't have this, you're probably better off cticking with 'Your Company' unless it expressly says they are acting on behalf of clients....

 

Best of luck xx

[ODC]

I Do Not Acknowledge Any Debt To You Or Any Company You Claim To Represent

[Boro]

Thanks odc will stick that in place of what i had, few other thoughts though, seeing as this is virtualy already statute barred would my argument of illegal fees hiking up the debt (above the threshold) be a poor one seeing as a number of these fees would be statute barred ie i can no longer claim those fees back, to quote something you said earlier odc "unenforcable due to being an an application form without the prescribed terms" would you mind elaborating here? shall i take it from that that whatever they say its unenforceable and therefore they cannot make me bankrupt anyway?

[Boro]

Further to my last post do i need to add to the letter that i also request a breakdown of this alleged debt or will i automatically get that? i assume the cheque should be made payable to Lowell Portfolio I LTD dont worry i will get my father to make out a cheque so they will not have my signature, or could they use his signature in just the same way?

[ODC]

Have a read of this very useful thread http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collectors-debt-collection/105315-my-agreement-enforceable-useful.html

[Boro]

Cheers odc, also been reading up on the sd and how to stop it or ensure i am not made bankrupt and now feeling much happier, cca request will go off tomorrow, i will prepare papers to have the sd set aside but im not sure yet whether im going to file them now or until nearer the deadline, if i do it now i could argue that they have been hasty with the sd as the payment offer they sent me is £200 less than the bankruptcy threshold and still has a week to run, anyone know if i will need to provide the court with any evidence to back up my dispute of the amount when having the sd set aside? just until the csa comes back i have very little, i do however have some statements that show a number of high charges being applied to the account

[ODC]

If they sent you an offer you can rest assured they have F All by way of any Legal CCA. CALL THEIR BLUFF

[Boro]

Right cca sent off to lowell today by special delivery so will be with them tomorrow and can be tracked, picked up forms 6.4 and 6.5 from the court for the set aside, i raised the fact that there is no court name on the sd with the lady on the desk and she did say it should have one and to put that into my statement, now i could do with a bit of help filling this thing out, well a lot of help as i have never had to do one before, my defense will be that i am disputing the amount as i believe (know) a proportion of it is unlawful charges applied by the credit card company but as i havent kept all statements for the account (only got a couple which do show charges) i wont know how much these come to, in the affadavit theres a list of options, assume i go with option 1) do not admit the debt because....? would it be a good idea to send a s.a.r to either cap one or lowell? i presume cap one in this situation as thats who the account was with and very much doubt lowell will have them or do i not need this unless they produce a signed credit agreement which from what i have read about cap 1 im hoping they cannot

[ODC]

Wait until you see what Lovely Lowells come up with. From what I hear all of the Crap One debts they bought are either Statute Barred of unenforcable because they are application forms which do not contain the prescribed terms.

[Boro]

Trouble is if for some reason they are able to produce an agreement that meets the terms (and i doubt they will) and are serious about proceeding with bankruptcy (again doubt they will over £1100) and i dont have the sd set aside it leaves me open to attack and i know that in my rental agreement theres something that says about bankruptcy so if i was to be made bankrupt i would loose my premises